Ethics question

[fishuhalik]

We've been having a problem in our deer area the last couple of years and I was wondering how you guys would handle it. We've been hunting the same patch of public land for about 25 years now, it's literally right behind the house I grew up in. We had it to ourselves for about 20 years and then we got some new neighbors that moved in next door.

Now, before someone says it, I know, permanent stands are not exactly "legal" but the stands we have set up have been there for the better part of the 25 years we've been hunting the area, we just repair them as needed. My question is, if you're hunting about 1,000 acres of public land and know that your neighbor is hunting a specific area, would you sit in on "his" area or find your own spots? These guys have been sitting in the stands that we built, and some of them aren't just a couple of pieces of wood stuck to a tree, they took alot of work dragging lumber a mile off the trail. The way I was raised, if you're scouting an area and find that someone else is already hunting it, you find another spot, plain and simple. What would you do?

[motley man]

That's why they call it public. I have had the same thing happen and there is nothing to do but try to get along with these folks.

[benbosh]

get there earlier then them

[dukhnt]

That's why they call it public.

I agree. You can't "stake a claim" to public land. Just because you have hunted it for 25 years doesn't make it yours. Everyone has the same right to hunt there. Whether you have hunted it for a hundred years or one day.

[Musky Buck]

I'd feel lucky I had it for 20 years and in that time saved about 10,000 grand in property tax. I'm not a public land hunter but I find every approach near where I live has ribbons or vehicles parked on every approach so I'm not sure what I'd do if I had to go public because it's all kinda spoken for. I guess dragging that lumber in I would've had the conversation that at any time someone else could be in one of them. I'd tear them down and go to portables or ladder stands. Tough ? I'm surprised it took as long as it did for people to invade those stands. Best of luck.

[Neighbor_guy]

I guess I have to side with the neighbors on this one. It is not realy an "Ethics question".

Public land is just that, "public". And permanent stands are not yours, they are there, and you built them, but you put them on public land. Now while I wouldn't use one personaly, some others may. If you have had 1000 acres of public land all to your selves for 25 years I can see how you would feel put uppon by new people sharing it with you, but the permanent stand does not equal ownership.

Now if you were to be sitting in "your" permanent stand on opening morning and the new guy walked in with a portable and some climbing sticks and set up 5 yard away and started talking to you, THAT would be an "ethics question"

Sounds to me like you guys need to have a bit of a sit down with a few beers and hash some things out. Between you and 1000 acres of ground there should be room for compromise and everyone being "happy" or at least finding a middle ground some were.

Good Luck

[madbomber10]

Personally (which I would consider to be my code of ethics) I would move on and find my own spot. Legally, your hands are tied.

[buddha]

I too wouldn't use someones stand on public property, but there are plenty of people who do and that is the problem. About all you can do is get out earlier and even if you do they may be ******** about it and screw up your hunting. I guess you got lucky to have the privacy as long as you did.

[Deitz Dittrich]

I too agree, that this is not an ethics issue. The land is not your and they have every right to hunt the land. And just because you did something illegal(building the perm stands) does not claim it as your own.

If I were you, I would try to work it out with the neighbors. maybe set up a sched of when they can use them and when you can use them. If not.. tear them all down, and you will not have this issue.

[Musky Buck]

I think the hard part to a bit is they kinda invaded you and weren't too concerned with having a sit down/beer chat so now it's up to you to be the good guy and you may already know that this might not be the easiest thing to do, my last confrontation with some neighbor guy I didn't know I didn't know his rap sheet was 9 pages long and full of assault/with dangerous weapons etc charges. The deputy filled me in for various reasons. Just be careful and go with your gut.

[Getanet]

Can someone show me where it's illegal to build a permanent stand on all public land? I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just interested. From what I've found in the regulation book it depends on what the land is designated as. The regs book says it's illegal to build a permanent stand on WMA's and State Parks. As for State Forests, portable stands are "encouraged" but I can't find anything where it's illegal.

Fishuhaulic, I feel ya. My family has been hunting public land for many years too. Yes, public land is public land, but it is still frustrating to have people hunt too close, or in your stand. Unfortunately, there's not much you can do about it.

[96trigger]

Personally, while I know that the stand isn't their stand, or have the right to sit there, or whatevee, I wouldn't sit there. If its a neighbors, I would ask if its theirs. It is the courteous thing to do. I would not hunt it if they planned on using it or if they were using it, especially if it is attached to a large chunk of land.

[fishuhalik]

I know it's their right to do it, but it's just the way I was raised. Public or not, you don't go in on someone else's territory, IMHO.

We actually did sit down with them, on several occassions. We have more than gone out of our way to help them get into deer, above and beyond what I think most people would do in the name of getting along with your neighbor and because other than during deer season they are really fun guys. I actually found a great area, honestly just as good if not better than "our" area, about 2 miles away on some different public land, WE built them some really nice stands in some great locations, showed them how to hunt them since they are kinda newbs to deer hunting (wind, scent, time of day, etc.) and they still come and sit in our stands. They just see the deer that we come out with every year and think our stands are magic, they just don't listen when I tell them "don't hunt this stand in this wind", etc. and just think it's the location. One of the guys that hunts with them actually got mad at me for setting them up in the other location because he said there were no deer there, only to find out that he literally "relieved" himself at the bottom of his stand every morning when he got to the stand.

[96trigger]

With people like that, you are better off moving. If they are like you say they are, they will grow tired of it and move. Personally, I would take the stands down. Let them go at it on their own. Say you thought they were rotting and not safe anymore and let them go about deer hunting on their own, and I would move. I wouldn't be a jerk about it, I'd like to still be able to have good neighbor relations, but if they want to play that game, thats how I would roll. Again, I don't think they will be there long.

[Bear55]

Years ago there was kind of an unwritten rule on public land, guys built stands, basically marking their territory and everyone stayed out of everyone's way and it all worked itself out. Times have changed and those old rules don't really apply anymore. Some people don't realize how much work goes into a stand and they might not care because its public land. And to be honest they are right, it is public land but I do understand where you are coming from.

They way I see it you have a few options, get there before them and stay there, these guys might push deer to you. You could try and work out a deal like others have said but who really knows how long that deal would last and you might have others move into the area down the road so then the problem starts up again. If it were me, I would cut down all the stands and go portable, its a little extra work but it will keep you mobile and these other hunters won't be piggy backing off your hard work. If they rebuild the stands go ahead and use them but most people who hunt out of stands they didn't build are not going to put in the work to rebuild them.

[mrklean]

It stinks to say public is public, i would find a new area, but be careful not to get caught building perms on public land by the DNR, they can just tear them down, or they can toss a big fine at you as well.

[Muskie456]

Bear nailed it. Years ago this was the way it was. There is more presure on "our" public land then ever before and sometimes it is not that easy to just go find another area to hunt that someone isn't already in. Personally i won't move in on guys but you better be willing to bust your a$$ getting away from them.

[fivebucks]

I agree with Bear55. We still see some of that in the public land we hunt. The day will come when it will change but for now I am glad the way it is. And it is legal to build perm. stands in alot of the state forest land of the north. They recommend portables but perms are legal. You cannot build an enclosed box stand but you can a platform and a seat.

[Gofishleech]

I didnt read all post here but the ones I read are just the kind of people that will "move in" on you. Yea, yea its public land but if Im scouting and area and find deer stands I will find somewhere else to hunt. This is all about ethics and most people dont have any!! So you hunt a spot for 30 years and now you are sopposed to go find another spot because someone wants the area you hunt???? Its a bunch of [PoorWordUsage] but as said nothing you can do about it.

This kind of stuff just ticks me off, it happens on land and water all the time and these people have no ethics or know what the word means, they hide behide the word "public" This kind off behaveor will sour people from hunting and hurt us in the future.

I would definatly talk to these guys and tell them what the word ethics mean, they dont have agree with you but this would not go un argued if it were me!!

[Chef]

Take the ladders down and then pack in climbing sticks so you can get into your stands.

[Muskie456]

Gofishleech,

I am going to play devils advacate here. #1 if i'm on water how am I supposed to know if someone has been hunting that for years. If it is the point I should be hunting for that wind and no one else is sitting there i'm hunting it. It's not my fault they slept in and felt it was "their" spot once they get there. Deer stands are a little differant (especially when maintained and it is opening weekend)but just because some one put a stand in an area back in 1903 or 2003 that means I can't hunt there. What if they hunt somewhere else now and the stand has been vacated. If I know full well they are using the area I will not hunt it but just because there is a stand in the area doesn't mean I am unethical for hunting there. There are honest mistakes. You want it, get up early and own it. If you show up and someone is there suck it up and move on without wrecking the other persons hunt. To do anything else would be unethical.

[Musky Buck]

Here ya Muskie456,not to get off topic but fishing muskies this summer caught a 49 incher and a boat pulls up, instead of saying nice fish they said well we raised that fish an hour ago and were waiting to refish it at prime time like it was there fish. Disgruntled they fired up there 225 merc, trimmed it and floored it as hard as they could to the far end of the lake. Public Land/Water can mean public headaches/frustration. I think a bit too is many of us have lost many spots we used to be able to hunt putting more pressure on public ground and many can't or are unwilling to buy land for 9 days. I used to goose hunt roughly 12-15 farms, I have 1 left. Private land isn't always a walk in the park either, trust me. Heck, depending on the number of hunters if there was a stand for each of you and the neighbors, have a fantasy stand draft each night before and those that have shot deer are out of the draft until those that haven't have chosen. Think it would work, I doubt it to.

[lawdog]

Here's how I was raised, public land means it is not mine and I can't claim it for my own and then whine when some of the rest of the public wants to use the public land that they have every bit as much right to as me.

[Jameson]

Well put Lawdog.

I use to stay clear of a clear-cut, because of a few permanent stand built around it. After tracking my buddy's wounded deer past three of the stands last opener and having no body in them, I now do not stay clear of permanent stands unless their is someone in them.

[skee0025]

I too wouldn't use someones stand on public property, but there are plenty of people who do and that is the problem.

I gotta play devils advocate on that loaded statement. I would argue that the problem lies with people who place permanent stands on public land and think that it somehow gives them exclusive rights to an area. Dont want someone using "your stand" use a portable or buy your own land.