Who says?!?!?!

[pike doctor]

Keep up the good work guys! I am a firm believer that they destroy lakes.

[Gordie]

that lake seems to be dead anyway pike doctor

thats a whole lotta carp floating their also

[MJ1657]

I might have to give that a try it looks like alot of fun. I have saw some big carp pike spearing this winter.

[ac777]

That is just our little pond jumper. We have a couple other boats as well.. 90% of our fish are shot at night. Unless winter fishing.

Trap man, does that platform ever seem top heavy as in close to being tipped when standing on it? I would like to build one on my john boat, but dont want it tipping on me.

[leech~~]

Holly Carp Batman! You guys are out there! You need to get a hold of Mrs Paul. I think she could use some more fish stick meat!

[TrapMan13]

I easily shoot 4 people on the front of that boat. It is a 1652. The platform also is made out of all aluminum exept the wood top so it isnt to heavy. I can lift it myself. Plus I gutted out all of my lights and put the ballasts and ignitors in a remote box located in the rear of my boat in the back bench. I also have everything in that boat balanced very well. Which really helps.

[bassNspear]

talk about building a carp machine. Sweet looking rig!

[TrapMan13]

To anyone that doesn't know much about the sport or wants to know more. I recommend you check out the llba (Land of Lakes Bowfishing Assocation)

Thanks!

Chad

[leakywaders]

Hey, I'm just curious whether or not you guys know that buffalo, redhorse and suckers are native to MN?

Carp are not native, as most know, and can be destructive, but buffalo and the sucker species are nothing but beneficial and belong in our local ecosystems.

I've really got no beef with bowfishing, especially for carp, but it seems wasteful to shoot a bunch of suckers and buffalo just to bury them in a garden.

So, how do you justify shooting all those buffalo and suckers?

[Gordie]

leakywaders I think that lake was haveing a winter kill I'm not sure but if you look at the pics you can see dead fish floating in one or two of them. So I'm guessing that its having a winter kill.

[carpmanjake]

hey trapman, where did you get all those carp? i want to get out and fish for some carp (rod and reel)

if you dont want to share online, my email is [email protected]

thanks in advance

[mrklean]

what did you do with all of those? I saw you had an axe in your hand????

[TrapMan13]

Jake, Give me a call... 3202500917. I dont have a problem giving my spot out to fellow carper. We will be heading back there thursday I believe as well.

Chad

[broken_line]

yes the lake was having a winter kill and i came back after the ice had thickened with the skid loader. and now they are all sitting in a manure spreader waiting for spring. my buddie was trying to make the hole bigger with the axe.

[Jmnhunter]

hey leaky, taking buffalo along with other suckers pose no threat to their populations as they reproduce rapidly; grow radily: and are a hardy fish as with the carp.

for a bowfisherman to take out 10,50,75 or more from a lake is peanuts to what the population is.

[leakywaders]

Jmnhunter,

I don't think what you say is always the case. For one, carp compete with buffalo for food and habitat. I can see carp everywhere, but where carp and buffalo co-exist, there are far fewer buffalo.

Also, there are certain species of redhorse that are not very abundant, less abundant than say, walleye. These are the River and Greater redhorse.

Also, the blue sucker is, I believe, a "threatened" species and should not even be taken by hook and line. Would you know a blue sucker if you shot one?

Again, I am not against bowfishing. What I am for is treating our native fishes with greater respect than we do the invasive species such as carp.

I would have more respect for the sport of bowfishing if bowfishers would show more restraint when it comes to native rough fish. Do we really need to kill redhorse, suckers and buffalo, just to fertilize a garden?

Putting fish that will otherwise just rot on the bank to good use, as in the winterkilled lake scenario, I can understand.

leakywaders

[broken_line]

buffalo may be native! BUT! do you like catching crappie, walleyes or catfish? the buffalo in the lake i pulled em out of. eat the fishes eggs and destroy i mean DESTROY! the natural vegitation in a small lake, so i really have no respect to any rough fish other than bullheads...

[eyehead]

Nice shootin guys!!! Keep up the good work and get rid of em all.

[Jmnhunter]

leaky,

in lakes i've bowfished that held carp and buffalo was nearly 1:1, some lakes are dominated by buffs and others by carp -again they are one of the hardiest freshwater fish.

although they maybe native, they are still in the sucker family, meaning uprooting vegetation=poor water quality; you can compare aerial photos before and after sucker species enter the water --even bullheads/fatheads (sorry broken line).

populations need to be controlled somehow and again they grow in reproduces in high numbers. Alot of bowfishermen smoke/can buffs not all goes to producing state record tomatoes

[leakywaders]

Jmn,

That's interesting info, I'll have to check it out.

leakywaders

[leakywaders]

I have found out some good info regarding native suckers and buffalo vs. water quality. Briefly:

-Bigmouth buffalo are filter feeders,they do not feed on the bottom or uproot vegetation. "They are actually beneficial to vegetation because they remove suspended algae and plankton and increase the transparency of the water" (Becker, 1983)

So, when you shoot a bigmouth buffalo, you are taking out a fish that is very beneficial to the ecosystem!

-"Smallmouth buffalo do not inhabit shallow lakes in any significant numbers. They live in flowing waters. They do feed on the bottom but there is no evidence that they have ever had a negative effect on aquatic vegetation, as they do not have the same extended, rooting mouth structure and feeding behavior as carp."

- Other sucker species that have absolutely no negative impact on aquatic vegetation include Blue Suckers, Hog Sucker, all species of Redhorses, Black Buffalos, and Carpsuckers.

-White suckers, black bullheads, carp, and fathead minnows indeed DO have negative impacts on the vegetation in wetlands and shallow lakes. However, white suckers and fathead minnows do not survive hard winters in shallow lakes and wetlands, and are only found in such areas when they are intentionally stocked into them by people, for profit. The majority of wetlands and shallow lakes "damaged" by white suckers and fatheads are, in fact, being intentionally used for aquaculture purposes (the bait industry).

And, finally,:

-"Modern aquatic biology rates the health of aquatic ecosystems using the IBI score (it stands for Index of Biotic Integrity). There are dozens of scientific papers out there describing different methods of scoring ecosystems in Minnesota and elsewhere. Briefly, lakes and streams with high IBI scores are healthy ecosystems, and those with low IBI scores are damaged, degraded, or polluted. One of the most common scores for IBI is the number of "simple lithophilic spawners", which is a fancy name for native sucker species. So, in short, DNR biologists specifically count the number of native sucker species in lakes and streams in order to tell how healthy they are."

All the above info can be verified through the MNDNR.

I stand by my conviction that native species of "roughfish" should not be shot in mass numbers just for garden fertilizer or just because they are fun to shoot.

There are plenty of destructive carp around to provide plenty of shooting action while leaving the native species alone. Shoot a buffalo or redhorse to eat? YES! But in reality, how often is this the case?

I have to add this, just so you know that I'm not anti-bowfishing: I have close relatives and friends who love bowfishing and shoot a ton of carp every summer. I discuss this issue with as well. Also, I hope to try bowfishing this upcoming season. I was hoping to last year, but never got the chance. If I shoot a buffalo, it will end up on my table.

leakywaders

[Jmnhunter]

Leaky,

after learning that buffs are part of the sucker family, most would conclude that they are bottom feeders, but with your data that points out that is not true; so linking buffalo and poor water quality is just not true.

But shooting quantities of buffs still will "have no danger of overharvest (MN DNR)" due to their large population growth --this is my main argument about using them as fertilizer most of the time while keeping a few for the smoker, as they grow and reproduce so fast.

[leakywaders]

Jmn,

While I disagree with your reasons for shooting them, I guess I can't argue the point about there being no danger of over harvest...of buffalo.

Here's to spring!

[Muskiefool]

That is awesome; I really have to get out with one of you guys this summer and pound away at some Carp, I figure a guy could Muskie fish after your fingers get sore from lettin'em fly lol.

Interesting info on the Buffalo, I assumed they were tearing at the bottom alongside the Carp.

[HorseshoeChain]

This is maybe slightly off topic, but hopefully not too much.

I just learned, from a fisheries biologist, that catfish often eat, out-compete, and basically displace bullheads. He stated that bullheads are detrimental to most lakes, and that they cause water quality problems due to their rooting around. They also cause higher algae growth by "recycling phosphorous" in the water.

Catfish also are generally preferred by anglers because they get bigger, fight harder, and taste better. And, they don't have any more negative effects on the other species than the bullheads would.

-I probably should've posted this in the catfish forum. Those guys would love me for it!