Permanent Deer Stands on Public land

[northman]

I agree and I to never hunted off a deer stand I did not make. However, there is another side to it where it would be ok for someone to do so. What if the hunter died, quit hunting the area, moved a half a mile a way and built 1 or more new deer stands. thus that deer stand is now abandoned. That makes it open to anyone. It would take a while to figure out that it is abandoned. You just can't walk up to it and say to yourself. Well, no one is on it, I guess its abandoned? If snow is on the ground and you see no human activity on it all deer season. Then take it over next year. something like that. I guess if someone makes 4 deer stands and can only hunt on one at a time. then maybe just maybe. You should ethically have the right to hunt on one of the other 3, If you could figure out that is, that, that is exactly what was going on. there seems to be too many if ands or buts when it comes to deer stands and hunting terriority on public land. All I can say, is that before I ever put up a stand. I walked all around the area 50 or more yards away in a circle and looked to see if another stand was up and too close. Heck, even if we all have good ethical practices, we can still accidently cause a problem between one hunting party and another. Especially if the new party that moved into an area for the first time. A party of 8 people will want to jump into a pretty large area and build 8 or more stands. then the party that has been there for a long time. show up and say what the heck is this? this is not going to be easy to solve.

[Benny]

Yep that would be acting like one, but so is taking a deer stand that you didn't put up just because the law said you can.

If it was near crimnal why then did the CO tell me that he couldn't do any thing about the guy who sat right above me on the mine dump, facing me and shooting at any deer or anything he thought was a deer?

This guy knew I was there after his first few shots as I walked down to where he could see me clearly.I yelled to him that I was only about 50 to 75 yards away right directly in front of him.

All I got was (F) you I can hunt any where I want,its public property!!!!

This guy was there every single day, and never came out till 5 minutes before shooting time because he could drive right up to the edge of the bank.

The CO said he could not do any thing unless the guy shot at me, threatened me, or started pounding on pans to scare the deer away!

He was legaly on public land with a valid deer license and was not at the time sitting on his truck with his gun across his lap when the CO checked him.

He was about 75 yards away and maybe 20 or so feet above me, facing right at me the whole time.

He was taking 400 to 450 yard shots at deer crossing the dump down by where my brother was sitting.

My brother shoots a 7mm mag and is proficient with it, but he wouldn't have tried that shot.

The CO checked him every morning, for three days, I think the CO watched him for the first day as well.But he wouldn't tell me any details other than the guy was legal.

Now you tell me what is wrong with this whole public land deal.

That right there is a prime example as to why we need to educate the public better.

My familly has hunted the same woods for three generations, and next year my daughter will make it four gens to hunt it.

Benny

[Benny]

Yes that is what the book said word for word.

BUT, read my post above.

I did call the CO and was told it isn't harassment unless you can prove there is harassment.I.E pounding on pans or yelling all the way around a person, or threatning the hunter.

Benny

[Benny]

You are absolutly right, if some one abandones a stand even if it is for a few years it should be considered fair game.

And I have experianced a new party moving in on us.The land used to be private, but the two older brothers who owned it didn't want to pay the taxs any longer as it had been many many years since any one lived on the property.

So the county took it over and now they want market value for land the loggers took half the trees off of.

But any way, this past year we had a group move in on us.

They had three hunters line up along the top of the mine dump above us, effectively shuting down any chance the deer could get down into the valley where we hunt.

They then had two roamers work the woods up to the dump, from the field beyond where we have our stands built.(only one is a permanent the other two are portable)

When I confronted the guy right above me , he was all attitude and said (F) off it is public property.

If you read my post above I go into detail about that guy.

But there wouldn't have been any problems if they would have simply not came back after they found out we were hunting the same woods.

These people were locals up there so they had no excuse about not knowing the area and not being able to find another spot to hunt.

Benny

[lawdog]

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But there wouldn't have been any problems if they would have simply not came back after they found out we were hunting the same woods.

These people were locals up there so they had no excuse about not knowing the area and not being able to find another spot to hunt.

Benny

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There also wouldn't have been any problems if YOU didn't go back because YOU ALSO KNEW SOMEONE ELSE WAS HUNTING THERE! Why should they leave and you get to stay??? They have as much right to hunt there as you do don't they???? Isn't it PUBLIC land??? You see, you too sir are a part of the problem...

[lawdog]

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Yep that would be acting like one, but so is taking a deer stand that you didn't put up just because the law said you can.

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No, putting up the perm stand on public ground illegally is the unethical part. Sitting in something that's by law public can't be unethical.

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If it was near crimnal why then did the CO tell me that he couldn't do any thing about the guy who sat right above me on the mine dump, facing me and shooting at any deer or anything he thought was a deer?

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What you described and what he did are very different facts. Also, you don't grasp the difference between what is illegal and what they can show to the court to be illegal. Reality is they are a little different.

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He was taking 400 to 450 yard shots at deer crossing the dump down by where my brother was sitting.

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Sounds like a slob hunter. That's a different issue than perm stands on public ground though.

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My familly has hunted the same woods for three generations, and next year my daughter will make it four gens to hunt it.

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Hope you realize those guys will be there again as they have a right to be. And I sure hope you don't wrongly try to tell generation #4 how she has some right to be on this public ground that is somehow superior to the rights of the others who want to hunt it.

[Bubbadust]

Alright, what is "CCW"?

[bigbucks]

I'm guessing & of course you other guys know the answer for sure, but I'm going to say some acronym for a conceal to carry permit. Perhaps the W is for weapon, but I don't know that.

Am I close at least?

[Eric Wettschreck]

Let's not lower ourselves to the point of conceal and carry while deer hunting. Even though I'm not for permanent stuff on public land, I'm even more against that poor of sportsmanship.

[Giant_Jackpot]

Conceal Carry

[duckbuster]

Let me start by saying I am not a deer hunter. Grouse and ducks are my game. Reading these post though about deer stands I want to throw something out to those of you who believe that if you build a stand on public land it is your stand for eternity.

There are 3 duck spots in our bay to hunt, a creek, a river and a point. There are 3 groups of hunters in our bay. One group has always hunted the creek, one has always hunted the river and we have always hunted the point. We stay away from there spots and they leave ours alone.

Over time our blind has become very, very nice, we have also dug some pits as well. About 4 years ago a group of 3 hunters bought a very run down shack tucked away in the corner of the bay. Since that time in order for us to hunt the point we need to get over there 2-3 hours before shooting. These guys have all but ruined this point because they cut down almost every tree on the point. There is hardly a piece of cover behind us now to conceal us from birds coming from behind the point.

With all this being said I now have to ask this question.

Do we have the right to say, hey we have hunted this blind for X amount of years, now go and try to hunt some where else?

Obviously the answer is NO.

So my next question is, what's the difference between a permanent duck blind and a permanent deer stand, both of which sit on public land?

[Jackpine Rob]

Reading through this thread makes me sad, and more than a little concerned. It seems like there are a substantial number of folks out there who are more concerned with "getting their fair share" than in respect for the sport, respect for fellow hunters, and respect for themselves.

The guy who creates an eyesore of a stand, cutting marketable timber for shooting lanes and destroying public property in the process does our sport no good. He is a slob who lacks respect for the resource, and reflects poorly on all of us. Those who destroy marketable timber belonging to the public should be confronted and made to pay for the destruction.

I have never hunted out of a permanent stand on public property, but have consistently respected the fellows who do so. Several friends and relatives have permanent stands on County and State lands, and they are unobtrusive, but seem to get the job done. If I know a stand hunter is around, why limit both of our chances of success and risk a confrontation? Doing so is foolish, in my book.

Likewise, the fellow who climbs up in a stand that someone spent time and energy in constructing and is obviously being used hurts us as well. While legally he may have a right to do so - just because something is legal doesn't necessarily make it ethical or right. Think for a minute about the guy who shows up at the duck pond, sees you and your decoys and sets up right next to you. Is that right or good or respectful? I think not.

Growing up I was taught that when someone else was fishing a reef we wanted to hit, we simply went somewhere else. If someone was duck hunting a rice bed, we went somewhere else. If someone was known to deer hunt a stretch of woods, we went somewhere else. If a pickup truck was parked at a trailhead during partridge season - yep, we went somewhere else.

It is the current crop of "its my right" lunatics who hurt the outdoors community in ways both big and small. For the individual whose hunt or fishing trip they disrupt or ruin the pain is very real. The legacy of many such little pains leads to efforts to legislate, regulate, etc., and gives sportsmen as a whole a black eye.

It all comes down to respect. Not "concealed carry" or childish "I'm gonna get you" tactics.

[Eric Wettschreck]

Duckbuster, my opinion, there is no difference. Permanent is permanent whether it's a duck blind or a deer stand.

I know where you're coming from when you say there are others that ruined your favorite spot. It's happened to me also and it's extremely frustrating. That's the price we pay for hunting public land. I'm just glad there is public land to hunt.

[FOOT]

Quite simply put - IT SHOULD BE ILLEGAL TO PLACE, BUILD OR INSTALL A PERMANENT STAND ON PUBLIC LAND.

There is no difference in not being able to put a permanent deer stand on public land and not being able to build, place or install a private waterfowl blind or leave your decoys overnight on public water.

It is illegal to "save" your spot while waterfowl hunting by putting up a blind or leaving your decoys overnight so why not a deer stand?

As a hunting community we MUST respect the other

individual(s) when it comes to them "beating" us to our prime hunting spot. I have lost out several times. It didn't make me happy, I was just more committed to gettting their earlier the next morning. I've also beaten the other guy several times and have had only one altercation where he felt just because he had scouted out the area he deserved first choice. I also scouted the area for several weeks prior to the season.

Show the other hunter respect, if he gets there first he wins you lose. Buck up and quit your cryin

[Benny]

There also wouldn't have been any problems if YOU didn't go back because YOU ALSO KNEW SOMEONE ELSE WAS HUNTING THERE! Why should they leave and you get to stay??? They have as much right to hunt there as you do don't they???? Isn't it PUBLIC land??? You see, you too sir are a part of the problem...

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You didn't read the post all the way through did you?

I said these people were locals and new my familly has hunted the same woods for many years.

Now why would I want to give up the spot my family has hunted for 3 generations just because a slob hunter moved in and was hiding behind a stupid law that says he can hunt the same woods as other people who have been there for years and years.

And it was not always public land, we hunted that land since the 20's and the owners never let it go back till the late 90's.

The point I want to get across is that the law is not a very good one.

Just like the law that says motorist must stop for people stepping off the side walk into a cross walk.

These people who think the law is for them to have a free pass to jump right out into oncomming traffic and expect everyone to slam on thier brakes and stop so they can cross the street are the first ones to sue if they get hit.

Can your SUV stop from 45 mph to avoid some (Contact US Regarding This Word) who walks right out in front of you just because the law said he can?

Same with this law about how the woods are public property and any one can just walk right in and hunt next to some one else who may or may not have spent many years scouting and patterning the deer.

It sets up an unsafe invinment for everyone, as you might be the safist hunter out there and never shoot at just any thing.

But your bullet might exit the deer and travel that 75 yards to hit the other guy whom you didn't know was there.

Benny

[Benny]

"CCW" means consealed carry weapon!Besure to read my resind note as it was not apropriate for me to make that statement the way I did.

I was assuming the other person was threatning me by shooting at me or pointing his/her weapon at me.

I didn't realize it would sound so bad as the way it did.

Thanks, Benny

[Benny]

((((No, putting up the perm stand on public ground illegally is the unethical part. Sitting in something that's by law public can't be unethical.)))

The one and only permanent stand we have was there since the early 1980's.It was built on 4x4 stilts burryed in the ground a foot.We could move it if we wanted to or are made to.

My dad hunts on the ground as do I, he has an inclosure that looks permanet but is just sitting ontop of the ground on a ridge.

I sit in an office chair on a differant ridge next to the mine dump.You wouldn't even see it in the summer, unless you just happend to walk that ridge.

And all these stands or spots were picked out way before the land went back to the county, so it was legal to build them when we did.

So what was so unethical about that?

I agree that NOW, it would be wrong to build any more stands that can't be moved out each year.

((((What you described and what he did are very different facts. Also, you don't grasp the difference between what is illegal and what they can show to the court to be illegal. Reality is they are a little different.))))

Ok , explain to me what is so differant.

He knew that there were people who hunt the woods below,he also knows that the deer travel along the bank as do I.

What is the diffeance between him sitting only 75 yards away from me and shooting in my direction than me sitting 75 yards away from some one who took the stand I built , and me shooting at a deer I saw before he did?

Yes the guy and most of his family are slob hunters, they have been driving around in thier trucks and ATV's up on top of that mine road for years.They have been caught a few times with loaded rifles in the truck as well.

They are the very image of a road hunter that the general public sees.

((((Hope you realize those guys will be there again as they have a right to be. And I sure hope you don't wrongly try to tell generation #4 how she has some right to be on this public ground that is somehow superior to the rights of the others who want to hunt it.

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)))))

No I won't be telling her any thing differant than what is right to teach her.

I would rather have her walk away from some slob then try and hunt next to them.

I will let her know that it is her right now to hunt any where she wants on public land, but to move on if some one else shows up to hunt there as well.

Benny

[Benny]

I am sorry if my ranting has taken us away from the issue here.

So I will try not to stray any more.

My point of vew right now is that public land IS open to every one, BUT we need to teach the others that just because it is legal for them to hunt a section of woods on public land doesn't mean they should try and foil the other person out of a good spot.

As for permanent stands on that land, I don't see a problem with having a SEMI permanent stand.Some thing that can be removed at the end of the season.

But since the general public has finaly started to venture out and see the condos that some one built out there, we need to elimanate the preseption that every hunter has a permanent stand just like that one.

If that involves doing away with any permanent stand, then we will have to sacrafic for the greater good.

Benny

[Mark Christianson]

I cant digest that much typing Benny.

Ban the stand.

[Benny]

"LOL"

My fingers hurt from all the typing .

Benny

[dkhntr]

Taken out of the hunting regs for State forests.

STATE FORESTS

State forest lands are generally open for hunting and other types of outdoor recreation. Hunting on private land within a state forest is subject to state trespass laws. A partial summary of state forest use regulations is included below. A complete listing is available from the DNR.

Elevated Scaffolds

• The use of portable tree stands is recommended, especially those which can be secured without driving nails into trees. Nails are a safety hazard for woodcutters and harm the forest. Personal property must be removed from State Forest lands. It is illegal to destroy state property, including the cutting of trees of four inches or more

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1502_001_140 7/7/04 10:05 AM Page 129 Public Lands & Wildlife Refuges in diameter at four and one-half feet above the ground for shooting lanes. Littering and erecting permanent buildings are prohibited.

TIP: TO REPORT GAME AND FISH LAW VIOLATIONS, CALL 24 HOURS A DAY 1-800-652-9093

I dont know guys, kinda spells it out for me. What do you think. This isnt new either. Is it talking about ANY stand.

[Benny]

And your point is what?

Those laws are for STATE LAND only, my party hunts county land!

It still may not make it right to build a huge monstosity of a stand, but it is leagal to build one there as far as I know.

And again I repeat, we really don't have any stand that is NAILED to a tree.All of ours can be moved at any time.

And where did you copy that second quote from?

I think it was to read that you can't CUT TREES that are more that 4 and 1/2 inches in diameter at least 4 feet above the ground.

BUT you can cut any thing smaller than that as per the LAW.

Now I do not mean to say that any one SHOULD cut the trees at all, leave them be, just trim the branches back a little.

You don't need a 10 foot wide path to shoot a deer, if it is on the run or fast walk you shouldn't shoot at it any way.

Benny

[fivebucks]

I am not in favor of banning permanant stands completely but would like to see some restrictions like platform size and no sides. I like Perpich's article in Outdoor News this past issue. He raises some good points that I agree with.

[WB make the CUT]

Jackpine Rob

We have a bingo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[The_Duckslayer]

WOW what a lot of writing! I guess if I had a perm stand I would be on the side to keep them. If I hunted an area that had perm stands in them that were not mine I would be against them. Since I currently don't fit either catagory I guess I will sit the fence. I guess if I were to lean it would be to the side that wants them pulled out. It is after all, public land. Then again I am no spring chicken any longer and if I did not have to lug a temp stand in and out every day that would be great! Hmmmm Things that make ya go Hmmmm. Take care and N Joy the Hunt././Jimbo