APR's good..I gotta ask...(?)

[CANOPY SAM]

This has nothing to do with APR's but since that topic is ridiculously hot...

We just got the Outdoor Channel in HD, and OMG! OMG!

We had the Outdoor Channel a few years ago (perhaps 6-8 years?), but now, oh my goodness? These guys, and shockingly hot gals, "smoke" giant deer on what appears to be a routine basis.

What in the world of deer hunting is going on here? They've got deer on film, every single show, that are absolutely ridiculous!

Am I alone in this, or will any of you step up and admit you've hunted your entire lives and never, ever, even seen a buck HALF the size of what the average Outdoor Channel buck looks like? I mean honestly, some of these animals are so freakishly large they look like circus side-shows.

C'mon. Can someone shed some light on this? I thought for the last few years I was reasonably good at finding a decent white-tailed buck. I've watched this channel for the past few hours and I can't even get my mind around how BIG these deer are! Some are better than average. Some are just stupid big, and then the camera men call off the shooter!!!!!!!!???????

What the ____????

[PEATMOSS]

It's called HORN PORN. It is what sells gear and equipment. It is also what is driving normally sane reasonable people stark raving mad.

Almost every one of these shows is filmed on some high fence "hunting preserve" and the deer they "harvest" are carefully bred and managed livestock. These shows have somehow convinced a large and growing number of our friends that our once great hunting heritage is now just a game of antler quest. This whole mess has spread all over and we in Minnesota have actually resisted this insanity longer than most, but as the other thread clearly shows, our heritage may be slipping away

[delcecchi]

Reminds me of the show last weekend where the host was saying that since in the north the deer population is low, only 5 per square mile, that they baited and the ethics of baiting was a personal decision. Then he said they were hunting with a service called "baitmaster" or something like that.

Might have been the one in Saskatchewan.

"Prefer a slower pace? Then try one of our comfortable ground blinds or tree stands overlooking an active bait. Our bucks don't come easy - but they are well worth the effort! "

[matchset]

Almost every one of these shows is filmed on some high fence "hunting preserve" and the deer they "harvest" are carefully bred and managed livestock.

on what proof can you base this outlandish claim?

The Drury's hunt 100% fair chase. Lee and Tiffany own/lease thousands of acres that border the Drury's.

Stan Potts is very reputable, and hunts outfitters that you can go to yourself.

The only show I can think of on the Outdoor channel is larry weishuhn's (MR. Whitetail) and he clearly say's he's hunting a preserve.

we call it APR's in Minnesota, in IOWA they call it common sense.

[jay83196]

And politicians don't lie and Santa clause exists....not sure about tooth fairy?

[PEATMOSS]

on what proof can you base this outlandish claim?

I dunno, maybe it's seeing big bucks coming out to graze in an open field in broad daylight. Could be the dumb looks that the deer give the camera man. Might even be the fact that these deer never seem to spook when the hunter goes "he's a shooter" right before he plugs the thing. Maybe it's just that these shows are so far divorced from the reality of what I have experienced over the years that I just can't grasp it

[nonteepical]

You guys just refuse to believe that their is such a.thing as good hunting. Yeah some of the.shows are high fence they are pretty easy to pick out but if it's in iowa, illinois or kansas it's the real deal. Ever notice they rarely hunt minnesota

[matchset]

[quote name='PEATMOSS

I dunno' date=' maybe it's seeing big bucks coming out to graze in an open field in broad daylight. Could be the dumb looks that the deer give the camera man. Might even be the fact that these deer never seem to spook when the hunter goes "he's a shooter" right before he plugs the thing. Maybe it's just that these shows are so far divorced from the reality of what I have experienced over the years that I just can't grasp it [/quote']

it's called B-Roll. editing and b roll are what make a hunt exciting. different camera angles too.

if they really shot the hunt in sequence like you see...they'd have to have multiple operators, and a dozen cameras.

[96trigger]

Disclaimer: I don't have the outdoor channel, cable satelite dish or otherwise. Good old fashioned antennae tv here in this house so I don't have knowledge of the shows you are talking about. However, their are 4 people that live in this town that have tv shows. Two are a popular tv hunting couple and I can't really speak for how they hunt as they are on cable, but the hunting they do around here is not high fence. The other two guys are on an internet based show, their hunts are generally on public land. A lot of the talking and filming occurs before and after the hunt and its then edited in. That is usually pretty obvious.

[matchset]

You guys just refuse to believe that their is such a.thing as good hunting. Yeah some of the.shows are high fence they are pretty easy to pick out but if it's in iowa, illinois or kansas it's the real deal. Ever notice they rarely hunt minnesota

exactly.

[Spike76]

Minnesota has good hunting, without APR's.

[PurpleFloyd]

Good. The longer it takes for people like that to take over hunting in the state the better.

[jay83196]

Either way, they are (maybe not all but many of them are) hunting areas that are like somebody suggested deer are raised and kept inside high fences (i tend to believe this as well) or they are hunting some of the best quality land secret spots there are on the planet. In either case nobody reading this site will ever hunt in a lifetime that kind a quality area. My point is this its unrealistic and doesn't give a remotely honest picture of hunting. I've watched a few shows and it cracks me up every time they almost always make comments like I just got here today and were looking for this big fella that cousin elroy and uncle goober spotted last week on his their hunt and during what they make seem like a few hours they turn away half dozen deer most of us (i don't care what state you hunt) see in years or a lifetime. The shows are more laughable than educational...its almost insulting they show it to be so easy. I'm not saying all shows are, all the ones I have seen honestly are this bad, but I don't watch them often.

[goblueM]

We had the Outdoor Channel a few years ago (perhaps 6-8 years?), but now, oh my goodness? These guys, and shockingly hot gals, "smoke" giant deer on what appears to be a routine basis.

What in the world of deer hunting is going on here? They've got deer on film, every single show, that are absolutely ridiculous!

C'mon. Can someone shed some light on this?

Well a significant portion of those shows are either:

high fence operations OR on huge ranches that manage for trophy whitetails.

I saw one on Michigan the other day, and they were hunting a place where there were at least half a dozen 140+ bucks milling around in the same field. Looked it up and its 10 minutes from my cabin. $7,000 for a hunt there

Some shows (that I like) hunt non-managed land, but it's still the best land out there. They aren't going to Uncle Bob's Back 40 and hoping something shows up. They're going to places that consistently pump out big deer

[flipper]

These are the shows the APR guys watch just before filling out the DNR surveys.

[Wanderer]

PLEASE don't confuse APRs with Hollywood hunting...

[surewood]

I rarely watch those shows, but many are absolutely fair chase. We don't believe it cause it's rare in MN. Plus they often take hours/days of video and edit it down to a half hour. These hunting opportunities do exist in other states. I have a friend from Iowa that sends me pics of deer from his stand that most of us would shoot on sight. He also has videoed for some of these "Pro" hunters you see on TV, all fair chase. It's just a different culture of deer hunting in his area. They shoot does, and bucks when they reach maturity. They've created this reality that seems unrealistic to us in MN. It's not just ranches, he has 60acres that produces large deer every year.

[leech~~]

PLEASE don't confuse APRs with Hollywood hunting...

I'm pretty sure that Bill J, and all the rest of the hunting video makers get contacted by these ranches and Outfitters when they find a nice big rack on the land to go and shot it! Makes good video for RealTree and the Outfitter gets more biz!

[TruthWalleyes]

I have an Aquantance that just hunted 10 miles from the location where the world record buck was taken...He also has a few mil's in the bank.

If you can aim and pull the trigger, there are places to buy giant bucks with much more extreme management than APR.

[tfran123]

I mispoke on one of my quotes - it's likely that 70% of bucks harvested annually are 1.5 year olds, not that we shoot 70% of the 1.5 year olds.

This discussion is interesting and everyone obviously has their views. I find that people think the outing is more exciting if the opportunity for a trophy exists. Same is said for fishing, heck why do guys got to Canada every year walleye fishing - it's not to catch 12" walleyes. It's all about the quality.

If you really think that MN has quality deer hunting like IA/MO/IL then you're kidding yourself. So what's the major hang-up for most?

Don't like people to tell you what you can do?

You really think the 1.5 year old is that much more superior from a eating standpoint while most people convert 80% of their vension to sausage?

In fishing we have minimum size requirements on some lakes or slots, etc., is that a problem?

Honestly can't comprehend why others don't see why letting a few more big buck survive is a bad thing. While my kids would be thrilled shooting any buck they have dreams of a big buck.

[tfran123]

One last story:

I hunt public and private. On the private it consists of 4 parties who control about 700 acres. 10 years ago we shot every antlered buck, very rarely in these years would we get a 3.5 or older, heck a 2.5 year old was a nice animal. Now with the exception of the kids we have a self imposed 3.5 year old limitation (or 8 pt/16" wide). During the last few years we've run trail cameras and I've watch my 1.5 year olds which historically made up 80%+ of the population now are closer to 40%. And at any given year now are age distriubtion looks like this: 40/30/20/10 (1.5/2.5/3.5/4.5+). This is what you'd get with APR's state wide, it's not that you'd have fewer 1.5 year olds you just have a more balanced age distribution. Believe me it's gratifing passing up a 3.5 year old because you know there are bigger ones roaming . . .

[22lex]

I have a few people I know who contract for Drurys and other various shows. They pay a reduced fee to trophy hunt in SD/MT/KT/MO/KS etc, give AD time to the ranches (not fenced)....then are compensated a little more than the trip costs by the end video production. Don't make a ton, but they get to film/trophy hunt and make some money and do some speaking as well. They are accomplished hunters, and do the leg work on their own once they pay the fee to hunt the land. They don't have billy bob run them out on a gator to the stand, they hang double stands all over and hunt hard for a week or two to get some good footage.

Shows these days are ridiculous compared to ten years ago when it was just about the average 8/10 or even harvested doe they shot.

[fr0sty]

My favorite b roll scene came from one of Mike Haneback's shows. The "aiming" shot clearly showed the gun's scope covers were both down when she was lining up her shot.

Classic.

it's called B-Roll. editing and b roll are what make a hunt exciting. different camera angles too.

if they really shot the hunt in sequence like you see...they'd have to have multiple operators, and a dozen cameras.

[Getanet]

Let's be real about what "fair chase" is on these hunting shows. In nearly every case they are on privately managed,exclusive hunting preserves. So yes, while the deer are not penned in, these are also highly exclusive, privately managed hunting lodges that limit the number of hunters and charge outrageous fees to hunt this land.

For example, someone mentioned The Drury's hunt 100% fair chase. I don't watch the show, but I went to their HSOforum. They have an entire list of Outfitters on their site. One was in Iowa, South West Iowa Outfitters, so I clicked their link. On the site they had many videos from The Drury Show. You too can have the same "experience" for around $2,500 bucks (not including about $500 for the license). If you're one of the first 20 people to book, since that's all they allow on the property. And you're fined $500 if you shoot a buck under 125 gross inches.

$2500 is actually on the low end. I'm sorry, while this makes for good TV, it's not what I think we should be attempting to turn MN's hunting into.

[22lex]

Either way, they are (maybe not all but many of them are) In either case nobody reading this site will ever hunt in a lifetime that kind a quality area.

I hunt in Zone 3, and used to hunt next to many hundreds of acres that were off-limits to hunting by a family of local farmers. On the backside of that land it was leased by H.S. for many years.

I shot a 170/140/ had many other sightings of mature deer, and saw the biggest buck I have ever seen on the hoof (can't even imagine what it would score) but it was freakishly huge. I also harvested a many does on that land with numerous age structures of deer. I had three seperate age class bucks running a hot doe once, most amazing thing I had ever seen. I call that a very quality area because of the spillout of bucks that had to roam in their own areas because the big boys kicked them out. The kicker was the farmers would invite numerous families out there to shoot does, and the kids could shoot whatever buck they wanted if they were 16 or younger. Kind of their own APR in a sense. The adults could shoot a ten or better.

Again, I will say this works well for zone 3, I cannot attempt to believe the same exact hunter approval would happen statewide.