lab types?

[chuckwagon]

My wife has a friend that is going to be having pups soon. They are british labs ... I am a big time new b to hunting dogs and was wondering what the different types of labs are out there. And what the main differences are?

[LABS4ME]

This will be interesting...

Good question though. Not going to leave you hanging... just want to read the responses and then I'll interject my thoughts...

Good Luck!

Ken

[duckbuster]

OK LABS I'll bite.

There are only (3) types of Labs.

Black the most dominant and most popular.

There is the yellow, (don't let anyone tell you they are selling "ivory" puppies, no such thing).

Then you have the Chocolate which is the least popular of the 3 but making big strides to catch up to the first 2.

It is personal preference as to which you choose.

GOOD LUCK!!

[Ralph Wiggum]

Don't forget the labradoodles

[lenny7]

Don't forget the labradoodles

Or the "fox reds", the "silver" or the "white" labs.

[duckbuster]

They don't count. They are a cross between a Lab and a Standard Poodle. NO GOOD!!!

[WaveWacker]

There are also labs that come out of pointing lines and are suppose to be pointers not flushers. I think a lot of those originally were known as British pointing labs.

[Bryce]

Black, yellow, chocolate. Good breeding and bad breeding in all 3 types.

[MuleShack]

I think he was talking about the british style and american style or what ever you would call them.

From my limited reading, the british or english breed are a little calmer and thicker in the back...more of a show dog style?? The american breed labs are suppose to by a lot more hyper and thinner with more engergy for hunting??

Other than that, that is all i remember from some of the web sites i was reading.

[Nate McVey]

Quote:

Then you have the Chocolate which is the least popular of the 3 but making big strides to catch up to the first 2.

Do others feel the same? I know when my parents raised labs while I was growing up, the chocolate females went for WAY more than the others in the litter. This was back in the late 80's, have things changed that much? Just curious.

[fishingbuddy]

I have a Brit and went for size and being calmer. I live in a town home. Bottom line if they are trained for obedience both are great.

fishnbuddy

[Ralph Wiggum]

They don't count. They are a cross between a Lab and a Standard Poodle. NO GOOD!!!

It was just a joke. "Designer mutts" bug me big time

[Iron Cowboy]

I have a fox red brit lab. best dog I've ever had and dont think I will ever own a different kind the rest of my days. I think a lot of its great attributes though come from the fact I went to a good breeder that does it for a living and doesnt compromise. If you research the difference's and like what the brit.labs are comapred, go to a good breeder, then they really are as described. I'm afraid though with the popularity of them and the fact they usually get more money for them there are going to be ones out there that arent as good as advertised due to poor breeding so the owners can make more money.

[caseymcq]

... They are british labs ... And what the main differences are?

There has been much discussion on other threads in this forum on the topic. I have had one of each of the two "types." You will hear all kinds of different takes on the subject. Some will probably have to agree to disagree on the topic

I am by no means a "lab authority" but I am extremely fond of the breed so I take a bit of interest in the topic. Anyone can chime in and their credentials will probably depend on their amount of experience with the breed but there probably isn't an absolute right or wrong answer to the question. Mostly opinions or explanations of show standards. There are a lot of dog / retriever training / hunting sites with forums containing posts on the subject and the discussions get pretty interesting To the point of cyber fisticuffs. Even PF has had articles about the topic.

Here is my take on it:

Appearance(physical features) is the only real difference.

Some say temperment is another difference... I don't know. I have seen "American" labs that are cool and calm and I have seen "Brits" that are a little hyper. Energy may be a more appropriate term to use. "Americans" seem to be more charged and "Brits" seem to be more laid back. Typically some indicate this has an influence on how firm corrections should be while training the respective "types" of labs.

The dog on the left, Oscar, is an "American" lab or he maybe could be considered a "'tweener" lab (uh-oh, I may have created a third type ). The dog on the right, Maggie, is a "British" or "English" lab. Both dogs were two years old (full grown) in the picture. Both great dogs (admittedly I am biased so I should say IMO).

A lab is a lab. Any lab can hunt. The "British" or "English" labs have been bred with a look (show dogs) as the intent for the selection of the sire and dam. "American" labs have been bred for performance/hunting as the intent. I know a guy that has a "American" or "Pointing" lab that is one of the calmest, most well behaved dogs I have ever seen. The dog is also a great hunter. The owner deserves the credit for the way the dog turned out. He invested a lot of time and effort in training the dog.

We had a litter of pups in November. One person that called asked about the pups being "real English Labs" My response was that they didn't bark with an accent but there were dogs that showed up recently in the pedigree that came from England. He asked constantly about how well the dogs would behave and hunt with an incessant focus on the "English" tag. I finally told him that any lab that goes to a good owner is going to be a good dog and any lab, no matter what the breeding, that goes to a turd is more than likely going to be a turd. He asked if I would make any type of guarantee on the dogs performance. I chuckled a little bit and said I'll make a guarantee on the dogs hips and eyes and I would also make a gaurntee that the dog would squat to take a ... He didn't buy a pup from us We also had similar inqueries based on dogs in the pedigree that people recognized by name and I had similar, but more tactful, responses: A pup you would get from us will be what you make of it.

Some one mentioned them, I think in a humorous manner, but I think it is peculiar when I see "silver", "fox red" or "white" labs advertised as beeing anything more than chocolate, yellow or yellow; respectively; and that they are more expensive because they are "special" labs.

Like I said, I am by no means a lab authority so these are mostly just my thoughts. But I will contend that labs are far and above the best dog

[verg]

I agree. I really dislike when people sell and price pup due to its color. I've seen some breeders sell "white" ones for a high price and also "red" ones. I love the red color..but will not pay any more for it than I would its sister that is plain yellow. I disagree with that.

I also have a problem with breeders that sell pups that don't sell right away for a lesser price. Meaning when pups are ready to go and they are asking $500. But three weeks later two pups don't sell and they reduce the price to $250. How does that make a guy feel who got one right away...knowing if he held out a bit he might have gotten one for half price.

I guess that's picky and I may be wrong but don't like it.

[duckbuster]

Verg, that is what you would call a fire sale. No one wants to hang on to 1,2 or 3 puppies past that 6-7 week mark. So you do what needs to be done to place them in a good home.

Most of the time no one is privy to other puchase prices anyway.

I will say this, that is THEE one thing I learned from my litter. Find a couple of litters you are interested in. Call for DOB, Colors expected, Date to go home and PRICE. At week 5 you call again and let the negogiating begin.

I can't tell you how bad some people beat me up on price. In the end, you as a breeder want them gone and will do what it takes to see that that happens.

Like Captian Quint said on the boat waiting for Jaws to come back, "I'll never put on a life jacket again". Well, I will never pay the original asking price again.

[870Express]

So people actually negotiate dog prices? I guess price was the one of the last concerns of mine with my pup, I was just happy to get in on that litter.

[verg]

Verg, that is what you would call a fire sale. No one wants to hang on to 1,2 or 3 puppies past that 6-7 week mark. So you do what needs to be done to place them in a good home.

Most of the time no one is privy to other puchase prices anyway.

I will say this, that is THEE one thing I learned from my litter. Find a couple of litters you are interested in. Call for DOB, Colors expected, Date to go home and PRICE. At week 5 you call again and let the negogiating begin.

I can't tell you how bad some people beat me up on price. In the end, you as a breeder want them gone and will do what it takes to see that that happens.

Like Captian Quint said on the boat waiting for Jaws to come back, "I'll never put on a life jacket again". Well, I will never pay the original asking price again.

I suppose you're right. I can see that with pups that the breeder has been hanging on too for a couple months to where the pup is 4-5 months old. But I've seen it where the left over pups are only 10 wks maybe and the price is dropped. It has never happened to me..I pay for the dog I want no questions asked. But lets say a guy buys a pup for 500 and then finds out his neighbor bought a sister 3 weeks later for 100. I can see where there might be an eye brow curled. But you know what..I don't think I have ever seen this with excellent breedings. They are usually gone before born or shortly there after.

[duckbuster]

The puppy market is so over saturated that asking for a lower price is a common practice.

Excellent breeding or not, backyard or to a national trial champion.

[BLACKJACK]

C'mon Labs we'd all like to hear your take on this!!!

People selling lab pups on color is just a marketing thing, trying to differentiate their pups from the hordes of blacks, yellows, and chocolates. And it works. Suzy Homemaker maybe just wants a 'white' lab.

[PikeBayCommanche]

Ok well I will interject my opinion.

I think that it all comes down to experience with Labs of all types to figure out certain traits that you seek in your bloodlines. Personally I have sought out smaller labs because of the stamina and reduction in size related health problems in the larger bred dogs.

Unfortunately there are many breeders that sell on color alone. If you are serious about owning dogs with low disease , great temperament, game finding drive, trainability, and good looks it just takes time and research.

Labs has had more experience with a lot of different lines and will probably tell you it comes to personal preference in the traits you seek in Labrador gundog.

Also to the point that people bring up of never paying really high prices for a lab.

There is a difference between a good gundog that most get there own dogs to and the Level of and Elite Gundog. You would find it hard ever to find a FC Lab that is not from storied a bloodline with a successful history in its past.

[duckbuster]

Can you expand a bit on your last paragraph. I'm not sure what you are trying to say.

Thanks

[duckbuster]

Matt, I was trying to ask you the question about expanding. Sorry about that.

[PikeBayCommanche]

No problem.

I think in the last paragraph I was trying to get at the point that some seem to get at with the common response of "well I paid $200 and he is a great dog, I think it is stupid for some to pay $1500 for a dog."

My whole point with the comment was yes you can get dogs for cheaper prices that would fetch plenty of birds and be a fine hunters when taken to the field.

Where you step into that "Elite" level you are getting dogs that have the ability to excel at the top end of the sport. Whether it be being an excellent pheasant dog to multiple blind retrieves in tough conditions.

Beyond the drive and trainability you have health guarantees and hopefully if you do your research, CNM non-carriers.

The number one thing is I believe you have to ask yourself. What kinds of things do you want your dog to be able to do?

[cutter08]

color has no affect on a labs ability to hunt. It all comes down to blood lines and how much time you put into the dog. I here people say i have a black chocolate yellow silver red or white lab and its the best dog ever. In my experience the one who talks there dog up to be the best is the one who needs to spend a little more time training there dog. I don't talk up my dog cuz the min you do he or she will make you look like a fool.

With that being said I have a chocolate lab that comes from a very good blood line full of NFC FC mother and father are both MH. He is a mix of American and English. Very high strung but trained very easily. And is very eager to pleas. Its not because he is a english or American, It comes from his blood lines and how much time i have put into training him. You only get what you put into a dog.