CRP LAND

[Faner50]

All this banter about land acquisitions. How many times do you drive by 100's of acres of land in the CRP program (payed for by your taxes) AND POSTED NO HUNTING.??? Call me a hard a$$ but for my money, it ought to be illegal to post CRP. There...we now have upland to actually hunt other than by just the owner.

[Farley]

If that was the case there wouldnt be nearly as much CRP land. Less CRP land means less birds.

[Faner50]

How about this...if you open your CRP land to public hunting, you get some monitary bonus (based on a % of opened land) on your CRP payment. I guess I'd drop dead on the spot if I saw an "OPEN TO PUBLIC HUNTING sign in front of CRP Land. Why tax dollars have to go to land acquisition when it could go to those who open up their property.

[Farley]

Ive seen in other states walk in areas that are similar to what you are talking about. I think they even might have a few in MN but there arent any around here I dont think.

Either way it will be tough to get farmers\landowners to open up to the fact that at any time some guy can walk on his land, wheather the state gives him money for it or not. Plus, chances are it will still be more benificial financially for them to plow it over and plant crops if nothing else.

A buddy of mine has a buitifull chunk of CRP and they spent the time and money moving\planting pines in there and a food plot every year. He raised pheasants and put them out there. We hunt pheasants every weekend till the end of the season there. Why would he want to make it public? Because the state gave him a grand or two?? I'm not sure what he gets for it, but it cant be much more than that.

[CJH]

Good post Farley.

The payments aren't big enough to warrant having a bunch of people traipsing all over your private property, leaving garbage, having the liability issue if some yahoo gets hurt on your property, etc.......

We all benefit from the additional birds that grow and spread out from this habitat. Its a stop gap between private and public land.

Hopefully we'll add more public land with the Amendment money, if the legislature can keep its greedy hands off it of course!

[croixflats]

I used to think the same thing Fanner 50. We had a similar discussion last fall I believe and after seeing and hearing what proponents of CRP had to say my position on the subject has changed in favor of CRP. Though I do believe in some cases the program gets abused but what state funded program does not.

The benefits from CRP is beneficial to us all not just for the hunters. It controls erosion and replenishes soil, filters water run off to mention a few benefits.

Like most government sponsored programs there is always a faction that disagrees with a particular program which is fine we have the right to disagree. I think if people were to do some research on these programs they may understand a little bit better what its about.

Can the program be changed or tweaked a bit? Possibly, I know in the western states they have a program where land owners get paid a small amount per person to let hunters hunt their land. I dont know if this would be feasible or not to work this into the program on a voluntary basis. I know CRP prices is no where near being competitive with land rental maybe this could bring in a bit more money for those that elect to let people hunt. It seems to work pretty good out west. This program out west from my understanding does not open up the land like its a WMA the land owner still has the choice to limit how many poeple they want to let hunt on the land and hunters still have get permision to hunt.

[kobear]

The Walk-In Hunting bill is on the floor in House and Senate. It would pay $15 an acre if you allow the public to hunt your land. Not much money unless it's all black anyway.

The government is paying for all those cornfields too Base Acre Payment, Insurance Subsidy, Ethanol Incentive.

So should we be able to hunt any cornfield because there is a $0.50 per bushel incentive? That's alot more per acre than CRP payments.

[WaveWacker]

A "subsity" is being paid to landowners as an incentive to implement conservation on their land. Besides the general CRP (which there hasn't been a sign up in a while) or the now SAFE acres the only option is the continuous sign up CRP practices which are focused at marginal or sensitive acres for water quality/soil conseration purposes. Yes most probably look at the habitat benefits but they really go hand in hand and it's not just about paying to create a landowners own private hunting land. Heck, I hate to say 100% of the time but this is darn close in that the CRP rental rates are below what land rent is going for. Point being, a landowner could make more renting their land than in CRP.

Ah, how about the guy that runs his own land? I applaud those opperators for enrolling their marginal land into CRP. "Oh but they don't get any sort of crop off that acreage in most years anyway". Well then...if they don't have a CRP option guess what?? They'll choose to still receive their "subsity" to still show that they planted crops on that acreage. Either way it's stil taxpayer dollars but with CRP it benefits both the animals and the water resource.

Open to public hunting. Read the front page of last weeks outdoor news. It's being discussed down at St. Paul. Will most people do it? Probably not, unless the payment is enough. Contact your rep. and senator and tell them that you'd like to see a walk in program established. Probably going to be tough with the state of the state right now.

Keep pushing the envelope with just making CRP and other conservation program (RIM, WRP, etc.) open to public hunting and then watch to see what gets signed up. One still probably wouldn't have any more acreage to hunt as the amount of enrollment would spin so much down hill that it would make your head spin. That's going to help with habitat and water quality??

[BobT]

One thing to remember is that even though it is enrolled in CRP, it is still agricultural land and hunting it without permission would be trespassing whether posted or not.

I've been considering posting my land. Not because I want to keep hunters out or create my own private hunting preserve, although it would be within my rights but because it seems that there are too many that either don't read the laws or don't give a rat's behind about them.

A few years ago a couple guys stopped by and asked permission to hunt my land to which I gladly agreed. That relationship has grown into a special annual hunt for us because now every year they come to hunt opening day with me. As a result I feel that I have to post my land out of respect for them.

Just because land is posted does not mean it can't be hunted. Who knows. You could find yourself a terrific hunting partner by being respectful and asking the OWNER if you could hunt his/her land rather than thinking you should have some special right to his property because he agreed to take his marginal land out of production and try to help protect it from erosion while providing the local wildlife a side benefit of added habitat.

Edit: One other tidbit I'll share. Those farmers that enroll their land in CRP don't do it for profit. They could make a lot more money right now farming that land, trust me.

[goblueM]

fun story BobT. I've met a bunch of people out in North Dakota that are the same way as you - they love it when my uncle and I go out and hunt with them, amazing the cool friendships you make asking permission

lot of CRP land getting plowed under out there

[pike doctor]

Dont plan on seeing an increase in CRP acres any time soon. The Federal govt wants to see as many acres planted as possible. With the increased use of corn, beans, and wheat the last couple years extra acres are need to keep a cushion in the ending stocks so food prices stay low. Can you imagine how upside down our economy would get if food prices skyrocketed right now. The USDA is going to release its "planting intentions" of what farmers are going to plant this year tomorrow. Most analyst believe it is going to be the most corn and bean acres ever. There is quite bit comming out CRP that is going to get planted.

Maybe if we didnt waste so much money on all of this social engineering and trying to turn the flintstones into the jetsons in iraq and afgahnistan we would have some money to entice people to put more of their marginal land into CRP. I would love to see a mandatory 50' grass buffer along all creeks and ditchs, something done for highly erodable land, but as long as they tax you and wont give you anything for it, dont plan on seeing any farmers volunteer to help.

And NO, i dont think people should be able to hunt your land if you are getting a CRP payment. Am I allowed to go in the home and eat the food of someone getting housing assisstance and food stamps? Not to mention all of the legal [PoorWordUsage] that can arise if someone gets hurt on your property. We turned down a couple dozen early goose hunters last year that were drooling at the sight of a couple hundred geese sitting in our combined wheat field all cause we dont want some bogus lawsuit if something would happen.

[graingrower]

What is everyones fascination with privately owned ag land? How can a CRP buffer strip generate this much discussion? When sensitive or unproductive scraps of land are accepted into the (CRP) program, it is to protect soil and water, improve farming operations; it does also build habitat. Explain to me how you would argue an open hunting law if there were no CRP "subsidy". Now learn the difference between a subsidy and a payment; the CRP program PAYS landowners in return for implementing a conservation practice for a determined period of time, it does not subsidize a political objective indiscriminately. This contrast is what makes hunting arguements appear void to me. I also have to ask everyone, why do you think hunting land is so hard to find?

[BobT]

Quote:

I also have to ask everyone, why do you think hunting land is so hard to find?

In part, attitude.

[Musky Buck]

In part, when someone has the goods and you get asked, called, woke up, harassed, tires squeeling out of the end of your driveway for saying no to the 71st vehicle that comes up your driveway to get goose hunting permission, starts to rub a guy the wrong direction. Then, I'm viewed as the bad guy and then the following year 40 of the 70 trucks try try again and now it's mourning doves and turkeys on top of that. Then it's bow rifle or muzzy on that then it's grouse or pheasants or trapping or shed hunting etc. When the small dairy farmer ranks plummeted and these hunks of land were sold, subdivided, etc. it really shrunk the amount of available land to hunt because it was bought up by people who want to hunt. Many landowners have been wronged in the past if you are foreign to them it's tough to build any kind of trust so no is the best answer to avoid headaches. Many use a kid as a feeler. Also, everyone knows someone who hunts and that locks up tons of private land because there's a level of trust.

[scsavre]

Dont get me started on ethanol, what a waste.

I have CPR, if I had to let people on it, I would just rent it out to a farmer and they would crop it and pay me a lot more than the government gives for CRP.

Theres your answer.

[Augusta]

Dont get me started on ethanol, what a waste.

I have CPR, if I had to let people on it, I would just rent it out to a farmer and they would crop it and pay me a lot more than the government gives for CRP.

Theres your answer.

And what a great answer it is. So why are you not out there renting it out to some farmer making those big bucks? Or is the CRP that you leased to the taxpayers your personal hunting preserve and paid for compliments of the taxpayer? I thought CRP was for farmers?

[scsavre]

It is just land that sits there and does nothing. About 60 acres. If someone asks to hunt it, and they seem nice and respectful. I would let them every singe time. Instead, when I go check on the land I usually find, pieces of clay pigeons, dead geese, plenty of used shells and some garbage. Even a deer stand.

The land is 3 hours from my home and I think the people around must know that.

Please note I have never hunted this land. So no, it isnt my own reserve. It has a pond that I might try to hunt next year, but I prefer pheasants and it isnt in a good area for that. this past year I was thinking about buying some birds and planting them out there, but why do that when other people are just going to sneak out there.

I dont rent it for more money because I like to think that I am doing just a little to provide habitat for a few deer, maybe a turkey or 2 or anything else that would like to use it.

I did plant a few pheasants out there for my puppy to kick up and that was a great time.

I struggle to find good pheasant spots somtimes. But I have found farmers are still willing to let you walk if you ask. Problem is, bad apples have brought us all down.

[BobT]

I thought CRP was for farmers?/quote]

In order to enroll land in CRP, the land in question must have been used for crop farming in four of the previous six years so yes, it is a program designed to encourage farmers to set the land aside rather than putting it to plow. Which would you prefer? That the farmer turn the soil over and plant crops or that he expend the cost of preparing and seeding the land down with native grasses, control noxious weeds, and leave the land idle for ten years or more?

CRP is not a program designed to "pay farmers not to farm." It is a program designed to encourage farmers to set aside marginal land for the benefit of our water, land, and air quality they would otherwise be farming and in exchange providing compensation for doing so. A side benefit of this program is the wildlife habitat it creates but that is not a primary objective of the program. The farmer enters into a business contract with the government. It's not free money. He has responsibilities and costs that go into it.

Rather than fostering this "everyone owes me" attitude maybe you should consider being grateful that the farmer agrees to participate at all. You want to hunt the land, ask the landowner for permission to hunt his property and then when you do get permission, be grateful for it and treat the property with respect because it does not belong to you. You want it for yourself? Offer to buy it.

Here's an example of a bad apple that destroys it for others. The other day I helped a guy and two young boys out of my neighbor's hay field. I was on my way home from Church last Sunday morning and found them with their Chevy Trailblazer buried in mud up to the running boards. I had no idea how they got in there but I went home, threw a few chains in the tractor, and went back to help them out. I had to be extremely careful about where I drove first, because I knew it was wet enough I would bury my tractor in there and second, because I didn't want to tear up my neighbor's hay field. I eventually got them out with minimal damage.

After they left I was looking over the area and realized that they didn't just accidentally end up in that situation. I could see where they had been joy-riding all over that area. Had I paid attention to begin with I think I would have left them there and called my neighbor instead. I'm sure he's not going to be a happy camper when he goes out there to cut hay and finds it full of ruts.

I guess farmer's land is open game for everyone's recreation. I've had similar situations on my own land where I could see tracks across my hay fields and into areas on my property where I have set it aside for wildlife. There is more and more land being bought up by private individuals and a change of attitude is getting to be more and more necessary if we want to have land available to enjoy the privilege of hunting it.

[jigging-matt]

Augusta, not every farmer is in it for the money. Many just want to help our natural resources. I know plent of people that have land in CRP, and some do let people hunt it. But when people stop and act like they have every right to hunt their land, they say no evey time to someone like that. I feel priveledged to be allowed to hunt some of the CRP that I do and make sure to convey that to the owner. I have taken the owners hunting with my dog, and sent giftcards, and offers to help around the farm if needed. By being courteous and showing respect it has gotten my foot in the door on other properties. If someone says no, that is their right. If you live in the city, do you like everyone else doing what they want on your yard to do you like to have your yard to yourself? Same principle. It is theirs not yours.

[Augusta]

If you live in the city, do you like everyone else doing what they want on your yard to do you like to have your yard to yourself? Same principle. It is theirs not yours.

[carpshooterdeluxe]

Currently, 424,000 farms enrolled in CRP receive an average of $51.52 per acre for an average earning of $4,104 per farm. Enrollment now stands at 31 million acres.

the 2010 federal budget for the CRP program is roughly 1.7 billion dollars. thats a lot of taxpayers money. wait a second........

that entire 1 year budget for CRP is the equivalent of 7 DAYS WORTH OF GOVERNMENT SPENDING FOR 2 WARS ON TERRORISM.

anybody whining about people getting taxpayer money and not allowing hunting seriously has their priorities out of whack.

[muc33]

Guy's I will admit, I have had a long day and am a little irritable today, but come on. If you want to just complain without action, you have no right to complain. Speak to your congressional representatives if you don't like it. Remember, we all own something here.... maybe not the ground, but an opinion, one thing is for certain, we won't likely change anything but someone else's opinion in here who will then agree with you. Make the call, those who vote are your voice. My opinion is multi-leveled. CRP is a great program for many things; nesting cover, holding ground for birds and deer with cover, and great filtering of fields next to creeks and such. CRP can also be in one's opinion a waste of taxpayer money, or a feeling of I pay taxes so I should get to hunt it. I view it as this. Great for our environment and habitat, owned by someone else whom for whatever reason decided to enroll it in a program offered. I have no say to his property or the rules of the program. If I want to hunt it, it is no different to any cornfield or pasture or alfalfa or whatever.... I need to ask permission because it is not mine. You don't get to walk into someone's house and take a nap because they took advantage of the first time or new homeowners tax credit do you?????

Moral of my rant. We all know where we stand, and we can tear each other's thoughts apart, but at the end of the day. We don't get the decision except for election day. Speak to those about the issue who have a vote, they are your voice. All we are going to do in here is offend someone whom we really know nothing about likely. And none of us deserve that! Have a great day guys.

[BobT]

I understand what you're saying Augusta but I also think you're a bit off the mark. I leased my 2001 Ford for two years before I bought it. As a condition of that lease I had to pay a non-refundable down-payment, was responsible for routine maintenance of the truck, protect it with full-coverage insurance, and when the lease term was up I would have been responsible for any damages, as well as paying for any additional miles beyond the 24,000 per the lease agreement.

I also owned a home that I leased out for 10 years. A condition of that lease, as it is with most any apartment lease, was that the tenant had to pay a down-payment, was responsible for routine maintenance such as keeping the house clean and livable, and she couldn't just do anything she wanted with the property. She did not have the right to remodel the home to her liking. She did not have the right to tear down the garage if she felt like it. When the time came for the lease to expire she would have been responsible for structural damage or excessive cleaning that I may have in order to re-list the property.

I leased my land out to my neighbor for a few years. When the lease was up, I fully expected that I would get the property back in the same condition as it was when I let it out. During the time of the lease he was responsible for normal care of the property. He had to use reasonable farming practices so as not to strip the land of its nutrients and leave me with a weed infested, spoiled cesspool.

Finally, as already stated, the average CRP contract pays about $50.00 per acre. I think if the good citizens of MN feel they want to "lease" the land for unlimited access then I suggest that they cough up the going rate, which around here is between $75 and $100 per acre, which is cheap compared to the rest of the state. The further south you go the higher that price gets.

And then, with this lease that you claim you have, where's the down-payment and when was the last time any citizen of MN volunteered a minute cleaning up the property of the trash left behind? There is a WMA about a half-mile from my home and I stopped in there the other day. Guess what I found in the parking area? Somebody decided it was a good place to dump some trash including a couple old tires and this is land that we bought and paid for! There are lease programs in place where public hunting is allowed and required by contract and in some cases there are arrangements made to take advantage of the Public Access Program that is currently available through the 2008 Farm Bill.

I don't know where you are from but consider checking what it costs to lease agricultural land in your area. In fact, why not contact a local farmer and work out a lease agreement? That way you will have the right to hunt it at your leisure and open it for public hunting or perhaps even post it if you wish.

[jigging-matt]

Well said Bob. I have family with land enrolled in the program. They are not doing it to make money, they are doing it to help wildlife. They don't even hunt it. If someone were to stop and ask to hunt, and was decent about it, they would get permission to hunt. When people just think they can walk out on their own and hunt, the family gets a little upset. They actually stopped renting to the farmer and put it in a program, just because they felt it was the right thing to do. Kind of rubs a guy the wrong way when you know the circumstances and others feel that they should be allowed to hunt it because $5.00 of their taxes went toward the land. Not everything is about money.

[scsavre]

Anyone who feels that doing away with CRP funding and buying up more land is going to work is dreaming. First off, farmers dont get very much for the CRP, and secondly all you are going to do is have more public hunting land that gets pounded and has no birds on it. IF the government is in charge of buying up said land, good luck with that too. Our government couldnt run a kool aid stand. Id love to see the land they purchase. CRP is the best option, you just need to be more respectful to the land owners and maybe you can hunt it. I just said in front of how many people on here that I would give anyone who wanted permission to hunt my land. Not a single person asked me.