all i want is a decent looking lawn

[DTro]

Here in Jordan the soil is pure sand so my lawn dries out extremely fast.  I have a lot which just a bit over a half an acre.  I have 5 zones of irrigation which I typically run every other day in the early morning for approx a half an hour for each zone (2.5 hrs of watering).    This comes out to roughly 40hrs of watering per month.  It’s just my wife and I so we use very little inside water.

 

I just got my utility bill and it says I used 53,000 gallons of water. It is Bi Monthly so approx 27k/month.   Does this seem reasonable?  Excessive?

 

The kicker is that the city charges a premium for anything over 30,000/BiMontly, so if I’m at 53,000 then it’s a $1 more per thousand gallons and that charge is on the entire amount, not just the additional 23,000 gallons.  So instead of paying $3.87/1000 its $4.87/1000.  Add in flat sewer rates, and flat availability charges, surgcharges, etc and I’m easily over 400 bucks!

 

This sure seems like a lot to pay for a decent looking law and that is not even including the (3) $40 bags of fertilizer and various weed products I probably will have used this year. 

 

Even after all that, my yard still looks semi shoddy with plenty of weeds and bare spots.   Meanwhile the neighbor had knee high dandelions all spring and now a completely barren lawn.   After seeing my recent bill, I’m wondering if that isn’t the way to go...

[Tom7227]

One thing you could consider it putting in some native seed plantings making sure that you get materials that will grow in your area. I put in two a few years ago and right now that's about the only area that has green on it. Google and find someone down in your area and spend some time visiting with them to get recommendations. Now is a good time to get an area started.

[Jameson]

Astroturf? Fieldturf? Wouldn't have to mow it and it would give you a decent looking lawn!

I've never bothered with trying to get a good looking lawn. I try and have it green, and not dirt. That is good enough for me. The native prairie grass seed is a great idea.

[pushbutton]

Thats about right. My neighbor keeps up an acre and drops 350 ish during July and August .... just to supplement a small well and pump. Pure sand as well. And yep, that does not include the fertilizer, weed control, overseed seed, dethatcher/aerator attachments. Not too mention the 15 grand deer. Must admit it sure is nice to walk shoeless on it. But I will just keep pocketing my cash and keep my shoes on while frolicking on my weedy brown yard.

[setterguy]

Figure each large rotating sprinkler will put out around 2.5 gallons per minute. While I don't know your set up....

5 heads per zone, 5 zones = 25 sprinklers

25 sprinklers x 2.5 x 30 minutes x 15 days a month = 28,000 gallons.

Irrigation systems are supposed to fill in the gaps between rain. When we have basically zero rain for 45 days, even the best designed irrigation systems have to be adjusted.

Does your timer have a % setting? I would turn my settings down in the spring and fall and maybe bump them up in july august. I would also consider spreading a light layer of black dirt and overseeding the next few falls. Give your lawn a soil that will retain a bit of moisture.

[B. Amish]

how high do you mow?

how much shade is in your yard?

mow higher and less frequent + more shade = less water.

i've also added a prairie planting to more yard where grass grew poorly. landscape it in or have a design and they can look rather sharp.

[merkman]

I think it is time for a sandpoint....

Just sayin'

.

[LwnmwnMan2]

I think it is time for a sandpoint....

Just sayin'

.

Some cities will fine you for a sandpoint. Even if you put it in a shed, it's pretty obvious if you have a green yard right now with 300 gallons of usage last month. That water came from somewhere.

I had properties with a $3,000 water bill last month.

[CANOPY SAM]

I would also consider spreading a light layer of black dirt and overseeding the next few falls. Give your lawn a soil that will retain a bit of moisture.

I was thinking the exact same thing. Perhaps even adding a light, loamy layer of soil for several years in a row, until you achieve a much thicker layer of quality soil rather than so much sand. That, and incorporating what was also said about mowing less often, and leaving it cut longer.

I think we all worry to much about what our lawn looks like. We put WAY too much fresh clean water, seed, and fertilizer on something that just doesn't really matter. The nice thing about grass is it can go dormant for a LONG time and still come back when the soil moisture returns to normal.

Yes, grass doesn't look very nice when it's real dry, but there's only so much fresh water on this planet, and I fear we're pretty careless about how we use it. No offense intended big D. We're all guilty in this regard.

I take care of almost 10 acres of mowable ground. When the weather cooperates, and we get ample moisture, my place looks like a city park/golf course...because I actually have two tee boxes and a golf green! When it gets dry, the place looks like a cattle pasture. I personally just can't justify pouring money into my lawn, but that's just me.

I also looked at a sand point well, or irrigating from the river that surrounds our property, but again, it just isn't something that takes a priority over more important things.

[DTro]

Thanks for the suggestions, was mostly venting about the price of H20.

Hopefully I can recoup some of the cost when and if I ever sell.

I got a little good news I think. I found a phantom extra $120 added to my bill. Looks like a computation error in my favor.

Lesson: Audit your bills from time to time.

[delcecchi]

The price of H2O? In rochester it is about .1cents per gallon (like 80 cents for an 800 gallon unit.).

Sounds cheap to me. Maybe you need xeriscaping?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xeriscaping

At the very least, perhaps some fine fescue or some other grass that needs less water.

[DTro]

well, the price here is 4.15/1000 which seems cheap until you use 53000 gallons

[delcecchi]

well, the price here is 4.15/1000 which seems cheap until you use 53000 gallons

4 dollars a thousand gallons? Wow. Does that include the sewage charge too?

[DTro]

NO

and to make it even better, its tiered so everything over 30k goes up to 5.47

[setterguy]

+ The chances of the sandpoint actually being able to operate the irrigation system the way it was designed are slim. Unless you spend mucho bucks on a pump, then you are not ahead anyway. Most sandpoints will not have the capacity to operate the heads at the right pressure and volume that city water does. The lawn wouldn't look that good anyway then...

[Scott K]

When I first moved into my house about 12 years ago, I wanted to keep the yard in good shape, even hired a lawn company to come out and spray and fertilize the first couple years, but back then we got our city bill every 3 months, and the bill we would get in August would floor me. I am talking $1000+ more for a 3 month bill because of watering the lawn, and the sewer charges would be based off of how much water you used. After a couple years, I figured a nice brown yard in late July and August that I didnt need to mow, was acceptable.

[aanderud]

NO

and to make it even better, its tiered so everything over 30k goes up to 5.47

[aanderud]

After seeing what Jordan, Carver, and Phoenix charge, I figured I better check where I live now. I've determined that water rates all look fairly random. Here I'm in Eden Prairie, and they have 5 tiers for residential ranging from $1.90 per thousand for the first 36k gallons up to $4.40 per thousand for anything over 78000 gallons. So, cheaper overall than Carver and Jordan. BUT, then you look at some of the other rates and it's comical.

http://www.edenprairie.org/modules/showdocument.aspx?documentid=716

Non-residential rates (apartments, businesses, industrial, etc) is the cheapest rate for all gallons, with no tiers -- $1.90 per 1000. No wonder businesses can water every day!

Then there's this other category that isn't really labelled residential or commercial called "irrigation meter", which I'm gonna have to look into whether I can install one in a residential house or not. I know you can get second meters in many communities, but that's typically only done so that they are able to account for the sewer usage and not charge sewer treatment rates on the irrigation water. Here in E.P., as in Carver, they do the thing where the sewer rate is calculated based on winter usage, so I'm not sure if they even let you put an irrigation meter in a residential household of if they are meant for industrial use only. The rates on the irrigation meters range from $2.90 to $4.40 per 1000 gallons, but then they say "divide by 3 to get the monthly rate". (they must be billing only quarterly). If I divide by 3 on those, it looks to be pretty cheap to maintain lawns -- from just under $1.00 to just about $1.50 per 1000 gallons even under max-usage scenario, which I wouldn't be at. But again those may not be for residential use. I've got a message on their answering machine, and waiting to hear back.

[Tom7227]

Living in White Bear I have paid a lot of attention to what rates are charged for various levels of use. And it isn't easy to figure out.

A basic idea in utility regulation is that there should be two components in the rate structure. The demand charge, which pays for the pumps or generating plants, wires or pipes, staff etc. The use charge is the cost per unit consumed. In many instances the large users pay less per unit than small users, which seems to give little incentive to conserve.

But in some places the demand charge isn't built at a high enough level to pay for all of the fixed operating costs. For instance in the City of White Bear I believe that the operating costs are paid through the general property tax levy so everyone pays the same amount regardless of the amount of water they consume. The result is that the water rates in White Bear are supposedly a quarter the amount charged by the Saint Paul Regional Water Service. Some are making the argument that the Saint Paul water is too expensive and so the municipal system shouldn't be changed to use surface water rather than the well water that we in the NE area use.

If you really want to know what the water is costing you have to dig a bit into the rate structure of your system and see if all the costs of it are contained in the rates.

[aanderud]

For instance in the City of White Bear I believe that the operating costs are paid through the general property tax levy so everyone pays the same amount regardless of the amount of water they consume. The result is that the water rates in White Bear are supposedly a quarter the amount charged by the Saint Paul Regional Water Service.

That's a perfect example of the 'random' I was talking about. Rates in St Paul are 4x as much as White Bear, which is darn-near next-door.

In a market that is so tightly regulated as this, where the consumer has no choice where to shop due to the municipal monopoly, I would expect a bit more consistency on water rates. But this is what we get when we let government control things. I bet Comcast and Centurylink don't charge 4x as much for their products in St Paul, nor do any gas stations or car dealers.... Just sayin.

Note that I'm not advocating that we have private businesses start laying pipes and delivering water in the cities, I'm merely pointing out that the local gov't doesn't seem to be getting it right if there's a factor of 4 discrepancy in neighboring communities.

In E.P. the rates are pretty clearly spelled out as far as what is an 'administrative' fee, what is paying for operating costs and maintenance, etc. They're pretty proud of it all (and of the fact that all of this is paid by user fees, and NOT tax dollars). I like that they're at least trying to be transparent in their fees (see page 2):

http://www.edenprairie.org/modules/showdocument.aspx?documentid=716

[CANOPY SAM]

aanderud, I'm ready to accept that I'm wrong about this, but I think that many of those south central and south western cities, such as Phoenix, sit square on top of one of the largest fresh water aquifers in the country.

It's deep, and off the top of my head, I don't know the name of it, but they live right on top of it, hence, it costs very little to pump and deliver water to many of these residents.

However, there are really stringent regs about water usage out there, and I believe most everyone is aware of them. Fly over, in or out of Pheonix some time and you'll clearly see very, very few green lawns, and if you do, they're almost certainly artificial grass. Most "lawns" in the Phoenix area are sand, and cactus.

[delcecchi]

White Bear and St Paul might be right next to each other but their water systems are distinct and pretty different. St Paul gets its water, as I recall, from a chain of lakes, ending at the water plant in between E. and W. Vadnais lakes just north and east of 694 and Rice. Strange you can fish from shore on one side of the E. Lake and not the other shore. Nice walk along the side of the lake.

White bear probably uses wells, although you would know better than me on that one.

[harvey lee]

I uae to keep my lawn very green and it would cost approx $150 month to do that on an average years.

Now, if it wants to get a tad brown, then it can do just that. I do not enjoy the green lawn well enough to spend $500-$700 a summer to have it all green.

More time fishing, less time mowing.

[leechlake]

my neighbor farms so he get's a good deal on fertilizer. We have a deal that works great for both of us. He takes care of all aspects of my lawn except watering and mowing. He aerates, de-thatches, fertilizes, sprays weeds. In return I plow his driveway in the Winter. I'm plowing anyway so it takes me another 10-15 minutes every time it snows. He's doing the above to his lawn anyway so he takes another 10-15 minutes to do mine too.

I think I get the better of the deal but we're neighbors and friends and we're both happy. My lawn looks like Augusta National most of the time. The sprinklers don't cover as well as mother nature so I could us some rain but when it does I mow twice a week.

[DTro]

Found out today I've been overpaying my water bill for 5 years...