Northern pike regulations to change on 15 lakes

[OnAFly]

Jameson, do you believe that pike fishing (in any form) would be better if there were no DNR length regulations?

[Jameson]

...If you choose to spear than you are limited to killing only....

photo are possible, too. This muskie was 100% unharmed by my spear.

[Jameson]

Jameson, do you believe that pike fishing (in any form) would be better if there were no DNR length regulations?

No. Look at one of my first posts in this thread. I suggested lowering the one over 30 rule to one over 26, and one over 35 per year.

cjac, I was trying for the double hat trick just for you. It is tough to do these days.

[john skarie]

Educating myself?

I think my degree in fisheries gives me enough education to have an opinion on DNR regulations and how effective they are or aren't.

Your thoughts on how to regulate pike are completely unfounded and would be an enforcement nightmare.

JS

[OnAFly]

For 1 over 26" and 1/yr over 35: I don't think a solution to the reduction of the "large" pike population involving reducing the "large" pike population makes sense.

In an earlier post you wrote, "We could eliminate hook and line harvest of pike to start."

You would be in favor of catch and release only, but not in favor of the current slot limit? This doesn't make sense either.

[Jameson]

For 1 over 26" and 1/yr over 35: I don't think a solution to the reduction of the "large" pike population involving reducing the "large" pike population makes sense.

In an earlier post you wrote, "We could eliminate hook and line harvest of pike to start."

You would be in favor of catch and release only, but not in favor of the current slot limit? This doesn't make sense either.

facepalm

....

It's been fun wallowing in the mud with y'all.

I don't seem to enjoy it as much as some.

Time to go work on the new icehouse.

I drastically reduced my time spent hook and lining years ago after killing too many fish on accident.

Thankfully, y'all have shown me quick strike rigs.

The new house hopefully will be going out on Tonka.

Hope to see y'all out there this winter.

Even you cjac!

[cjac]

Hell yeah Jameson!

I'd love to look and release a bunch of those nice 10lb+ class pike that swim in 'tonka and maybe see a few muskies too over the course of the season. Those situations do make for some cool photo shoots like the pic you posted.

We could take a few of the low 20 inch class fish on occasion for pickling and help establish an even better Esocid population on the lake, establishing a better fishery, albeit one lake at a time.

I'm stone-cold serious, I'm willing to bet we could have a fun time and positive conversation in your new shack, even with what could be considered a lethal weapon, that being a spear, in our hands.

Point being: it's time to remove the legislature and uneducated and ill-informed politicians from these discussions and let the groups in question hash it out.... Oh yeah, the DNR needs a collective seat in the shack with us too out on 'tonka. I hope you're building a big shack!

[Jameson]

Thanks cjac.

We've butted heads on here before. I've kinda figured it was because we were more alike than different.

The shack should seat 3 maybe 4 comfortably. Fire up the old wood stove, and look through the big hole. I have a hard time going back to an 8" hole. So, even though I plan on putting the house on a spearing-ban lake, it's gonna have a sight fishing hole. Another lake will have my spearshack for when I need that fix.

Politicians in my shack. Oh brother.

[RK]

Hiya -

Jameson - if the hole's big enough, you could stuff any number of politicians down it I suppose Maybe a cold swim will wake them up a little. Prolly times when it'd do me some good.

Time for this conversation to take a complete left turn, because I'm curious and can't help myself....

Jameson - cool pic of the muskie. Imagine you see a few in the hole now and then. Two questions: are they at all predictable, and can you get them to respond to either a live or artificial decoy?

Here's why I ask. There used to be a farmer who lived by me that put a fishhouse out on a muskie lake nearby. He'd spear some (I speared with him a few times actually) but mainly angled out of a spear hole just because he thought fish watching was fun. He's the one that got me calling a spearing hole "The Norwegian TV set". Mainly he was just getting out of the house and away from his wife, who was a total warthog - but that's neither here nor there...

Anyhow... He was bound and determined to catch a muskie through the ice, and he tried all kinds of stuff. A couple shiners with a big decoy sucker in the middle was something he did a lot. I don't know that he ever got many, but he did say two interesting things: One was that some fish, you could dang near set your watch by when they'd come through the hole. Same fish, same time, every day for days at a time. Second, was that he could pull muskies up behind a live decoy so far that their heads would actually be almost in the hole.

Ever seen one often enough to make you think you're seeing the same fish at consistent times? And, ever play with one and get it to follow something up like he described? Cuz...that'd be cool to see.

[Esox_Magnum]

Rob, as someone who sight fishes alot on muskie waters some days we see the same fish several times a day, sometimes they will just lay near our baits to annoy us. Sometimes we may go weeks without seeing any then all of a sudden 1 day you'll see 3-4 fish and see them several tmes a day. We never try to entice them though, cool to look at for a minute then we want them gone so we can get back to catching supper. I have seen them smoke a bass, try and eat the gill on my line, try eating the wifes fish camera and seen them 30 feet away while we were hammering gills/perch and they just layed there for hours.

One winter we did frequently see the same 3 fish roaming together but only that 1 year, one was upper 40"/50" range one around 40" and the 3rd was a low 30" fish but if you saw 1 you saw all 3.

[Muskiefool]

This got put through because there were hunting regs in the policy bill that just "had" to be tacked onto the finance bill. None of the Governors requests in his Veto were met on the fishing concerns.

Fisheries in in a downturn all the way around, most outdoorsman understand the value of having the opportunity for quality experiences without going to Canada. Generally spearers have great respect for the fish and understand we all have to abide by the rules biologists have recommended, this dilutes that image.

Unfortunately there are a few that feel nothing matters, everything is a lie, the world is after them, all is a conspiracy and they dont care how bad they make outdoorsmen, legislators and the regulatory process look to get their way.

Pike are great creatures to fish, spear, catch, release, eaters or trophy's to photo; Pike offer allot. Theres a few that may see opening up harvest on these mostly marginal lakes and capping any new lakes as some victory I'm sure from their oppression.

[OnAFly]

"I'd love to look and release a bunch of those nice 10lb+ class pike that swim in 'tonka and maybe see a few muskies too over the course of the season. Those situations do make for some cool photo shoots like the pic you posted.

We could take a few of the low 20 inch class fish on occasion for pickling and help establish an even better Esocid population on the lake, establishing a better fishery, albeit one lake at a time. "

This is the attitude that all spearers should have and I'm sure many do. I've got no problem at all with people taking pike to eat while sustaining the resource. I've got a big problem with arbitrarily handcuffing the DNR because some politician thinks science is the tool of the devil. Really, all this does is reflect poorly on the spearers that want a healthy pike population and are willing to take smaller pike to get it.

[Spike76]

Don't blame it on the politicians, they just helped you all. The statewide regulations are sufficient, or they should close all fishing on those lakes that need bigger fish for a few. The minority wants slot limits. But my opinion is very few lakes should have them. The majority of fisher people don't sit on their computers and whine like some of us are doing. All I want to do is be able to spear on the lake that I've been fishing and spearing since 1964. Walking out on a lake is easier then driving miles to another one.

[john skarie]

Lots of monster pike have been killed on Cass already this winter via the spear.

I guess the notion that they just wanted to open up Cass for more eaters was pretty much what we all knew, a lie.

JS

[OnAFly]

No kidding, look at the spearing forum pics. The "we the big pike swim past" line doesn't seem to hold true. Average size on there has to be 30inches.

[Archerysniper]

No kidding, look at the spearing forum pics. The "we the big pike swim past" line doesn't seem to hold true. Average size on there has to be 30inches.

3 pages and 9 fish over 30",Do you post the pictures of every 6 inch sunfish you catch?

[Archerysniper]

[quote=RK And, ever play with one and get it to follow something up like he described? Cuz...that'd be cool to see. [/quote

[Scott M]

DNR to hold open houses to discuss northern pike special regulations

DNR News

The Minnesota Department of Natural Resources (DNR) invites the public to visit a DNR area fisheries office Friday, Feb. 17, from 8 a.m. to 4:30 p.m., to provide comments and learn more about why the northern pike special regulations were dropped on a permanent basis on 15 lakes.

The DNR dropped 15 lakes with northern pike special regulations on Nov. 1, 2011. This action was necessitated by a change in state law that restricted the DNR to no more than 100 northern pike special or experimental regulation lakes. The 15 lakes that were dropped were lakes where fisheries biologists felt the regulation was least likely to achieve its management goal, or smaller lakes connected to larger lakes that also had a special northern pike regulation. Emergency rule was used to drop special regulations on these lakes. In order to drop these regulations permanently, the DNR is required to solicit additional public comment.

Open houses are scheduled at the following locations:

CENTRAL REGION

Long and Crooked lakes (Stearns County), Montrose Area Fisheries headquarters, 7372 State Highway 25 SW, Montrose, MN 55363; 763-675-3301.

Ogechie Lake (Mille Lacs County) and Little Sauk Lake (Todd County), Little Falls Area Fisheries headquarters, 16543 Haven Road, Little Falls, MN 56345; 320-616-2450.

NORTHWEST REGION

Cotton and Big Floyd lakes (Becker County), Detroit Lakes Area Fisheries headquarters, 14583 County Highway 19, Detroit Lakes, MN 56501; 218-846-8340.

Lake Louise (Cass County), Walker Area Fisheries headquarters, 7316 State Highway 371 NW, Walker, MN 56484; 218-547-1683.

Lake Latoka (Douglas County), Glenwood Area Fisheries headquarters, 23070 North Lakeshore Drive, Glenwood, MN 56334; 320-634-4573.

Campbell Lake (Beltrami County), Bemidji Area Fisheries headquarters, 2114 Bemidji Ave., Bemidji, MN 56601; 218-308-2330.

NORTHEAST REGION

Caribou Lake (St. Louis County), Duluth Area Fisheries headquarters, 5351 North Shore Dr., Duluth, MN 55804; 218-525-0853.

North Branch Kawishiwi (Lake County), Tower Area Fisheries headquarters, 650 Highway 169, Tower, MN 56470; 218-753-2580.

Scrapper, Rice, Unnamed (#31-0881), Haskell lakes (Itasca County), Grand Rapids Area Fisheries headquarters, 1201 East Highway 2, Grand Rapids, MN 56744; 218-327-4430.

Those unable to attend an open house may submit written comments or comments by phone to the appropriate area office. All comments must be received by 4:30 p.m. on Feb. 17. Public comments will also be accepted during an open house Feb. 22, from 8 a.m. to 4 p.m., at the DNR Central Office, 500 Lafayette Road, St. Paul.

[Spike76]

Spearers buy a spearing liscense plus a fishing liscense. Why are we recommended not to eat large pike for health reasons and then the DNR has restrictions for pike between 24 to 36. These restrictions are only for getting larger pike by restricting the majority of fishing people from the 4, 5, and 6 pounders. I don't know a single person personally, who is for the slot limits. Fish are for eating.

[Nick Kuhn]

So all those people fishing catch and release tournaments are just wasting their time? I have 3 pdf's below: which lake would you choose to fish for pike, and why?

http://dnr.wi.gov/fish/nor/docs/2006grindstone_spring_summary.pdf

http://dnr.wi.gov/fish/nor/docs/2008balsam_polk_spring_summary.pdf

http://dnr.wi.gov/fish/reports/final/LakeMendotaSummary2007.pdf

[RK]

Hiya -

Spike76 and Nick have really summed up the dilemma when it comes to pike management.

On one end of the spectrum, "fish are for eating." On the other end, fish are for sport, and quality in terms of size is a high level objective.

Pike are both - a consumable species and a trophy class sport fish. Managing to both objectives simultaneously on one body of water is extraordinarily difficult. You can't maximize two variables in one equation.

Pages and pages have been written here and elsewhere about slots or no slots, but really, the above two posts sum up the whole debate. What do anglers value? How do we get there.

We still don't seem to have an answer, so what we end up with is a perpetual tragedy of the commons.

RK

[reinhard1]

yes fish are for eating, but they are also for reproducing. so it seems to me you eat the smaller one's and release the bigger ones. i know that sounds too simplistic but that's the way i roll. slot's to me are a good thing, and the main purpose is to maintain better chances of trophy fishing. as long as a person has a licence and follows the regulations it's up to that person to decide what size pike to eat. hopefully it's on the small side. there are plenty of them, and a lot fewer of the trophy's. good luck.

[OnAFly]

RK - We could have a nice balance of lakes with slots and without...oh wait...we tried that.

There are >4000 fishable lakes in this state and ~2.5% of them have slots. With so few slot lakes, I don't understand how the harvest oriented fisherman can complain.

[pushbutton]

Quote:

Spearers buy a spearing liscense plus a fishing liscense.

Yes and thank you for doing so. It is like deer hunting. If you do not want to hunt you do not have to buy a license. If you do want to hunt then you have a choice to do one or all of the following: rifle/shotgun, bow, muzzle, and a wide variety of special local hunts, but you have to buy a different license for each. The cost of fishing, hunting, or many public outdoor activities for that matter, in my opinion is very little compared to how much fun one can have or in your case....eat. Not much in the world is free and paying these license fees helps to support the institutions that allows you to be able to go out and do this. Someone has to secure the land, build and maintain the access; make, govern, and enforce laws concerning this activity; then set up and maintain a system by which all this can be paid for, tracked, and make this information accessible to the general public. This is just not the DNR either. Local entities such as zoning, environmental services, police, fire, and rescue all also play a role in many different ways to help protect you and this resource. But yes, we do have to pay for it.

Quote:

Why are we recommended not to eat large pike for health reasons and then the DNR has restrictions for pike between 24 to 36.

As far as the consumption guidelines I would suppose because toxins build up in large predator fish. The lakes have pollutants in them. As food gets eaten by each larger organism in the food chain more and more of the bad stuff is concentrated the higher up it goes. As far as the slots this is an unrelated issue. The slots are put in place to try to help keep a balance in the system. Ultimately to prevent overfishing and preventing a stunted size structure. These guidelines and slots also apply to other fish as well, the pike are not singled out, but ultimately both of these are to protect us from us.

Quote:

These restrictions are only for getting larger pike by restricting the majority of fishing people from the 4, 5, and 6 pounders.

Yes. As previously mentioned, if you take away the large apex predators the system will get out of whack and you will be stuck with a stunted population. This theory applies to every species of fish. Ironically if you forgo harvesting the bigger ones, in the the long run you yourself will have more opportunities to eat! This is a finite resource and long term practices and solutions are important for the future. I view the issue as not what I can get for me today, but rather what i can give to my kids tomorrow.

Quote:

I don't know a single person personally, who is for the slot limits. Fish are for eating.

Spike 76 i believe you! While i am in favor of them as are others, and do not agree with you for reasons pointed out above and many others. Please do not take any of this personally. It is ok to respectfully disagree. My response here is really not to you, old habits die hard, I am guilty of that as well, but post this for the hope that someone who reads this will reconsider the need to harvest and eat everything they catch. Simply to to get outdoors and spend some quality time with family and friends is reason enough to fish for me. And, yes, sometimes just to spend some quiet time away from family and friends is even a better reason

[Spike76]

My wife says I don't take nothing personal, and you gave a nice disagreement. I think every pike is a trophy and if I want bigger ones I work harder for them. I would guess more large fish die from catch and release then are speared in a season. Thanks for the kind comments.