MN Supreme Court calls "illegal game baiting" laws ambiguous

[benbosh]

do farmers pile their manure in 1 spot, no.

ah... yeah they do.

[shortfatguy]

To me a food plot and baiting are only different in the fact that unless you have money you can't do it. People who can't afford to own hunting land can't plant food plots. Just another way for the people who have their own land to keep the deer from using public land as much. Why should a guy be able to plant food plots on the 80 acres next to the public 80 I hunt and I am not allowed to put feed out to try and counteract his effort to draw them all away from my hunting area?

[MuleShack]

I with the farmer/hunter on this one. Mainly because if he actually was trying to bait deer, he would not have made such a big pile in the open and also would not have called the CO and said he was going to be hunting over a huge pile of Pumpkins. Also, piling the pumpkins up and calling it green manure does not make near as much sense as spreading them out, but there are issues that can arise making spreading them out very difficult, such as equipment breakdowns, wet fields etc.

[Black_Bay]

You guys are missing the point. This guy needs a pumpkin chunker.

[bigbucks]

That's funny stuff man!

[Beast26]

If I read the article correctly, he states that he rotates the pumpkins between 3 fields each year, putting the pumpkins in the field they were not using.

Why would he not choose to hunt the other 2 fields instead of the one with the "Bait" in it? He had options, he just choose to grind his axe because they harassed his son IMO.

Why should he have to? It's normal farming practice.

[TooTallTom]

Why would he not choose to hunt the other 2 fields instead of the one with the "Bait" in it? He had options, he just choose to grind his axe because they harassed his son IMO.

Even if he did this he'd still be baiting, according to the MN regulations.

[Bear55]

Anyone else find pumpkins to be horrible bait until later in the year? My deer ignore them for weeks and them gobble them up in December. Not that I hunt over them I just throw them in the back yard with a camera over them to see what shows up.

[Ufatz]

Somewhat related. Minnesota DNR officers are reporting AGAIN an increase in citations for deer hunting over bait. They state they are confused as ever because " nobody seems to get the messsage." Especially ONE GUY who has been busted THREE times for doing it and always in the same general hunting area.

Mayo should do a study to determine if deer hunters in MN possess a selective "stupid gene" or whether they think laws are made for lesser beings.

Got me stumped.

[Musky Buck]

I read that ufatz, I talked to a CO who busted a Brainerd guy with a trophy buck shot over apples,corn,sunflower seed pile, he said this buck is nothing compared to the one I shot last year over bait. Bait works well apparently or it can, but this pumpkin story seems a bit out of hand. I have to decide on a baiter and if I want them to go down or not, I have permission for rifle, found empty bags of shell corn under his stand this rifle season, I know one year they decimated our area by taking 20 antlerless deer out of there over bait, thing is all these guys can afford hunts in Canada, Montana, Colorado, drive $50,000 rigs, own a meat company but still bait so I think there's actually different genre's these people fit into. These guys fit into the game hog category. How bold to just leave the bags in the woods. I have to go to the farmer and tell him I can't hunt your land unless these guys quit baiting. Anyway, hey it's Happy Thanksgiving time guys ! Here's to looking forward to a promising 2012 deer season pending winter, time to go scout for next year and see what I could've done better.

[Beast26]

I read that ufatz, I talked to a CO who busted a Brainerd guy with a trophy buck shot over apples,corn,sunflower seed pile, he said this buck is nothing compared to the one I shot last year over bait. Bait works well apparently or it can, but this pumpkin story seems a bit out of hand. I have to decide on a baiter and if I want them to go down or not, I have permission for rifle, found empty bags of shell corn under his stand this rifle season, I know one year they decimated our area by taking 20 antlerless deer out of there over bait, thing is all these guys can afford hunts in Canada, Montana, Colorado, drive $50,000 rigs, own a meat company but still bait so I think there's actually different genre's these people fit into. These guys fit into the game hog category. How bold to just leave the bags in the woods. I have to go to the farmer and tell him I can't hunt your land unless these guys quit baiting. Anyway, hey it's Happy Thanksgiving time guys ! Here's to looking forward to a promising 2012 deer season pending winter, time to go scout for next year and see what I could've done better.

So you too have master baiters in your area? That sucks

[TRZ II]

MuskyBuck-Take'em down!!!!

[Musky Buck]

It really saddens me some, I know these guys and looked up to them as father like figures really growing up, but now there sons are doing it and I wonder if on their own hunting land up north if they do this during rifle season, I hope not. I saw 1 of them last year, outdoor news with a monster rifle buck and thought I hope his belly isn't full of corn, there is 0 corn where they rifle hunt. I figured with tags going from 5 to 2 that they'd quit baiting, that didn't happen, I wondered why they'd drive their 4 wheeler down the fields edge before bow hunting, no need to, now I know, 300 pounds of shell corn doesn't carry to easily. They have a game hog mentality and I can't believe at the age they are that they haven't grown out of it. I also can't believe they'd leave empty shell corn bags under their stands when they know I have to walk by 2 of the stands to get to mine. This pumpkin story is kinda very opposite of what these guys are all about, that's why I think there's categories of baiters and this pumpkin story to me is different and bizarre. Thanksgiving tomorrow and I think I must talk to the farmer first and just let him know and go from there, once I saw the corn bags on my walk out, I didn't notice the bags in the dark as I was just trying to carefully walk into my area, I didn't know how long the corn had been mopped up so I decided to not hunt there, with my luck a CO would've showed up and sir what can you tell me about these corn bags, even when the farmer plants 160 acres of corn they still carry the bagged stuff in. I'd hate to know how many deer they get over bait, it's been a lot I'm guessing and now the ? are they even tagging all of them comes to mind.

[Jameson]

I need some green manure on my food plot. Anyone have have any pumpkins?

This story reminded me of what I did last year. I saw the neighbor throwing out their pumpkins after Halloween and asked if I could have them. Than they sat in a garbage can till after I was done muzzy hunting. After that I dumped them on my food plot. Sure was easy to avoid any gray area for me, but I guess I was the dummy.

Maybe we would have all been served better if the CO in this case would have just chalked it up to normal farming practice? Maybe not?

[Beast26]

I need some green manure on my food plot. Anyone have have any pumpkins?

This story reminded me of what I did last year. I saw the neighbor throwing out their pumpkins after Halloween and asked if I could have them. Than they sat in a garbage can till after I was done muzzy hunting. After that I dumped them on my food plot. Sure was easy to avoid any gray area for me, but I guess I was the dummy.

Maybe we would have all been served better if the CO in this case would have just chalked it up to normal farming practice? Maybe not?

I am guessing you don't farm pumpkins and don't have thousands left over after October 31st? GeWhat doe you suggest this guy does with him left over pumpkins? Leave them in the field, in his front yard? Wouldn't that still be baiting? aJust sauin...

[Jameson]

You do now you didn't state anything? Just asked questions. Just sayin....

Lighten up folks

Back to the serious business of the internet.......

[Big Dave2]

I still have yet to see one GOOD reason why deer baiting should be illegal in the first place.

In my opinion, the concern of spreading diseases is an invalid reason because recreational deer feeding is still allowed. If there is such a concern about deer spreading diseases through close quarters feeding then I would think ANY feeding of deer should be outlawed.

The other reason I read about all the time is hunters are concerned about "fair-chase". That reason is also a joke. If we are concerned about the fair chase of deer then why are we allowed to use elevated stands, high powered rifles, high powered scopes, spotting scopes, trail cameras, scents, mineral blocks, calls, decoys, scent killer, scent locker suits and the list goes on and on of the high tech gadgetry that we are allowed to use to kill deer. If anyone thinks that using any of the items I have listed provides for a true "fair-chase" hunt, in my humble opinion they are mistaken.

[deerminator]

I agree. Ethics schmethics. So why can you bait bears? Because you're more successful in doing so of course!!! So why not deer? Don't get me wrong, so long as its illegal here, I won't do it, but if it is ever legal, I'll try it to see what results I'd get. I might try a crossbow too if they ever made it straight out legal during archery season. I like to hunt,period. I doubt early Native Americans or settlers ever worried about ethics or debated fair chase while trying to get that deer or buffalo. I'm not concerned with those either. What's legal is ethical I say. I hope they do legalize baiting in Minnesota some year. Would be interesting to see the results. Wisconsin and the other states that allow it seem to be doing better than us in terms of quality and quantity of deer taken!

[jay83196]

Good points all!

[Boar]

Baiting bear in MN is the only way to effectivly control the population. It garenties nothing. Same as baiting deer it garenties nothing, it ups the odds yes. bear dont leave srapes or rubs to indicate travel or area of usage, we dont hunt the bear rut which is in late may or june, unless u actually go out an spend time looking for sighn of bear you hardly never see them. they have have completely different habvits than deer that would be very hard pattern if it wasnt the use of bait. A mature boar can have a range of up to 250 miles. Try pattering that. i think the tterm ethical is different in its meaning for many, Try hound hunting fore bear, is that ethical? certainly not here in MN. but its legal in WI an many other states an as far as their traditions of bear hunting go its ethical.

If there was another way other than baiting bear to effectivly contoll the population an put one in my freezer then id do it. Spot an stalk yes I could do it, but now your talking a whole other game an your odds of taking one are greatly diminished.I understand that wen one thinks of baiting bear we just throw out some bait an boom dead bear, "how can you call that ethical" i make clean kills an my bear is dead on its feet. ethical. If one thinks thats all that invloved in bear bating, Crib site, place bait, shoot bear. yea what ever... Two words for ya, Try it. Fair chase? Man it took five weeks of back humping bating to ethicaly kill my bear, that was an long chase.

[NoWiser]

I think all you "pro- baiters" need to tune in to VS channel this weekend and watch a few south Texas whitetail hunts. Is that what you want Minnesota to turn into? That's not hunting, it's glorified target practice on a live animal. Any step, no matter how small, in that direction is a step in the WRONG direction. Go pay a farmer to shoot one of his cows in the pasture if that's what you want. There is such great hunting all over this state if you are just willing to work a little for it. Anybody who wants to bait is just plain being lazy in my opinion.

As far as the story at hand, don't known what to say. If it truly was placed that way for farming purposes, then he should probably be let off. I believe he purposely placed the pumpkins in a way that could be construed as baiting because he wanted a ticket. Field too wet? Come on, this was the driest fall that I can remember. I say save court costs, let him off, use the money saved to clarify the regulations, and nail him next year if he tries to pull something again.

Well, it's time to get cooking for Thanksgiving. I hope you all have a safe, and enjoyable one. This year I'm thankful to live in a state where you don't need to own land to enjoy an endless amount of hunting and fishing opportunities.

[TRZ II]

NoWiser hit it on the head. Baiters are lazy slobs who don't want to work for their deer. We have so much public land that isn't even hunted in this state. If you want great deer hunting you can work and find it. If you just want meat but a half cow. I would rather shoot a fawn in a fair chase than shoot a trophy buck over a corn pile!

[jay83196]

Wow...if you don't approve of something don't do it, I realize the legality aspect and breaking the law in MN but being legal in other states makes that statement just ignorant, and others shouldn't be condemned just because you don't approve, like I said just don't do it and you can sleep at night knowing your just and not a "lazy slob" good for you...

[Big Dave2]

NoWiser hit it on the head. Baiters are lazy slobs who don't want to work for their deer. We have so much public land that isn't even hunted in this state. If you want great deer hunting you can work and find it. If you just want meat but a half cow. I would rather shoot a fawn in a fair chase than shoot a trophy buck over a corn pile!

I'd rather be lazy than arrogant.

I still have not heard ONE GOOD REASON why baiting should be illegal. All I hear is that some people don't like it. I don't like Kareoke, should we make that illegal?

If you want to convince me, come up with an actual reason.

[TonkaBass]

I personally wouldn't bait. I however am all for baiting. Maybe it would bring more deer in front of peoples stands and they would hold off for a trophy instead of killing all the fork horns. The "brown its down" mentality in MN is unreal! I cant understand why people would pass on a doe to shoot the spike behind her. Its an orange army of people with guns, not hunters IMHO. If you travel in any direction, Dakotas, Iowa, Wisconsin, or Canada, the deer hunting gets way better! We have all the habitat here, but the majority of people who hunt MN think a big buck is a bonus, they'll take any deer. Baiting is far less of an issue than the other. If MN would make it illegal to shoot deer under 120" I would be all for it! That's the real issue here. BTW, is it not fair for me to bait for sheds? lol