HF 1241 use of crossbows for archery

[96trigger]

You guys can't honestly be comparing Archery to Crossbow? Many archers shoot daily with their bows, I can't see that happening with a crossbow, there isn't nearly as much skill involved. I'd go out and shoot 6 bolts at the target and say, yep, same as yesterday. Not at all like archery, where you have to be able to draw, hold, and aim. Crossbows are just aim and shoot. ALL archers should know, the tricky part usually isn't seeing the deer, its being able to draw and hold the bow as you aim and control your emotions and prevent the deer from seeing you. Hence the law against draw holders. A crossbow would eliminate that aspect of it. Thats why there is different season for Shotgun(Rifle is a whole new game) and Archery.

The technology in my compound bow is great, but it doesn't draw itself back and hold it. Crossbows for disabled hunters are great, not for the perfectly able bodied individual. I am not saying that crossbows should be illegal, but they should not be considered archery equipment. Let them be used during the muzzle loader season. The DNR has made this very clear, I don't believe that law has a snowball's chance in Haiti of passing.

For you guys that think the deer are skittish and scarce now during firearms season, let the State open up a crossbow season before firearm opener. Some of you WILL be the same ones on here complaining about not seeing deer.

[dukhnt]

I have hunted deer in Minnesota the past 4 seasons with a crossbow. The farthest deer I shot was at about 60 yards. Got that buck right through the heart and he ran about 10 yards and fell over. It takes plenty of practice to able to take that shot. Any other questions you have about crossbows, I can try to answer.

[fishane]

Oh my god the sky is falling!! The anti cross bow people should be honest with themselves and admit that the reason that they don't want to allow a new sort of hunting is explained by one simple word: competition! They don't want more people in the woods when they are. Some of the points comparing traditional archery with todays modern compounds are very valid. My dad uses a crossbow (in WI anyone 65 or older can use one without a special permit) and has good success, but I will outshoot him with my Mathews every single time. The crossbow is still a 30 yd weapon in my opinion. As far as I can tell there is only one advantage to a crossbow, and it is a big one. You do not have to draw on the deer, just point and aim like a gun. Haven't we all gotten busted by an old doe when we try to draw? As far as crossbows being easy to learn, when I got set up with my bow I had not shot a bow in 10+ years. By the time I left the store I was shooting 4 inch groups. If this is not testimony to modern technologies effect on archery I don't know what is. Try this with a recurve. I think allowing crossbows would allow more people to enjoy our sport, and if it means a little more competition then so be it.

[96trigger]

Duckhntr, you shot your deer at 60 yards, wow, thats great . You probably do practice a lot. But if you can shoot a deer at 60 yards with your crossbow, and I'm confident at hitting something out to 60 yards with my smoothie slug gun, whats the difference? Oh yeah, the BANG.

Maybe we should just open up firearm season in September and let it run through the middle of December.

In response to pressure, am I worried about it? you bet. maybe I'm just paranoid, but I hunt in the Whitewater state park area, its hard down here to find private land, if you opened up Crossbow during archery, I'm pretty sure we would see a big increase in pressure. We would probably start seeing more deer drives in October. I'm trying to find a nice piece of recreational property around here but its hard to find 40 acres of recreational for under $200,000.

[mncarphntr]

Crossbows modern? Better check the history books. Its not a question of modern or primitive, a crossbow is an entirely different weapon. Just because it has a string doesn't make it a bow. And I'm not naive enough to say that since it has a stock and a trigger that its the same as a gun. Its just different. As for getting more people involved in hunting, if you want to hunt and are able-bodied, then there is nothing stopping you from bowhunting. This is one of those debates that will never be solved, I just hope it doesn't pit hunter against hunter.

[harvey lee]

Lets Please keep this thread very friendly and within forum guidelines.

[dukhnt]

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Duckhntr, you shot your deer at 60 yards, wow, thats great

. You probably do practice a lot. But if you can shoot a deer at 60 yards with your crossbow, and I'm confident at hitting something out to 60 yards with my smoothie slug gun, whats the difference? Oh yeah, the BANG.

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I definately wish I could hunt with a regular bow, but it is not in the cards for me. I do agree that there are some big advantages with crossbows. My opinion on this matter is that I think it would be great to have a crossbow season for everyone, but it shouldn't be as long as the archery season. It should have its own season. Hopefully one year down the road I will be able to go back to a regular bow, but until then, I am very happy I get to spend time in the woods to hunt with the crossbow.

[fishane]

I guess that one consideration is how difficult is it to get a crossbow permit at the present time? I really don't know. If it is not a big deal, so that anyone with a real disablility could get one without jumping through too many hoops, then a compelling argument could be made that anyone looking to share the long archery season should learn to shoot a bow. So, to anyone that knows, how difficult is it to get a permit to use a crossbow in MN?

[96trigger]

dhunter, I agree with you. I wouldn't mind seeing a crossbow season. I just don't agree with it being the same season as archery. As has been stated, its apples and oranges. They aren't the same thing. I hope that you will be able to hunt with a bow again in the future.

I'm not concerned about the advantages, or if it gets passed. I just don't believe that crossbows should be allowed during archery without a special permit.

I don't want my comments to be taken the wrong way, we are all hunters, and should be on the same page.

What if there was a clean up season after the gun season where you could try and fill your archery tag with a crossbow? Maybe one that ran in conjunction or right after the muzzle loader. I'd love to do that, it would just be one more toy to buy.

[Bassboy1645]

I dont see the diff of using a crossbow or not. Bows and X bows are both 40 yard or less weapons in my book. Yes the competion would be more. No the deer heard wouldnt get affected any worse. Say it does pass......Looks like the ppl whining and complaining about the competiton will just have to hike further into remote areas? Its just lke gun hunting! Nobody hunts more than 1/4 mile off the road that i have seen or known about. How about a compromise?? Crossbows cant have a scope during the reg archery season.. what do u say?? TO EACH HIS OWN but we can all agree on one thing....This is a heated debate.

[jlm]

I would be for the use of crossbows if they do not compete with archery season (at least most of it anyay). Perhaps they could be used during the black powder season or the last few weeks of the archery season. A guy could pick up a crossbow and be accurate with it in a day or two of shooting. The skill in bow hunting takes far more time (which in my mind justifies a longer season). Crossbows should be treated the same as a firearm as you can load them and pull the trigger. Its tough to argue that that is not a huge advantage when hunting compared to a bow!

[fisherking01]

I decided that from here on out, I want to use snares. Way cheaper, I don't have to sit and watch them, and they're much safer when I'm drinking.

Form your opinions, and put that information where it counts. At your represenatives, senators and legislators fingertips.

[BLACKJACK]

The big difference between a cross bow and a compound bow is that the cross bow is cocked and ready to go, no worry about the deer seeing you drawing your bow back. I'll bet every bowhunter has been busted at one time or another by the deer seeing you drawing your bow. The cross bow is no longer a primative weapon, its like a gun and shouldn't be allowed during the archery season. Yes the modern compound is easier to shoot than a stick bow, but its not automatic when you start considering wind and elevation and especially past 25 yards.

Another concern I have about cross-bows is the pressure it would put on the deer herd. Yes there are parts of the state that are overrun with deer but in central and western MN the deer herd is down, even durning mild winters. I think a big reason for that is the combination of the All Season license and the ease of shooting the modern muzzleloader, guys are saying 'hey I have another permit, I'll pick up a muzzleloader'. And with the ease of shooting one nowadays, in an hour they're proficient with it, and then they shoot the first deer that comes by. The same would happen with cross-bows, they're so easy to shoot, guys would pick one up and the deer herd would pay the price.

I'm for handicaped people using them but they should be banned for the rest of the hunters.

I wonder how much influence the manufacturers of cross bows are having on this debate??

[tealitup]

Quote:

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I decided that from here on out, I want to use snares. Way cheaper, I don't have to sit and watch them, and they're much safer when I'm drinking.

Form your opinions, and put that information where it counts. At your represenatives, senators and legislators fingertips.

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No need to get mad with people who disagree with your opinion. If your going to post a topic you should expect a debate for and against it. Kind of immature. I think it has been shown that both sides have viable rational for their opinions - and all should be respected.

If this is the worst thing that you are worried about when it comes to the state legislature.. WOW! time to do some research.

[fisherking01]

I'm definitely not mad. I have an opinion, and everyone is entitled to theirs. It's not something to raise blood presure, however for many it does. I feel that lightening the load and getting a little humor involved is good for all. I don't see swaying opinions further in this matter, as most points have been discussed. from here on out, it is our right to let the lawmakers know how we feel so they can make the laws that govern our lives. There are good points here, let those who will inevitably decide hear your voices. Written respectfully, Brent

[jlm]

Fisherking has a great point! If you feel passionately regarding an issue, be sure your voice is heard with our reps! Good luck all!

[friz]

I've hunted the last 2 seasons with a crossbow and it's not as easy as some point it out to be. I've been busted a few times shouldering the bow(it's hard to keep 7+ lbs shouldered for a extended period of time). I've practiced hours on end to become proficient in that 30-35 yard range(my max comfort level). Crossbows are affected by wind and the slightest movement when releasing will send a bolt sailing. I dare say with a crossbow you have 1 shot as they do make noise not to say the 30 seconds or more of commotion you cause recocking it while the deer is now no where to be seen. I realize that my x-bow has a 150 lb draw weight(comparable to a 60-65 compound) and releases at 275 fps but don't alot of compounds release at 300+ fps and hi-vis sight pins and quick releases and weigh about 1/2 what an average x-bow does? IMO these bows have very little advantage over the modern compound bow other than the fact they lay horizontal. As far as legalizing them, I'm not sure how big a difference it would make as the $500+ investment may make alot of people think twice.

[jlm]

Once you eventually shoulder your crossbow, how long can you hold that heavy draw weight? Can you rest as if it was a rifle on a rest? Of course you can! There is no comparison, a crossbow is a major advantage over a bow! I would never support them in MN unless they had a seperate hunting season that did not coincide with the archery season! JMHO!

[Royce Aardahl]

I'll bet PETA is sitting back and laughing at this post. I've hunted with arrows since 1968 and it sure wouldn't bother me to see crossbows in the woods. Lot bigger difference between a long bow and a coumpound than between a coumpound and a crossbow. The way my shoulder hurts from all the smallies I caught the last few years I may need to shoot one soon. We should be supporting any type of hunting that is deemed legal is the way I see it. Too many nut cases out there trying to stop different kinds of hunting now. If you want a different season for it guess where the days will come from? None of us own the deer out there. I guess the only thing I don't like is that I need to wear orange during muzzleloader season and no muzzleloaders out in the woods where I go. But I'll wear my orange and hunt and be happy. Anyway, we hunters should support each other.

[ScoutII]

Happened on to a little tid bit on the proposed crossbow rule.Seems it is an ethnic driven proposal. We have a group of people that believe that this is a weapon of choice that is used in the country they USED to live in and they want to use this weapon here in our country while hunting deer. I guess it is kind of like well I didn't know that I could only keep X-number of fish when I am fishing, because in the country I am from there are no limits. Just another HOME sick group of people wanting to pick and choose the rules they want to follow.

[fivebucks]

I've hunted with a crossbow for about 6 years. I've stuck 3 deer during that time and it's not because I'm a bad deer hunter. I am one of the better hunters at our deer camp. It's just using a compound or a crossbow is not an easy way to harvest deer. The crossbow is effective and not having to draw is an advantage but not that big of one. I long bowed and compound bow hunted in my 20's and would do that if able to so I can compare the two effectively. From the time you see a deer coming you still have to find the right moment to bring up your weapon. I do not have my crossbow shouldered for more that a minute, maybe 2 at most and I bet everyone using a compound can hold back for a minute or two. If it gets longer than that I can't keep the crosshairs steady enough for a shot. My comfort range is 30 yards or less. I took up the crossbow when my last dog couldn't bird hunt anymore because I missed bowhunting and wanted to spend more time in the woods. I think you would get a few more hunters in the field but it still takes just as much time in the field to shoot the deer. I don't think too many more people will devote the time to be in the woods on a regular basis just because they can use a crossbow. If they were that passionate about deer hunting they would be in the woods already with a compound bow.

To answer the question as how easy it is to get a permit, it is easy enough if you are disabled. There are temporary and permanent permits issued. You get the form from the DNR, have your doctor fill it out and sign it, mail it back to the DNR and they will make the decision to approve you or not.

My selfish personal opinion is to not allow it because someone might crossbow hunt where I want to hunt. From a sport standpoint if they pass it, I don't think they should treat it any different for compound bows nor any different seasons. I would rather they keep the rules the way the currently are except maybe add the provision of the 65 years old like WI has.

[surewood]

As a bowhunter I would feel cheated. I practice with a bow almost all year to make a clean lethal shot. Now I'm not saying that you can just pick up a croos bow and be an expert but I'll bet I wont have to shoot one all year to feel good about my accuracy. To me bowhunting is the ultimate rush so many more variables when you're hunting and you have to make them all come together. If cross bows were'nt easier they would have been legal years ago. I am also worried about about the boosted hunting pressure. Now some of the same hunters that scare me during firearms will have a cross bow to. Then what happens when there are to many hunters, shorter season maybe, I hope not. One of the attractive reasons for bowhunting is being able to hunt unpressured areas and avoid all the chaos of rifle season. During firearms and muzzleloader I'm fine with that, but I hope they leave bowhunting alone. Just one hunters opinion.