Tough Musky bite this year -- Lets hear some theories

[RuKiddingMe]

Jon Petrowske (ooops) brought this up in another thread but I thought it may be a subject worthy of its own.

I'm a member on various other Musky boards and the word seems to be the Musky bite is pretty tough all over MN, Mille Lacs, the Metro, Bemidji area, Leech/Cass you name it. On the other hand WI is kicking out fish left and right and biggins at that.

My year started out great with 3 fish in the boat opening day and nothing since with 1 trip to Mille lacs and many trips in the Metro and just seeing a fish a single fish is making a good outing, and the lookers are not insterested in eating.

I just don't get it, what could possibly have things so shutdown right now? Shallow Deep Suspended Structure you name it not much going. Any ideas?

RU

[CommonSense Guy]

I agree with it being a touch bite. I finally hooked into my first fish of the year last evening. I have moved alot of fish this year but very few were hot. I thought it might have something to do with the cool spring but it's been warm now for quite a while. I don't expect the northern lakes to start heating up until the end of July. I was up near longville last weekend and the surface temp was 66 degrees. We will just have to wait for August when the top water bite gets going.

[markkstanley]

High water and plenty of forage is behind the slow bite on Minnetonka. I have never seen so many schools of sunnies and small crappies. Also seeing some of these schools suspended out over deep water. You can get lots of follows this year but hot fish are rare. Those feeding windows have got to be very tight and you just need to be out flogging the water. I am going to fall sized lures - bigger might be the ticket.

[RK]

Hiya,

Yeah... I get reports from all over the place (my spies are everywhere ) and the general consensus is, it's been wierd. A repeat of last season in some respects. Short feeding windows, and a lot of the typical seasonal patterns aren't holding up.

The feeding windows deal is really painful. Almost hate to make a long run on big water because if you're cruising along at 50 while the fish are on a flurry - you missed it. Also strange that it seems to happen at random times throughout the day, and not necessarily at 'prime times' like dawn and dusk. Also VERY interesting that it can happen at the exact same time on different lakes. Talked ot a friend of mine a week or so ago, comparning notes. We'd been on lakes 45 miles apart, and both experienced a flurry (caught fish, and aggressive fish seen) in the same 45 minute window. No solar/lunar period, not dusk, no weather change. Just a flurry. But on different lakes, simultanously. Someone has an explanation for that, I'd love to hear it...

I think extended cool water has something to do with fish doing wierd stuff this year. Actually, I don't think what they're up to is all that odd, it's just that it's lasting longer than usual. I think a lot of fish are still over open water, either beating up on suspended panfish, or taking advantage of the fact that a lot of the cool water forage (ciscoes) is still relatively high in the water column. Talked to a friend who was bass fishing on a v. good muskie lake on a calm day, and he never saw a single muskie in the shallows all day. Nada. Can usually see a half dozen or more there by the time you've fished the good bass water. He went back later and caught 2 open water trolling. Tough to find them out there since you won't mark them on electronics very often if they're 6' down over the basin. Have to just have faith and troll up high.

I also think the rapid heat-ups we've had cause problems. Personally, I'd rather fish after a cold front than a rapid warm-up. Big spikes in water temps screws them up longer than a cool down (I think anyhow). I have way more confidence fishing a cold front than I do a heat wave when the water's cool to begin with.

As far as how I deal with it...a strong back and a weak mind is as helpful as anything. Just keep knocking on the door. I do tend to fish very fast when it's like this. Burn bucktails, fish fast topwaters like buzzbaits. Sometimes speed gets them excited even when they're off, and it's the best chance you have to trigger one. Plus keeps me from dozing off fishing a slow glide bait. On the other end of the scale, also done ok on jigs and grinding spinnerbaits this season. Same kind of deal as burning bucktails though really - triggering fish by making contact with cover in an obnoxious way instead of speed.

But yeah...it's still tough. Have said screw it and gone bass fishing more than once this season... Good news is, if it's a repeat of last season, as tough as early summer was, I had a fantastic fall. So there's hope

Cheers,

RK

[Cooter]

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On the other hand WI is kicking out fish left and right and biggins at that

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Thanks much for the confidence boost. Here I'm thinking the muskie action is slow everywhere. Can you be more specific on where in WI the action is? I'm becoming desperate this year - there may be a serious mental break down followed by a bitter,violent tantrum in my boat real soon at a local muskie torture pond

[MuskyBrian]

I have a possible "theory", which is all it is, a theory.....On a recent fishing trip, we saw a lot of sunning muskies. Threw the usual suspects at them (jerks, bucks, topwater), They would go ignored most of the time. Thinking that the fish were not feeding, we almost gave up. But near one of our final attempts, we realized they liked plastics when nothing else would work.

When going to other spots we would make our casts. We would see nothing, pull out some plastics, cast to the same spot, and then get a brown bruiser coming out of nowhere right on the lure. Our "theory" was that Musaky fishing has taken off bigtime in the last 5 years or so and that fish are starting to get more and more used to seeing lures fly by their face. We were thinking the plastics give lures a whole new look/dimension, and maybe immitate natural prey in a better fashion. While this was only one lake, I'm curious now to experiment on different lakes with "different" lures rather then the your typical norms, we'll see....

[Random guy]

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Also strange that it seems to happen at random times throughout the day, and not necessarily at 'prime times' like dawn and dusk

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This is something I have noticed also. My clients and I are popping fish at 1 or 2 in the afternoon and then not seeing another fish all day. I also agree with the fact that these fish are under pressure on a regular basis and is creating a different aspect to musky fishing. I believe any creature can learn whether it is a fish or a dog or a bird. Somewhere in these creatures mind they remember the bad experiences, look at a dog that hit an electric fence. That animal has no idea what that fence is but it will never go near anything that resembles a fence again, just like a musky will learn about a bucktail or bulldog. I can't complain to bad about this year I have been very lucky in finding fish but the deal is I am looking in some real odd places and putting out some strange presentations. Don’t get me wrong it is one tough year, I find myself sitting in the drivers seat looking at maps a lot more then I used to, and the Aqua View is going through batteries like mad in a never ending search for baitfish trying to piece together the puzzle of where did the fish go?

Another thing I can’t figure out is I am having zero luck on top water baits. Most fish are coming from jig presentations and slow rolled spinners. Cold water presentations I call them, but the water has warmed up they should be taking out there anger on top waters! I can’t remember for sure but I don’t think I have had a follow this year in MN on a top water? We need a fish therapist to talk to these critters and see if they are having some sort of trouble with there inner self or maybe they are not in touch with there feelings.

[Muskydanno]

Same thing here Jon, i have been beating my weagle and thunderheads to a pulp and have managed one little fish nosing up to my bait in all those casts. My fish have been more interested in early summer pattern baits like small bucktails and jerkbaits. Even jerkbaits are getting more misses and lazy follows than arm jolting strikes. It has been weird to say the least. I am also pulling fish from greater depths than ever before yet seeing alot of fish on shallow sand like they are still in a post spawn mode.On lakes that i normally see fish in the evening i can't even get a rise and catch more action during midday than ever before. Locations have been relatively the same for me with the exception that the fish are holding more on the last break before deep water rather than up on a primary break.

[IaMuskyHunter]

Had all of last week off work so I pounded the northern Minn. lakes and experienced much of what you wrote about. Had numerous follows (30+) but only had 5 strikes by skis. Caught 40+ northern pike and the majority of the action came between 11:30 - 1:30 pm. We fished a lot of 4:30am - 4 pm slots and could have just slept in! ))

[Random guy]

I was thinking about this and I can recall twice this year when I was going to suggest speeding up a retrieve to new fisherman in the boat and they hooked into fish before I said anything. Temputure / Metabolism problem?

[cjac]

Pressure, pressure, pressure.

I'm a perfect example: 3rd year muskie fishing, realized that it doesn't take thousands of dollars to get set up, and once you see a big fish follow, you have the "bug". Bass fished for years, now I lean more and more towards muskies.

There are so many people like me that the number of muskie fisherman has gone thru the roof. We all go to Thorne Bros and get the "standard" lures. Fish do get conditioned to seeing these thrown at them day after day. My last few fish have been "instinct hits" almost like I landed it on them and startled them. Follows just don't have any steam behind them.

There are also more and bigger boats with bigger engines on the back, hence more noise, somebody said something about people pounding on the ceiling, great analogy! All this activity probably pushes them deeper.

That said, going out now, trying a little deeper, and a jig 'n' pig presentation. Hopefully I'll have a report!

[AWH]

I don't have any answers. But something must be wrong with me. I gave up on muskies for a day and actually went bass fishing for 9 hours. The weird thing is, I never once wished I was musky fishing. But I catch probably 70% or more of my muskies from October on. So I'm being patient. Hopefully I won't have to wait until fall to have some success. But I know that my fall patterns will work (knock on wood). It would just be nice if I could figure out any type of pattern until then!

Aaron

[MN Slick]

I've had some success in my boat this year, well, at least the people fishing with me have as I've been SKUNKED. Anyway, we've been out in the metro about 10 times for 4-5 hour vigils and have 4 in the boat, 49.5, 49.5, 41, and a little guy of 32. 2 fish on topwater and 2 on gliders. I will say that on one lake I fish we've yet to raise a fish on my go to spots and bucktails have not raised a single fish that I recall. No complaints other than the fact that I haven't caught any of the fish, HA!

[Hugo]

It's been ver tough for me also this year. I have 6 in the boat with 3 over 40 and the rest under 30" and I've put in a lot of time on a certain body of water close to my home.I haven't even been moving many fish with 1 an outing being the norm for the year (ouch!). The 3 fish over 40 came from nearly the same spot on the same bait spread out over a 2 week period. I'm pretty sure one of the fish was caught twice but the other was much larger.

I too took some time off and went (gulp) walleye fishing on Millelacs for a break!

Dave

[RK]

Hiya,

I certainly think pressure is part of the picture. At the very least, it sure doesn't help when combined with erratic and weather and atypical water conditions.

Fishing pressure and how it affects muskies is something I've been thinking about, and writing about, a lot over the last couple of years. I'm convinced that if it's intense enough, pressure can trump a lot of the conventional assumptions about muskies.

There's no doubt the educated pressure on muskies is more intense than it has been.

I also think with intense pressure, 'spots' get fried, and you see much less of a return for your effort on what would otherwise be a good location & presentation combination. Doesn't necessarily mean the fish aren't there, but they get tougher to get a response from when they get pestered constantly. Fish just don't like being fished for, whether it's noise from the boats, lures crashing down, or whatever. It changes how they behave. Sometimes areas around classic spots become better than the spots themselves - whether it's adjacent open water or isolated pieces of structure in no-man's land nearby. Off the wall presentations can work sometimes too. I find that on pressured water, I spend a LOT more time looking for isolated, small pieces of structure like isolated weedbeds or rockpiles off the beaten path. Not as many fish on them, but less pressured fish overall. I get secretive to the point of paranoia when I find some of these spots too

I could go on for pages about pressure, but in re: the current conversation on why fishing's tough, I do think it can pay off to try radically different things when the usual stuff is falling flat, especially if you know fish are there, but they aren't reacting. I know I've caught a couple fish on wierd stuff so far this year

Any of you Twin Cities folks - I'm going to be on KFAN Outdoors tonight around 8 with Captain Billy... Have to come up with something to explain the slow fishing between now and then

Cheers,

RK

[Jim Hudson]

I had a tough go this spring, but this summer is starting to heat up. Finally finding fish in usual haunts and getting good hook ups from hungry fish. Nothing big to speak of as of yet, but finally some fish to be seen and caught.

I too can say that a few of these fish are coming at weird time frames, and I think this can be related to fishing pressure. As the fish I have caught on off peak times have come from a lake with heavy boat traffic and fishing pressure. So maybe there is a correlation to that.

But either way, it's fishing and a guy can go nuts trying to figure something out, cause sooner or later the fish is gonna make you think twice about what you already knew. As long as you put your time in and fish key fish holding spots, a person should be able to connect. Sooner or later, the fish is gonna be hungry!!

A quick question though, in regards to the increase of boat movement on the water and musky lock jaw. Why would this put these critters off when on one hand we as musky fisherman put a lure right in the prop wash while trolling to catch these things? Maybe they are chasing too many boats?

[TMan]

I hear you guys/gals on the pressure, but I'm seeing a trend as of recent that makes me question pressure being a prime or leading driver for our slow fishing as of late.

The last 7 days, I know of 8 fish caught between 3 guys (Me included) in three separate outings. Shoulda had more, dang it... With 2 previous outings of seeing almost 30 some fish with no takers. In this 7-14 day timeframe, the water temp has been a consistent 75-77, only varying by location of deep or shallow, not varying as it has over the spring-early summer where it fluctuates 10 degrees in a few days. Also consider that this period has been over the 4th of July, when as you Metro Junkies know, can be a %$*@! to fish due to boating traffic...

As such, I think it might be the stabilizing water temps as of late that is helping those I know. Becasue we were having the same luck as reported above prior to this period. Unfortunately, I'm up north the next few weeks so I won't be able to continue this experiment until I get back, so stay off my spots

Lastly - not to discount the pressure issue totally - Are we catching the same number of fish in total, with each of us getting fewer due to the influx of fishermen, or the increased denominator?

TMan

[Hugo]

Tman,

Shoot me some coordinates and I will look after your spots for you while your gone

Have fun up nort!

[MuskyMark]

I traditionally fish for muskies (on Cass) for a few days the week or two after opener. It's typically been a tough bite for me at that time. Cool water temps, fish still in post-spawn mode. This year was no exception. There was either steady rain most of the time, or occasional high skies with little to no wind. Could hardly get any fish to show themselves. I down-sized baits, and slowed down retrieves for several days, but except for one nip from a low 30s fish (on a baby DR), I was still getting blanked. Finally, during the last few hours of my trip, I decided to give top water a concerted effort. Within 1/2 an hour, I boated a skinny 38-39 inch fish, and briefly had a mid to upper 40s fish hooked. But that was all I had time for. Wished I would have mixed it up a bit more earlier on. But hindsight is always 20/20.

I'd also speculate that the last couple months of abruptly contrasting weather (rain... then sun) have something to do with the slow action. Doesn't seem like there's been much stability to the weather or any slow transitions. Just guessing of course.

Mark

[RK]

Hiya,

I think the unstable weather is the main culprit, much as it was last year. Classic fisherman's response - blame it on weather - but I think it's valid.

Look at water temps. Surface temps might be high one day, but doesn't take much of a cool down to drop them pretty dramatically. That sort of tells me that overall the water temps are on the cool side. It was a pretty cool spring, and with the storms and rain, the warm up has been slow and inconsistent. We've had some hot weather here and there, but it takes more than a couple hot days to really warm anything beyond the surface. On most of the lakes I've been on there's no thermocline established yet at all, and that's something I always sort of view as a sign of more stable summer patterns. Last year, a lot of lakes never stratified, or if they did, it was a very weak thermocline as opposed to a very well defined epilimnion/hypolimnion separation. One of the things a slow transition to stratification does is keep cool water forage like ciscoes high in the water column for extended periods, and keeps the band of water that's within their preferred temperature range a lot higher in the water column than normal. So you have available forage high in the water column over open water throughout the day, rather than just during certain periods of the day as you'd normally see when there's a more definite stratification taking place. I think this is why, for me anyhow, the most consistent pattern so far this year has been suspended fish in the top 10'. It's something that occurs every year I think - sometimes before the season even opens on early, warm spring years - but it's sort of been dragged out this year. I think as water temps stabilize and thermoclines start to set up, things will settle into a more normal summer period. Starting to see that here and there already.

The interesting thing about this all is, when it's like this, and weather patterns and water temps finally stabilize, fish can really go on a tear for a few days. You can get an abbreviated, but very difinite, summer peak.

Cheers,

RK

[hawg_wobbler]

I totally agree with cjac's coment about lake noise. I live and fish Mille Lacs, and when I'm fishing the bays I get tired of the noise myself...lol

One thing cjac forgot to mention is the roaring noise of all the suv's rushing up hwy 169 on any given friday, it's enough to send all the muskies into hiding (including myself)...LOL

[Fisher Dave]

I think pressure is the answer you guys are looking for... Its really hard to get a fish to chew that has seen 31 baits that day.

I have caught a lot of muskies this year considering the amount of time I have spent on lakes(i'm usually on a river) that have muskies in there...

Saying this.. I will say that not one of the Muskies I have caught has been on a traditional musky lure.. Most of my fish have been caught on walleye size crank baits (#7 shad rap for example), and throw in a couple on bass size spinner baits.. spinnerbaits have definitely produced the most follows.

Muskies get educated to the norm.. but will still hit when they are hungry.. although your going to earn them strikes in a small strike window.

Try something nobody else is doing... smaller baits trolled over deep weeds, spinnerbaits in shallow weeds, deep diver cranks over deep water away from the weeds, or deep structure... trolling isnt illegal in Minnesota yet.. how long do you think a musky is going to follow that lure before it dropps away, or hits it? Under normal circumstances.. a cast last for what.. 10 seconds? I am sure the muskies get educated to that.

I have been hitting them when I am not even trying... in lakes specified in this thread on a regular basis.. usually at least one hits the boat every trip.. 2 is not uncommon... and to be honest it doesnt matter if I'm targeting them or not.. what I am doing is working.

[buzzsaw]

Right on Fisher Dave! I agree 100%.... I was muskie fishing on Waconia Sunday morning and we spoke to a couple guys in a boat that said they landed two 48's and a 36, then another local guy that said he had a 50 on and it tossed his lure near his boat.... the one thing they both had in common was the fact that they had alot of follows and no strikes. As much as I'm not a fan of it, people could probably do well on large suckers.... that deep throat hooking becomes an issue however.

[TMan]

Dudes - I would say that the pressure was a non issue for those guys. I mean, 2 48"ers and a 36, plus another boat with a 50 almost boated? And this on a Sunday AM after a Friday evening fishing pressure and a Saturday of fishing pressure and a zoo of a recreational boating day? I'm not sure that these encounters help to support the noise and pressure arguements.

I'll add that I had my best day ever on Tonka (5 boated 39" - 49") on a Saturday afternoon during max boating traffic. One 48" I caught right next to a pontoon with kids swimming. You want to see kids scurry back onto a boat, you should have seen their faces when I pulled that fish from the water for pics . I think these metro fish get used to that kind of traffic.

I do think pressure is a factor in how fish behave, don't get me wrong - you can't ignore it, but I'm still not a believer that its what was making for a slow spring/early summer. After all, you hear of more fish being caught recently than 4 weeks ago, and I'd argue that pressure may have only increased since then...

[Random guy]

TMan I agree it must be turning on RIGHT NOW! I have heard more good reports in the last few days then I have all year. Maybe the water finally stabilizing and warming up to the muskies liking?