A huge disappointment!!

[trophychaser]

Our hunting party has been trying to practice QDMA the last 3 years. It had been working out great. We have been putting at least one trophy on the wall and with shooting a couple does we have plenty of meat. Last year really helped with so much corn in the field left. We had lots of very nice deer this year. We ended up getting 2 nice ones. Three of the neighbors also shot trophy deer. We went and checked out one of the neighbors deer seeing we had it on trail camera all year. We found out this hunting party shot 13 deer first weekend, with one nice buck, a couple doe, the rest were all the young small bucks we've been passing up. You could say it was a little disappointing. The neighbor even thanked us for passing up the little ones. Now don't get me wrong they have every right to shoot whatever deer they want to. The thing that really hit a nerve with my hunting party is this guy is complaining how they have 13 deer and nobody in their hunting party wants any. He didn't know what in the heck they were going to do with all the meat. And to make matters even worse they were hunting 2nd weekend to try and fill the 2 empty tags they still had.

??????????

[Jameson]

We had a tough season with some hunters not seeing any deer that they had a tag for and would be happy to take some of the venison. Others have posted on here also looking for venison. And the List- C r aigs also has people looking for venison. Post up your contact info if your willing to be a middle man, or see if the person with the venison wishes to get a few calls or make a few calls from those that want the venison.

[nofishfisherman]

All check out the donation program that the state runs. Just need to drop off the deer at participating butcher shops. The info is on the DNR HSOforum. 13 deer can feed a lot of hungry people.

[hockeybc69]

Trophychaser,

There are a large percentage of people in the same boat.

Us included. We just keep doing what we are doing, and hope we connect on what we want.

Not a darn thing we can do about it at all except hope the neighbors goals change.

I sit in my stand gritting my teeth every year when I hear the shots outside our land, and there we sit quietly letting deer walk by.

[HNTNBUX]

As bad as it hurts your program seems to be working for you. Every tag your party does not fill on a small buck is still one more to grow up next year. Good luck.

[fishuhalik]

That does sound tough. A good buddy of mine grew up in Tennessee and still hunts down there. Him and his dad have been practicing qdm for a number of years now and take huge deer every year. This summer their neighbors that were practicing also moved, and the new people shot 29 deer this year. Needless to say their trail cameras have been pretty empty lately. They usually hunt the later rifle season in December, and my buddy's contemplating not even going this year for lack of nice deer.

[nonteepical]

aside from QDM, your story is alot more common than people realize.

[jeffreyd]

Is this really an issue of QDM or an issue of people simply shooting because they can? 13 deer yields a lot of meat. Look into to Farmers and Hunters feeding the hungry. I donated an elk one year because my buddy shot his cow and it was just too much between the two of us.

Eventually one can expect that when word gets out about such parties and events, game and fish and the rule makers may start stopping all such events. I am not a trophy hunter, only for the meat. I do not agree with guys each year going for a buck to put in a room where they only gather dust. If a person is able to watch an animal walk around you, not knowing you are there, is that more of a reward knowing you outdid mother nature and the deers ability to smell you than shooting just to do so?

Peoples morals are being lost with the governments willingness to control animal thru hunting. I agree it is a great method but it does not make sense to allow people to shoot this many animals without some consumptive regulation.

Maybe MN needs to go to an all lottery type system where you may or may not draw a tag depending on how the ball bounces?

[McGurk]

As a younger member of a neighbor/family party like that (shoot and not want it), I feel your frustration. I find it downright disrespectful to shoot a deer and then not own up to it, and I see it every year on Sunday afternoon. Luckily (I guess?) our party only went 3-7, and all the deer were accounted for. Why are there people shooting deer only to end up donating it? I'm not against the meat donation program when tied into trophy hunting, or meat hunting to fill the freezer, either. Next time, though, let it walk!!!

[Quackaddict9]

sounds like they don't enjoy being outdoors and enjoy what nature has to give...It also might be a competition for them to see who has the most kill and bragging rights. They are out there just to kill everything that moves, Period! IMO

[Code-Man]

sounds sad...I'm trying to fill tags because I have friends that want and need the meat to save money on food and I cannot see anything to shoot. I would take 4 off of their hands in a heart beat without a scrap being wasted. This gives us all a bad name and in my book it's not hunting its now turned to killing. Sad day but I know what your talking about. I got some trail cameras out we have a small chunk of woods and the neighbors pushed everything opening day. They got 9 deer on 14 acres (4 bucks 5 does) One problem they had to find people not there to fill a doe tag for the last one cause they only had 4 doe tags in the group. Then the next day they hunted again.

[Musky Buck]

Wish I had that 14 acres code-man, sounds overpopulated, 4 bucks, that's a strong number on a small property. Anyway, good luck, chances are you could repost this a year from now, success to some is how much shooting they get in, I know a clown who shot 6 opening morning, his party didn't want him doing that as he's done this for many years, they less than thankfully tagged up his extra 5 goats, but this guy can't resist shooting anything in range, told the farmer he's your relative, lay down the law or only let him take 1 bullet with next season.

[TruthWalleyes]

I talked to one guy at work a week or so ago, he said he was going hunting for the first time....Just going to shoot it, i don't want the meat, he said....I was down right dissapointed. I really wish people didn't kill animals without a purpose.

With this guy, i told him to donate the meat, NEVER shoot a deer and let it lay to rot...He told me that someone else will be taking the deer...I guess i just don't understand the mentality behind hunting for something besides the meat?!? Whats the draw in Want and Waste?!? These guys need to stick to their video games... where there is a reset button.

[Musky Buck]

No doubt truthwalleyes, on more than 1 occassion I've seen a deer hanging from rifle season at Thanksgiving, talking zone 2 not 1. You can only figure those deer get dumped after dark someplace, shooting was fun, the work part of processing or butchering yourself isn't fun apparently to these cats. I hope at the pearly gates these guys that cheat and etc. have to answer the bell, I'll get to blow past all these clowns and couldn't live with myself any other way, got a brutal conscience here.

[trophychaser]

Our hunting party practices letting the younger deer walk, but I also feel if you have a license your are entitled to shoot any legal deer that walks by. So this isn't a case of our hunting party being upset about our neighbors not practicing qdma. The thought of them shooting every deer that walks by with their only goal being killing everything and not wanting any of the meat really doesn't sit well. I know the donation program helps many people that are in need, but I'm just having a hard time agreeing with it. Shoot what you want or need and if you don't want the meat then go to the shooting range and shoot your gun there!

[Musky Buck]

I agree if licensed you have your rights, just don't wake ma out of bed to come tag what she can for the group meaning our party hunting law gets pummeled in quite a few areas, there's quite a few in our state where enough never is enough and then next year on here if they have a down year they don't take into account the overharvest they did the year before, where's all the deer, etc. Think of how many hunters once they bag a deer think, well I'm glad the neighbors didn't get him or her, there's so much concern over whatever everybody else is up to. To the topic it is frustrating when your group wants to change there ways but you can't get enough people onboard to make it happen, so the cycle continues.

[Riverratpete]

Agree that if a person has a tag and want to shoot fawns..have at er, tastes better then some old swamp buck anyways. I hunt public land and end up passing many deer, mostly because their does or spikes, so I don't have the luxury or the time to play the QDM game. Unfortunately some people think that since they have a tag, they need to fill it, it gets to be about being able to say "I got one"..heck, I've seen brothers fight over who gets what stand becuase they want to say "They shot the biggest Buck"..silly. Then we have the one upsmanship game of "I shot this many deer". Wasting of animals due to greed, selfishness, laziness, idiocy..I have no time for and do not tolerate being around. They shoot too many deer because they can't control themselves..call TIP, maybe it'll get through their thick skulls when they have to pay a hefty fine. I do think the donation program is great and would highly encourage individuals to partake in it

[jerkbait]

Our hunting party practices letting the younger deer walk, but I also feel if you have a license your are entitled to shoot any legal deer that walks by. So this isn't a case of our hunting party being upset about our neighbors not practicing qdma. The thought of them shooting every deer that walks by with their only goal being killing everything and not wanting any of the meat really doesn't sit well. I know the donation program helps many people that are in need, but I'm just having a hard time agreeing with it. Shoot what you want or need and if you don't want the meat then go to the shooting range and shoot your gun there!

I agree with you Trophy. I am by no means a QDMA supporter and I will shoot what tags I have to fill, but we love our venny. My wife hates to buy beef and with 2 deer our freezer is empty by April may.

[jeffreyd]

River to visit something you put in your post is that you pass on does and spikes because you usually do not have the time to waste etc. You dont have the time to practice QDM but in a sense you do as you are passing on does and smaller bucks to let them grow and populate. While it may not be the model plan it is a method. The thing that gets me, and I do not know how mn works for tags for sure, is that if you make it a bit more difficult to get a tag, raise the cost of the tag or do a lottery statewide, you will get rid of the folks that just do it for the thrill of killing something. The thing about AZ, we have a lottery, one animal per person per year. The other thing is our tags plus the cost of the license is near 100 bucks. If you want to put in for a tag, you have to either have a license in hand or opt to buy it if you draw, plus no online apps so you have to pay the total upfront rather than leave a cc number and only charged a small admin fee. This has slowed the amount of people who really dont want to hunt over the ones who do.

[nonteepical]

I hunt public land and end up passing many deer, mostly because their does or spikes, so I don't have the luxury or the time to play the QDM game.

passing up spikes (1.5 year olds) is QDM.

[psepuncher]

Cornicelli, who’s been working check stations in the northwest sampling deer for bovine tuberculosis, said he saw more big bucks registered than he’d seen any time since he started working the area in 2005. Why that is, he said, is hard to say.

hmmm

Are more hunters in MN practicing QDM?

I thought we didn;t have any big bucks

But in reality what we old timers used to say was a big buck, it was based soley body weight. First thing we did was weigh it.

Now a big buck is defined by points. and that is to me a huge disapointment.

We need education and learn to pass on small bodies if we're going to tighten up the bag limits. Maybe we'll see body size educated in our hunters ed classes soon.

sorry for just rambling on.

[96trigger]

There are big bucks in Minnesota, make no mistake about it. This year was a perfect year for growing big racks, early spring, good crops, lots of lush nutrients all summer. If there was a year to get a buck with a big rack, this was it.

I know people think the QDMr's complain about not having any big bucks, I actually think many of them know we have big bucks, and many of them also know that we have the potential to get more into the breeding game if people would practice more QDM. I don't think I have ever read on this forum where a pro QDMer has said that Minnesota doesn't have big bucks.

Sorry, I don't mean to get into an argument with anyone, but thats about the 4th or 5th time I have read a comment like that since the deer season, that is aimed at people that are pro QDM.

[Riverratpete]

"so I don't have the luxury or the time to play the QDM game." that was a misstatement, what I meant to say was that I pass on Does and Spikes when I don't have a Doe Tag and will pass on one if I'm in the first day or so of a multi-day hunt but if push comes to shove, I'll take one by the end of the hunt if given the opportunity..inevitably though alot of times passing on a deer means not getting one..especially in the Big Woods of Zone 1.

[InTheNorthwoods]

Cornicelli, who’s been working check stations in the northwest sampling deer for bovine tuberculosis, said he saw more big bucks registered than he’d seen any time since he started working the area in 2005. Why that is, he said, is hard to say.

hmmm

Are more hunters in MN practicing QDM?

I thought we didn;t have any big bucks

But in reality what we old timers used to say was a big buck, it was based soley body weight. First thing we did was weigh it.

Now a big buck is defined by points. and that is to me a huge disapointment.

We need education and learn to pass on small bodies if we're going to tighten up the bag limits. Maybe we'll see body size educated in our hunters ed classes soon.

sorry for just rambling on.

IMO, trying to throw the fact that there has been some nice bucks killed in MN in the face of people who want to see more QDM practiced is like trying to tell a poor person they are rich because they have a few dollars.

As to Cornicelli's comments, they are only relevant to the bovine TB area of NW MN where there has been a decimation of much of the deer herd over the past 5+ years. With that in mind, there are a few reasons that I suspect are the cause of these findings. First, the antler growing conditions in the Northern part of the state were very good this year. An early spring combined with plentiful rainfall meant quality forage early in the year and throughout the summer. Second, and something that hasn't been mentioned, is that the TB area has very few deer now. This means less deer competing for the quality forage in the big woods areas. Add to that, that the deer remaining are likely the adult deer and the savviest deer in the woods who have avoided hunters and sharpshooters. The savviest deer are usually the mature bucks that live solitary lives and only move at night unless it is the rut - these deer are the hardest to kill. So my thought is that mature deer make up a larger portion of the deer herd in that area, when mature deer make up a larger portion of a herd, deer movement by mature deer is increased as they are counted on for breeding, they have to seek out does rather than having does readily available, and they compete with other mature deer for does, etc. This leads to an increased harvest of mature deer.

[psepuncher]

I know people think the QDMr's complain about not having any big bucks,

And more so what's even funnier..

Is the same pro qdm crowed goes to show me,

that all they do is count points.

I've proved it a few times on HSO.

We've had discussions about points.

I'll post a young buck with legal points,

time and again a pro qdmer is the first one to chime back and say

take him.

QDM is not at all soley about age structure, or breeding, or feeding...etc.

It's all things considered

But I'm stupified to see the audacity of those QDMer's to take such young bucks

and completly disregard age structure.

Is it so wrong to harvest young bucks? nope.

not even antler restrictions can save the young bucks,

in which all the qdmers were complaining about not seeing mature bucks

as if we didn't have any.

All I heard read and saw was..I want to see more mature bucks.

What was their context? and again it was qdmer's not considering age structure but counting points alone.

The education needs to be shared by all and probably taught from a traditional point of view. We've always had big bucks but now..counting points is portrayed as better QDM to grow bigger bucks.