Need to vent

[BobT]

My wife called me at work this morning. Seems that as she was leaving to go to her job she caught sight of some hunters that apparently think our land is open range or public. I’ve said it before that I doubt I would ever deny someone the opportunity to hunt on my property if they asked but I will say that it is truly irritating when hunters presume permission. I imagine if I was to take it upon myself to use their SUV while they were “using” my property they wouldn’t mind, right? My guess is the sheriff would be notified rather quickly.

I feel like I am in a tug-of-war with myself on this issue. On the one hand I don’t deer hunt on my own property so I can’t help but feel that I’m being selfish when I get irritated about someone hunting my property. On the other hand, it is my property and I like to think that I go the extra mile when it comes to being courteous and respectful of others’ property rights so why can’t others reply in kind?

I really don’t want to post my property because first I shouldn’t have to, either morally or legally, and second I can’t help but feel it makes me look selfish and unsociable. But then, those that refuse to abide by the law and treat me with respect might just force my hand. And what does it say to those that do take the time and effort to obtain permission? Is it fair to them that these Bozos act this way? Maybe, out of respect and courtesy to them, I should post my property.

Bob

[The Donk]

I think you should post your property, regardless. There are too many people out there who maybe don't know the rules and think if its not posted, it must be state land! We had that happen once. Its too bad that you have to do it, but out of consideration for the people who don't know any better, maybe you should.

[gonefishin11]

Post your land. I have seen signs that say "No Hunting or Trespassing without Permission" (or something along those lines). You aren't because selfish as your have advertised the hunting with permission and you prevent people from walking on your land and ruining the hunt for you and those that have asked you.

[BoxMN]

FWIW, there is some land in NoDak where we duck hunt that is posted "Hunters Welcome" and I think it is a cool thing to see. He just asks that you give him a call. While I don't think you need to or should do that, I see nothing wrong with having a "No hunting without written permission" sign. I don' think that would seem selfish, and for anybody taking to the time to give you a call I would think they are the more resonsible one,s who you might even up being friends with. That is how we got to be really good friends with some farmers in NoDak.

Just a thought, but you are totally not being unreasonable being ticked about people hunting without permission. Good luck.

[c&amagn]

BobT, keep the TIP number handy for you and your wifea and make the call, people like those dont' learn until they get busted so they keep doing it.

[uplander]

You should post your property! The last thing you want is one of those guys(tresspassers) getting hurt on your property..Then trying to hold you responsible. Post it and let guys with respect for the law, and others property hunt it. If it's a large chunk of land I'm sure you could lease it to a group. Lots of guys myself included are always looking for a good spot to hunt and would not mind paying a little money to do so..Also if you have guys out there you know they can keep off the guys you don't! Don't feel selfish! It's your land, you worked hard for it.. Do with it as you choose......Good Luck.....uplander

[fishwithteeth]

BT,

I feel for you. I also applaud you for giving permission to people so they may hunt your land. It angers me when I read about people who trespass, they ruin it for the people who wish to play by the rules. When I started hunting 26 years ago, if you asked for permission it was usually granted - but not anymore. Slob hunters have ruined many opportunities for the rest of us.

How about a sign that read, "Hunting by permission only. Please ask." Would it help? Who knows? Again, thanks for allowing people access to your land

[fishwithteeth]

Quote:

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The last thing you want is one of those guys(tresspassers) getting hurt on your property..Then trying to hold you responsible.

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Minnesota statute prevents people from suing landowners because of assumed risk. It is in the regs. Probably wouldn't stop an ambulance chasing attorney from trying though

[Sandmannd]

I think it's great you let folks hunt your land. I would do what other's suggest and just say no hunting without permission and maybe put your number on there. I would think it's common curtousy to ask for permission, but then there are a ton of jerks out there.

[brittman]

Quote:

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I really don’t want to post my property because first I shouldn’t have to, either morally or legally, and second I can’t help but feel it makes me look selfish and unsociable.

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If the land is wooded than legally you must post the land if you want to restrict access.

Why put you or your wife into a confrontation situation.

POST YOUR LAND IF YOU WANT TO LEGALLY RESRICT ACCESS

If you want to appear unselfish - Post land with "Hunting Allowed with Permission" or "Hunting Allowed with Written Permission" signs.

[mrwalleye_13]

After hunting in Nodak for the past 4 years of college I have learned alot about landowner respect... Many of you know Nodak land is fair game unless posted whereas in mn the situation is a little different... We almost always ask the landowner for permission unless we already know the farmer well and feel that we don't need to ask every day... When it says posted we stay off thats all there is to it... and even then by simply asking the landowner you can gain alt of respect that might permit you to hunt that posted land. Alot of times it really sucks that we can't get on a property to kill some greenheads but that's the way it is and i respect it... If I had my own land it would for sure be posted and not because of selfishness... I want to know and meet whoever would be using my land. I can think of handfuls of landowners that have posted there land since my arrival at college because of people's ignorance digging huge holes in the field and leaving them or leaving trash or disrepecting the land it self.. Ask no matter what its just better that way.

[Hammer Handle]

Actually, you do not have to post your land...unless that has changed recently.

I would personally drive up and ask them "Do you have permission to hunt here?" Then tell them, "Being you didn't ask, please don't hunt here."

I have my land posted. One year hunters came...just took down my signs and thought they could go in then. I called the CO instead of comfronting them, and the CO fined them. The CO told me my land didn't have to be posted.

By the way, I watched them tear down the signs as I was hunting in the woods at the time they came in (they never saw me). The CO fined them for that too.

It is wrong for people to just go in any private land without permission.

[Moose-Hunter]

Quote:

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My wife called me at work this morning. Seems that as she was leaving to go to her job she caught sight of some hunters that apparently think our land is open range or public. I’ve said it before that I doubt I would ever deny someone the opportunity to hunt on my property if they asked but I will say that it is truly irritating when hunters presume permission. I imagine if I was to take it upon myself to use their SUV while they were “using” my property they wouldn’t mind, right? My guess is the sheriff would be notified rather quickly.

I feel like I am in a tug-of-war with myself on this issue. On the one hand I don’t deer hunt on my own property so I can’t help but feel that I’m being selfish when I get irritated about someone hunting my property. On the other hand, it is my property and I like to think that I go the extra mile when it comes to being courteous and respectful of others’ property rights so why can’t others reply in kind?

I really don’t want to post my property because first I shouldn’t have to, either morally or legally, and second I can’t help but feel it makes me look selfish and unsociable. But then, those that refuse to abide by the law and treat me with respect might just force my hand. And what does it say to those that do take the time and effort to obtain permission? Is it fair to them that these Bozos act this way? Maybe, out of respect and courtesy to them, I should post my property.

Bob

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Hi Bob...

I've been in this same situation for close to 10 years and I can honestly say... POST YOUR PROPERTY!!! I manage quite a few acres for QDM within a short drive of the metro. the locals have asked numerous times to hunt there in the beginning "no hunt" stages (4 years) of my program. This only led to sour grapes, threats and has even came to blows one time. Self defense on my part and I'm still not proud of that day...

Due to the repeated badgering I literally closed my land to ALL hunters except family and a few friends. If a little respect and common coutrtesy had been observed way back when, there may have been possibilities for locals to hunt this wonderful place. Now... All bets are off!!!

Make things easy on yourself and post the property. If you notice tresspassers, Call the sheriff and let them sort it out.

[kcota15]

Unfortunately I am writing this from Arizona. I am trying to fill the void of my first missed hunting season since I was 13 with FM. So far it seems to be working.

To the point. We goose hunt near the Fourtown/Grygla area. We have been doing this for about the past 8 or so years. Basically since the beginning of the increase in goose numbers. I understand that most of this discussion has based around deer hunting and woods. This situation is a bit different as we are talking about agricultural land. Being respectful hunters, we have always asked permission to hunt. Sometimes we were allowed sometimes we were not for various reasons. We have always respected whatever decision we were given. Also when we were given permission we are sure to pick up after ourselves and leave the area just as we found it. Because of this, we have developed a reputation as being "good hunters" who are allowed onto property regularly.

Good so far. Now the problem. We have had groups of hunters move into a field after we were set up and basically ruin our hunts. We work hard putting on many miles and making a lot of visits and phone calls to put us in the best position. We feel a bit violated when some group moves in on us. And worse we have later found out that the other groups did not get permission. This is completely shocking to me!

One farmer has completely given up hope of keeping unwanted hunters off his land and has adopted a "first come first serve" attitude. Again, we are dissapointed because we used to have this land to hunt on without competition, but we understand his dilema. It's absolutely ridiculous how rude some people can be. It's bad enough to move in on fellow hunters, but to blatantly tresspass is absolutely unacceptable.

[PerchJerker]

Post your land if you don't want people in there without permission. Maybe your trespassers knew they were trespassing, maybe they didn't. Could it have been an honest mistake on their part??? I don't know what your land is like or what the situation is, but since you don't have it posted maybe you should give the hunters the benefit of the doubt????

Trespassing really bugs me. I don't like doing it myself and I don't like other people that do it. I post my land to keep trespassers out, and there's no question that they can't be there unless they have permission. There's only 1 person that's asked to hunt it that I haven't given permission too, everyone else has been welcomed.

[Scott K]

I have a 20 acre grassy meadow, great for pheasants, we had a group come down from the cities every year that hunted it. They have gotten permission from my grandparents a quite a few years before this. Well one day the neighbors asked if they could hunt it, I told them that they could but there was a group of others that have been down and hunted it the day before. They went out there found 2 dead deer shot, and called the game warden. The warden came up to me and asked what I knew about it, I told them that there was a group that hunts it from the cities and they were there the day before. I didnt know any of their names, I felt as though the warden wanted to give me the ticket for the dead deer.

I then posted the land, the next year these same group came down and asked me if they could hunt it. Mind you this is the first time they have asked in over 10 years! I got there names, then told them no because after they left last year there was 2 dead deer just laying there. They said they didnt know anything about it. So after that it was just the neighbors that I left hunt it.

Just a word to the wise, post it with a permission only sign, so you atleast know who is back there, incase something like this happens to you.

[fishwithteeth]

Just feel the need to put a positive spin on this subject - it may help less knowlegable or people new to hunting.

Last year pheasant hunting a friend contacted his brother-in-law to inquire about the possibility of me hunting his property. I stopped by to introduce myself and ask if it was ok to hunt his land. He said ok. After the hunt I offered him a pheasant and said thank you.

This year, unannounced, I dropped by one afternoon after little success on WMA's. I said, "Hello Mick. I'm Jay. I hunted your land last year." He said, "I remember you. You gave me that pheasant last year. I love pheasant. It was really good." He aasked me how hunting was and I told him it was slow. He told me to go behind his place and hunt, but don't forget the grass across the road because the field was just picked. We shot our limit in a couple hours. And yes, Mick received a pheasant that day.

The moral:

Always ask and be respectful. I have no doubt that by giving Mick that bird last year, insured that he remembered me. I also have no doubt, after giving him a bird this year, he will grant me permission to hunt his land in the future.

[Sandmannd]

I think's it's common courtesty to give them something like a bird when you hunt their land. If you just shoot one, keep it. But if you get a couple or even your limit, offer them one or two. Small price for a good piece of land to hunt.

[Scott K]

When I hunted someone elses land I would always give them some of them meat after processing, along with a fruit basket around the $40 range, I never was told I couldnt come back to hunt a spot.

[papabear]

I suggest posting your land. It can be confusing in some ares where public land ends and private begins. I believe most hunters respect private land and would not enter it if posted or some evidence of posting. I often look for the board on a tree that a sign used to be attached to. That tells me it was and there for still is posted. With out a board sign fence or any other clue a chunk of woods looks the same as any other.

[BobT]

I appreciate all the comments. Just to add a little info to those that don't know. My land is agricultural land bordered across the road by a WMA but otherwise all private around me.

One of our biggest concerns, especially when it comes to deer hunting, is that we have livestock and it would devistate my wife to find one of her registered quarter horses injured or worse by a stray slug. It does happen you know. In fact some even mistake full-grown horses for deer.

Bob

[Tom7227]

Interesting post and thread. Most interesting to me is that there are two opposite opinions on whether the land needs to be posted. A look at the hunting regs answers the question - but not without knowing the facts. Check out pages 12-13 of the regs. Note that you have to know whether the land is agricultural land or not, and then you have to know what the definition of agricultural land is. It gets a bit dicey because agricultural land includes land planted to trees that are harvested within 15 years. I'm not sure I'd know what trees those were.

Here's a suggestion. Post the land indicating that hunting is permitted with permission. Then put your name on the sign and your phone number so people know where and how to find you. It is very frustrating to spend large amounts of time trying to track down the 'owner' when so much of the land is leased and/or owned by non-residents. I have spent over an hour in Iowa trying to track someone down for permission and the end of the line was some dentists in California.

Here's what the reg book says in edited format:

Minnesota Outdoor Recreation Trespass Law begins below.

Restrictions (See below for exceptions, definitions, and posting requirements)

• A person may not enter legally posted land for outdoor recreation purposes without permission.

• A person may not enter agricultural land for outdoor recreation purposes without permission.

• A person may not remain on private land for outdoor recreation purposes after being told to leave.

Definitions and Posting Requirements

• “Agricultural land” is land that: 1) is plowed or tilled; 2) has standing crops or crop residues; 3) is within a maintained fence for enclosing domestic livestock; 4) is planted to native or introduced grassland or hay land; or 5) is planted to short-rotation woody crops (hybrid poplar

and other woody plants that are harvested for their fiber within 15 years of planting).

IMPORTANT NOTE: All planted grassland and hayland and all hybrid poplar and other woody plants that are harvested for their fiber within 15 years of planting meet this definition, including grasslands enrolled in the federal Conservation Reserve Program (CRP), Conservation Reserve

Enhancement Program (CREP), or the state Reinvest In Minnesota (RIM) Reserve program. These lands do not need to be posted to prevent unauthorized trespass. However, land that is brush or trees, including CRP, CREP, and RIM Reserve that is brush or trees, (except short-rotation woody crops as defined above) does not meet this definition and must be posted or verbal notice given to trespassers for criminal enforcement to occur.

Hunters and trappers: Always respect private lands. Ask first before entering lands not posted as being open to hunting and trapping. You will improve relationships between landowners and recreationists, and you will

have a more enjoyable time in the field.

[MOBY RICHARD*]

Entering any Private Lands without Permission is Trespassing...this has been discussed many times in the Forums...Entering Posted or Agricultural Lands is Criminal Trespass..Larger Fines, Possible Jail and Confiscation of Weapons, Vehicles etc...although in at least one Court Case a guy got off because the land did not Appear to be Agricultural...and was Not Posted.

You are not Required to, and Should Not have to Post Your Land, but if you do not, you will continually have "The Problem"...Mostly On Purpose, Most claiming By Accident..."We did not Know".

Its like expecting Red Squirrels to stay out of your Bird Feeders, even when you are not Watching...

The population of Minnesota, is Increasing by about One Million every 10-12 Years, Trespassing isn't going to Decline, with increased Hunting Pressure and Less Land Available...

The sooner you Post and Enforce, the sooner you will have a measure of Peace...it will take Some Time on lands that have not been Posted or Enforced, but the Alternative is Forever...

If you Post with, "By Permission", the Excuses will be that they thought they had, or a friend of theirs had, and said it was OK...

The days of leaving the Keys in the Ignition, and the Back Door Unlocked, are long gone...