what a bunch of ....

[fire29]

I just watched wild game nation on the outdoor channel. Opening day in Minnesota Muzzleloading. Big Bill and whats his face both shot bucks in Southern Minnesota with Muzzleloaders.... with scopes on them!!! I called the T.I.P. line to complain and they told me it was already brought to their attention and there were no fines handed out because there was no violations. WHAT??? Muzzleloading in muzzloading season with a scope is not illegal? Perfect, Im heading to gander to get a scope, oh but im not gonna be able to pay the mn dnr off so I will get fined. Way to go MN DNR. What a crock!!! Sorry for venting, just wondering if there is anyone else on my side. A law is a law.

[fr0sty]

Just a thought. Were they hunting on a fenced game farm? If so, maybe the scope rule doesn't apply.

[TooTallTom]

If you have a medical reason, you can have a non-magnifying scope. Or at least that's how I remember the law.

[Red Cabin]

If this is true then a crime has been committed and they should be punished for it.

It may be they were hunting during the regular firearm season and for the "show" said muzzleloader season?

[jigginjim]

Call the show and make them explain their actions. I call gills and fins and complain about the swearing on the show not fit for young viewers.they now post a flag at the beginning.

CALL them on it. tell to post on this site so we all know what is going on. I did not see the show if I had info info I'll call, text, e-mail til I get the action I want.

GO GET THEM!

i what my 1.5x 5power scope on my gun.

[picksbigwagon]

Have you called the St. Paul offices directly? Not the T.I.P. line, but the Main office. I fully agree with you, if it was during muzzleloader season, they shouldn't have had scopes. If it was shotgun season 3a or 3b then the scope would have been fine. They could have claimed it was muzzleloader season but actually were here earlier during the regular firearm seasons. Remember, we had a ton of snow last year and they could have decided to do a "creative" title

[picksbigwagon]

Wait, doesn't opening Day come on the last weekend of zone 3B? If so, I beleive they can use scopes on those two overlap days, correct?

[John478]

Wait, doesn't opening Day come on the last weekend of zone 3B? If so, I beleive they can use scopes on those two overlap days, correct?

They could if they had a 3b firearms lic, but not with just a muzzleloading lic.

You never now what to believe on those shows anyway

[Big Dave2]

I say, stop watching ALL hunting shows. They are the ruination of the sport.

[Solaris79]

Regardless of the overlap of gun and muzzy season, it is still a "reality" television show and these shows are designed to be exciting and develop viewer interest so the viewer comes back for the next episode. If the topic the producers wanted to portray was a late-season muzzy hunt, our early winter last year would have been perfect to relay a "late-season muzzy hunt" to their viewers during the 3a/b firearms season/s. Even if its under false pretenses, for the most part the audience doesn't have a clue it really isn't a designated muzzy season (even though the people are still technically muzzy hunting). Viewers from MN (or non-residents) who muzzy hunt in MN or those who hunt other deer seasons in MN but choose to learn cross-seasonal laws would be the only ones that would have the slightest hint of false pretenses, and it could be narrowed down even further by adding only the ones out of the muzzy and deer hunting groups who care to learn and practice all legitimate laws pertaining to the hunts. This includes knowing all individually specific laws pertaining to individually specific seasons as well as cross-weapons/season laws. Its sad to say, but there is a certain percentage of people who don't even know the laws pertaining to the specific seasons and areas they are participating in.

As for the specific situation with the show in question, if they broke the law through the use a scoped muzzy during the muzzy season and were not legally and medically cleared/defined as optically challenged, they should be penalized to the full extent of the law.

Many tv shows and the producers of them (especially reality tv) show what they believe the viewers want, even if it means its under false pretenses, beyond normal/immoral/unethical, or even content that is boarding on or is illegal. This is all done for higher ratings, personal ego's, and ultimately the almighty dollar.

[mntatonka]

It's entirely legal to use any scope on a muzzle loader during an firearms season EXCEPT muzzle loader season. They very well could have been hunting the second weekend of 3B, with a 3B license, and using a scope on their muzzle loader.

[laker1]

call and get a explanation,something is missing.

[harvey lee]

I agree laker as we need the whole story.

[fire29]

A call could be made, but what do you think the answer is gonna be? Yes I guess it could be the the last weekend of gun season, BUT the the way they made it come accross on tv is they were hunting opening day of Muzzleloading season in MN. It just rubbed me the wrong way, average Joe has to follow every law, but if your a nobody with a tv show all the laws change? Apparently they do.

[harvey lee]

I agree that if they were doing what you believe happened it is wrong. I guess one will never know unless you contacted them to see if they will tell u what really went down.

[lakevet]

Everyone involved with those shows have the major goal of marketing and selling product to generate income. Profitable business is a good thing IF done ETHICALLY, not just legally. These shows are role models for people, and as such should be a step back from the line, not blurring it.

Muzzleloader scope manufacturers would love to open the Minnesota Muzzleloader season to scopes. Tony Knight of the now defunct Knight rifles that started the modern muzzleloader craze has long campaigned hard for scopes for all. Even specifically personally pushing for changes at our Minnesota legislature. Wish he would just stay in Iowa where he can vote.

So why not start making shows about "Minnesota Muzzleloading" that the average hunter watches that look like you can use scopes during the Minnesota muzzleloader season? Hunters go buy scopes, your sponsor sees uptick in sales of muzzleloader scopes in Minnesota market (With 60,000 Muzzy hunters at $100 a scope it is a potential $6,000,000 market, if $150 a scope it is $9,000,000). Happy sponsors increase/continue to give $$$$$$$ to show and its hosts. And you might get a visit from the MN DNR, but you know you are legal, just doesn't look it in the show. Sure it was a rigged show and maybe not forthcoming how you did it "legally", but you do what you need to do to sell product to keep sponsors and your bank account happy. And deceive the hunting public for profit.

Meanwhile back in the real Minnesota muzzleloading season, show watching hunters who have bought muzzleloader scopes hunt Muzzleloader season and get written up by a CO for breaking the law (which results in the state of MN getting $$$$).

Net result.... transfer of $$$$$ from hunter to outdoor manufacturers and the state of MN. Not saying conspiracy on the states part, just the show (markets) and sponsors (manufacturers) part. Who are the sponsors? Has anyone called the shows sponsors and yelled at them? That is the way to get the shows attention. And a letter to the editor of a popular MN outdoor weekly newspaper to help educate the public about the deception, as well as any outdoor radio shows. Get it on their radar, as this is when muzzy season is a hot topic.

Thanks for being vigilant about this issue, and taking action

lakevet

[trebby01]

if its a one power scope they can have it on since there is no magnification

[Archerysniper]

if its a one power scope they can have it on since there is no magnification

1X is a magnification and is illegal, it's clear in the laws page 58 top of the page to have a scope you must have a special permit issued from the dnr.

[TRZ II]

I seen the same thing and figured it was a fenced hunt????

[shortfatguy]

I really doubt the hunters, and producers, and everyone else involved in the show would be dumb enough to film illegal activity and air it on tv.

[Quackaddict9]

I really doubt the hunters, and producers, and everyone else involved in the show would be dumb enough to film illegal activity and air it on tv.

Well if Jeff Foiles did it in one of his videos, someone else will. Even happened on Youtube and the guy committed suicid...ed himself a few months after the investigation if I have facts right. But this was related to waterfowl hunting.

[InTheNorthwoods]

1X is a magnification and is illegal, it's clear in the laws page 58 top of the page to have a scope you must have a special permit issued from the dnr.

I am no scope expert, but I have never heard 1x is a magnification. Multiply any number by 1 and the result is the same as the number you multiplied by 1 (i.e. 3x1=3; 9x1=9; 1,249,280x1=1,249,280). There is no such thing as 0 magnification (1x is = to no magnification).

I am not going to argue the legality, as I recall there being some question over whether or not a scope w/out magnification is legal in MN w/out some sort of Dr's permit.

[TruthWalleyes]

I just watched wild game nation on the outdoor channel. Opening day in Minnesota Muzzleloading. Big Bill and whats his face both shot bucks in Southern Minnesota with Muzzleloaders.... with scopes on them!!! I called the T.I.P. line to complain and they told me it was already brought to their attention and there were no fines handed out because there was no violations. WHAT??? Muzzleloading in muzzloading season with a scope is not illegal? Perfect, Im heading to gander to get a scope, oh but im not gonna be able to pay the mn dnr off so I will get fined. Way to go MN DNR. What a crock!!! Sorry for venting, just wondering if there is anyone else on my side. A law is a law.

This could be legal if they had a 3B Firearms license, and were hunting the last weekend of 3B and first weekend of Muzzle. Since you didn't say which zone, or what their license was, there is no reason to assume illegal hunting. I used my muzzleloader all of gun season, and next year will have a scope attached to it...but it will be removed when my muzzleloader season starts.

[LightningBG]

Yeah, I don't really care what they were doing. For all we know they weren't even in MN.

In the process of researching the scope issue, I found this quite interesting. Even if you do have the permit for the muzzy scope, it cannot have magnification. Just 1X.

Here is the statute.

Subd. 5.Scopes; visually impaired hunters.

(a) Notwithstanding any other law to the contrary, the commissioner may issue a special permit, without a fee, to use a muzzleloader with a scope to take deer during the muzzleloader season to a person who obtains the required licenses and who has a visual impairment. The scope may not have magnification capabilities.

[eyedawg]

Why don't the dnr just make scopes legal for muzzy hunting? I personally think it would be better for a lot of reasons. Look at all the other states that let you.