Smallmouth affecting walleyes?

[fishinfey8]

Does a very rapid growth in smallmouth population, and average size, affect the walleye population or is this a myth? I could swear this has been brought up before, but i can't find anything so some guidance would be very helpful!!

[PerchJerker]

I don't know, but I don't recall ever hearing that.

[BigWadeS]

I would say myth...

[Team Otter]

I have to believe it would be a myth. Most great smallmouth fisheries I can think of also have no problem putting out 'eyes. Perhaps you could contact a regional fisheries manager to get some clarification...

[tunrevir]

I'd say post this in the BWCA forum and get the take from the people who have been directly affected by smallies coming into a system that has walleyes. Larger lakes tend to have a larger forage base and when you get into Canadian sheild lakes that aren't real fertile with a limited amount of forage you will have a lake that will produce large smallies(for awhile), little walleyes and maybe a larger pike or two. The smallies seem to outforage the walleyes on the lakes that I have fished, turning a once good walleye fishery into a (small) smallmouth bass fishery. Now, look at a lake with shallow and deep habitat that is mesotrophic and has enough acres to fulfill the needs of both fish and you have a great one two punch IMHO.

Tunrevir~

[Swimstein]

Smallies and Eyes have coexisted nicely in Elephant Lake and nearby Blackduck for 55 years that I personally know of. We used to cast for both species (prior to the Lindy Rig). Mornings and late afternoons we caught mostly bass and then evening and night picked up a lot of Eyes on banana baits.

When the Lindies became popular, we switched to trolling for Eyes, but continued casting for Smallies. Really can't say there has been a change in the ratio of species caught over those years. More fishermen prefer to clean and eat the eyes, so that probably puts more pressure on the eyes.

[walleyematt]

myth

[goose89]

I'm also in the myth camp.

But, there's a lot of Green Lake (Spicer) fisherman that have convinced the DNR otherwise. Green lake has (had) a world-class SM fishery develop in the last years. Walleye fisherman claimed the walleyes suffered. The regs have been changed on SM, and they are likely to for sure suffer, in an attempt to get the walleyes back. That's the theory anyways. Search the Willmar thread, and enjoy. That debate has been going on there for several years.

[uwleagle]

I just read an article on this topic but cant remember which fishing magazine it was in. The topic said that they don't really effect each other but I will try to find the article and post a better explanation.

[fishcast]

Do smallmouth affect walleyes? I would say definately, they are competing for pretty similiar food in most cases.

Will they affect walleyes for the worse? In most cases I don't think so, there are many lakes and rivers with excellent size and numbers of both smallmouth and walleyes. However, a lake like this Mille Lacs has lots of territory and multiple types of baitfish to support both. And on the other hand if it is a smaller lake with a less diverse food source, and if smallies do outcompete walleyes, and if there are a lot more eyes getting taken out of the water for food than smallies in comparison, I'd say the walleyes would definately be affected for the worse.

I think if managed correctly even smaller lakes with a less diverse baitfish population like I mentioned above could still have great poplutions of both. No expert on this, but if they protected the larger walleye to limit harvest and protect potential broodstock (like a 18-28" no kill slot which I think Mille Lacs has this year) and also protected larger smallies while encouraging some harvest of small smallmouth to keep the numbers from getting to high. Just some personal opinion.

[uwleagle]

The article is in the March 2008 issue of Walleye Insider, its called Do Smallmouth Bass Limit Walleyes? It talks about a few studies they have done on different lakes and showed some differnt results. Kinda interesting if anyone wants to check it out. At the end it basically comes to the conclusion that lake systems are so complex that even bilogical studies cannot find reasons for fluctuations in fish numbers.

[Bassboy1645]

Dont tell an ely local that smallies are not affecting the walleyes or that smallies are game fish...They will cuss those fish up and down till they turn blue in the face! Alot of guys really hate them up here....Ive noticed the tourists really think they are neat and some of the guides I know do everything they can not to cringe when a client wants to fish for or keep smallmouth bass....I find it kinda funny myself! Personally I belive it is a myth and I think the smallmouth bass is a worthy game fish just as any other species....though they are not native to inland waters of northern, mn and wisconsin...

[fishhawk1750]

I am a believer after fishing Northern Light Lake in Canada. First 10 years, Many and I mean many walleyes large and small. The last 3 years it is almost impossible to keep those bass off. They are a blast, but so is catching a 30 inch walleye. After the big blow down in that area, I think the bass habitat allowed for a much larger recruitment of year classes. If you are a bass guy you should check this lake out for numbers and size.

[james_walleye]

Dogtooth Lake in Ontario is maybe the best trophy fishery in all of ontario and i swear when we fish shallow on that lake there is a smallie on every rock. You'd be hard pressed to find a better lake for a 30"plus fish.

[UncleKes]

There was an article in the InFisherman magazine a while back that dealt with this issue. It is a well recognized phenomena in many areas of Canada and the USA that smallmouth are taking over many waters that have traditionally been walleye waters.

The fear is that global warming is having an effect on the quality of the water that walleyes need. As I recall they were not sure but suspected that global warming was raising the temperature of the water in many lakes to the point that the walleyes were dying out. Since nature abhors a vacuum Smallmouth were filling the niche.

I don't know if any of this is true or not. However, I do believe that global warming and the pollution that causes acid rain haw had a disastrous effect on the water quality of many lakes and rivers in walleye waters. In some cases, in Canada, acid raid has left lakes that are now dead zones! That is they used to contain abundant aquatic life but now contain no life at all not even plankton! They are completely sterile!

This may be the shape of things to come. We will all end up fishing smallmouth instead of walleyes and be thankful for it!

Tight Lines;

Uncle Kes

[tacklejunkie]

I would also say myth. st louis river has tons of smallies and is some of the greatest walleye fishing. i also believe there are smallies in LOTW. may affect smaller, marginal walleye waters, but in my experience the smallies have not affected the walleyes one bit

[Bassman55]

I don't think that smallmouth effect the population of walleyes, but I do think that walleye fisherman just catch a bunch of them. They are a very agressive fish and will hit about anything that people throw for walleyes. I talked to a guy that was just mad because all that he could catch was bass, when that very day I had caught a couple walleye when fishing bass. You might go though a little more bait, but I think that it is worth the fight.

[tacklejunkie]

 Originally Posted By: Bassman55

I don't think that smallmouth effect the population of walleyes, but I do think that walleye fisherman just catch a bunch of them. They are a very agressive fish and will hit about anything that people throw for walleyes. I talked to a guy that was just mad because all that he could catch was bass, when that very day I had caught a couple walleye when fishing bass. You might go though a little more bait, but I think that it is worth the fight.

walleyes tend to be more finiky than smallies. Plus, i believe, walleyes tend to roam more

[lotsofish]

I think it might be possible they would be in competition over some of the same spawning grounds, but for the rest of the year they would probably have less effect on each other. I would think fishing pressure would affect walleyes more than smallmouth populations. Any rapid growth of any species is going to have a ripple effect on all other species in the system to a certain extent.

[Nick Kuhn]

I would say somewhat, but not to a huge extent on good sized lakes. It may just be that the walleye population is suffering from other factors and the smallies are just thriving on the extra forage available to them. Good bass catch and release ethics lead to them becoming well established in a short time, but rarely do they become overabundant. As others pointed out though they simply may be the more aggressive fish at a piece of structure you are targeting. They often prefer similar habitats.

[Bassman55]

I don't think that they compete for spawning grounds. Walleyes can start spawning when the water temps reach 40 degrees while smallmouth will wait until it is about 55 degrees. They do probably compete for food, but spawning grounds, not so much.

[lotsofish]

 Originally Posted By: Bassman55

I don't think that they compete for spawning grounds. Walleyes can start spawning when the water temps reach 40 degrees while smallmouth will wait until it is about 55 degrees. They do probably compete for food, but spawning grounds, not so much.

Oh yeah you're right... forgot about temps. They might use some of the same areas for spawning (if I understand correctly, they both like rocky or gravel areas with small amount of current or wind/waves) but the walleyes would be done by the time the smallies started.