rage 2 blade issues????

[jeff127]

My bro shot a decent buck last night, go pro showed a near perfect hit yet very little penetration showed on arrow. Deer was quartering away 25 yards, front half of deer was slightly more broadside. The arrow only showed 12 inches of penetration, broadhead was bent about 20 degrees, one blade was bent pretty good, luminock fell off on impact, and arrow fell out after 60 yards. My guess was he JUST clipped rear of shoulder blade and the arrow skipped towards way deer was facing. followed blood for 400 yards and could have put all blood found in a thimble.

3 years ago he shot a doe at 20 yards hitting it for a easy center punch double lung shot and the arrow literally hit and deflected along its rib cage straight into the air....deer was shot 3 weeks later with just superficial wounds

I shoot a 3 blade rage and have had zero issues on the deer I have harvested. I know strange things can happen but after watching the go pro video....this deer should be in the freezer.

anyone else have similar issues with the 2 blade rage?

[Scoot]

Jeff, if you look around the internet you'll find a sea of info about the Rage heads. Some will say it's the best thing ever, some will say it is terrible and couldn't kill a gopher. When they work, they result in some devistatingly quick kills. However, they have, IMO, a nasty habit of not working right more often than they should. Now that I've said that a dozen or more people may chime in and say how wonderfully they've worked for them. Rage followers will believe what they want to believe just like Rage haters will do too. I'm not a hater of Rage, but I'm not in love with their basic design. However, their newest head does have me a little intrigued. That being said, I've loved Spitfire Maxx's since I started using them about five or six years ago and see no reason to switch. So I won't.

[mrklean]

Like Scoot said welcome to the world of Rage broadheads. Some will swear by them others will swear at them because of what you described. Do a search on the internet and you will see lots of info on them good and bad.

[92python]

Can you upload the video somewhere so we can see the shot?

I have never shot a Rage head but....Big cut broadheads seem to sell so the push is to build broadheads that have bigger and bigger cutting "diameter" which is great until you hit bone.

[boXCar JiggY]

Ive used the rage 2 blade twice on two bear with devastating results. next yea im thinking on sitching to something else. I just don't like the odd. apprentley its just a matter of time before one fails on me.

[WalleyeChaser]

I also had the same issue with the 2 blade. Must have caught a rib when I shot because I only had about an inch of good blood past the broadhead on the arrow. Almost the same scenario with the blood trail as well. Made me feel better after not finding him after a full day of searching, when he showed up on my trail cam a few weeks later. Had another bad experince whe trying to take a doe as well! I gave up on mechanicals after that. I'm sure there are ones that work fine but I'll stick with my Muzzys.

[Shu]

Not a 2 blade but I shot the 3 blade on a doe Sunday night and had similar results. Quartering away shot at 14 yards...perfect angle...hit a rib and ran the arrow along the rib cage and lodged just under the front leg. Must have cut a artery under the leg since it went down in 30 yards. Not sure I can post the pic but it basically skinned the deer from the middle of the rib cage to the leg. But my son used the same 3 blade on a broadside shot and it worked great, like most heads would.

[jeff127]

I know he is looking at different broadheads now even though he shot and quickly killed a bear opening weekend hitting it same spot same distance and same body position as the buck.

I will ask him about posting video....it would be listed under rage epic fail!

[DonBo]

When you said "quartering away", I knew right off what happened. Rage is widely known for not penetrating on quartering shots, only following the outside of the rib cage.

Mechanics seem to work great on straight on broadside shots, but they do not work everytime. For me, that's reason enough to stay away from them. Moving parts and broadheads never did make much sense to me, that's why I shoot fixed blade. G5 Strikers for me.

[TheWalleyeSlayer]

Sometimes it is too easy to just blame the broadhead. With todays emphasis on arrow speed, many people are shooting too light of arrows to achieve those speeds. The result is a loss in kenetic energy, this is what you need to punch through those deer. Most times when shooting a deer or bear you WILL hit some bone. I happen to currently shoot 2 blade rage, I like the shot accuracy. In my 34 yrs of bowhunting, I have shot most types of broadheads and have had success and loss with many. Currently I am shooting a 450 grain total weight arrow. Last year with that setup, I put a terrible shot on a nice 8pt, I hit it high and forward, ended up right on the should plate, but with the kenetic energy of the arrow from my 68lb switchback, the arrow penetrated through that bone plate, yes bent blades, but blades that went through, arrow went in about 12 and broke off, result deer down in 25 yds. I am just saying there is more to it than just the broadhead, KE is critical to drive any arrow combo through.

[Bear55]

I'd like to see the vid too, even better if you can do a slow-mo of the shot. Might be a case of steep angle bouncing off ribs or the shot could have been too far forward and hit shoulder and any broadhead would have had trouble

When a deer is quartering away from me a lot of times my shots won't touch the ribs, it will enter behind the last rib and shoot up through the lungs. Not a lot of blood and no pass through with that kind of shot but they are usually down fast. You can sometimes clip the guts that way but I promise it gets the job done.

[Bear55]

Ok see what you guys think of this, obviously this pic is from the ground and the angle could be a bit different. If you are shooting at the yellow dot you might be in some trouble. Even worse if you are off a little but at that angle you might just be clipping ribs and lodging the arrow in the front shoulder and you broadhead never really enters the chest cavity. If you hit the red dot you might get the back rib or you might not but that arrow is shooting through the center of the chest cavity and the deer is in trouble.

Again not sure if this was the angle you guys saw and obviously when shoot from a tree those dots would need to be a little higher on the deer to angle down through the engine room. A good rule I like to use is to aim for the opposite shoulder, if you can hit that you should be good.

[harvey lee]

As far as the shot above, I typically do not shoot at quartering deer at a steep angle like in the photo above. I do not have much confidence in that shot, at least for me.

I have used the 3 blade and all I can say is, I will not use them again.

I have a few 2 bladed Rage left and my son and his buddies have had great luck with the 2 blade design. others will say the opposite. These 2 blade Rage heads do leave a heavy blood trail for sure.

I am back to shooting my Muzzy 3 blade heads as they NEVER gave me 1 issue over the years.

I guess why try and fix what is not broken. Hope I learned my lesson and stay with the Muzzy's until they do not work for me.

[Scoot]

This is just the kind of pic that DonBo is talking about (I think). I love quartering away shots, but this is too much angle for my liking for sure. Steep angles like this are exactly the kind of shot that a mechanical is more likely to not perform as one would hope. If that deer turned and was halfway between his current position and broadside, I'd love how he's situated. Instead, just like Harveylee suggested, I'd simply not shoot at this deer how he's positioned now.

[mainbutter]

The result is a loss in kenetic energy, this is what you need to punch through those deer

http://www.huntersfriend.com/carbon_arrows/hunting_arrows_selection_guide_chapter_5.htm

Take a look at the results of some testing with different arrow weights. Are bows transferring KE similarly efficiently to arrows of various mass?

Least efficient - 250 grain arrow, 294 fps, 48ftlbs KE

Most efficient - 650 grain arrow, 195 fps, 55 ftlbs KE

I'd argue based on those results that even with lightweight arrows, bows are pretty darn efficient (though they are measurably more efficient with heavier arrows) when compared to heavy arrows. They aren't AS efficient, but a heavier arrow won't likely get you so much more punching power that you'll destroy a deer if your lightweight arrow isn't performing at all. There just isn't that much more to be gained.

If a lack of KE is the issue for a mechanical broadhead failure, going to a heavier arrow to make the bow more efficient at transferring its stored energy to an arrow. It might be JUST enough more efficient to make a mechanical broadhead work well.

However, in all likelihood if a bow is shooting a light arrow and mechanical broadheads aren't working, then for the sake of reliability, the shooter probably needs more KE stored to make a mechanical work. Trying to squeeze that extra 5-10% of efficiency out of a bow may not be enough.

[TruthWalleyes]

I hit a big doe 2yrs ago, 80yds full sprint, last day of season, quartering away just as this pic. Muzzleloader shot mind you, but i hit her right where the red dot was(Or just slightly below), bullet destroyed the heart. No exit wound. Deer dropped dead immediately. It was an extremely clean gut job as the bullet never went through the stomache/guts and went right for the vitals. Heart looked like burger.

I don't think there is anyway i would take that shot with a bow at a standing deer. My confidence in arrows aren't nearly as high as 150grains behind a 300 gram bullet

[Bear55]

This is just the kind of pic that DonBo is talking about (I think). I love quartering away shots, but this is too much angle for my liking for sure. Steep angles like this are exactly the kind of shot that a mechanical is more likely to not perform as one would hope. If that deer turned and was halfway between his current position and broadside, I'd love how he's situated. Instead, just like Harveylee suggested, I'd simply not shoot at this deer how he's positioned now.

Agreed Scoot, this pic is a pretty steep angle for a shot, a matter of inches can make a huge difference here. So steep that any broadhead not perfectly placed is going to have trouble. I don't know if this was the case or not but just wanted to post an example.

[Scoot]

You bet Bear- it's a good example and we appreciate you posting it. I wasn't trying to crack on you in any way- pictures tell 1000 words with stuff like this. I was just trying to give my $.02 on it. Thanks for posting.

In 2008 I shot a bull elk and it ran about 120 yards and bedded down. My first shot was tucked in tight to the shoulder, but the elk was quartering slightly (but more than I realized) towards me on the initial shot. I'm pretty sure I got the onside lung, but not the opposite lung. We sneaked up on the bull and I felt like it was most ethical to try put a finishing shot on him ASAP. I took the first shot at slightly more angle than your picture (not one I'd ever take on an initial shot, but all bets are off when an arrow is already in an animal in my book). The arrow entered exactly where I aimed- just in front of the onside back quarter. Then it simply skidded along under the skin, but never entered the body cavity of the bull. It ran from the front of the back quarter all the way to the very front of the front quarter, never going any farther in than just under the hide. ...and, this was with a G5 Striker. So, it can happen with fixed heads too. However, I think there's a lot of support for the notion that it'll happen with mechanicals much more readily.

[mainbutter]

150grains behind a 300 gram bullet

Unless you're sending 10 ounce sinkers down range, you probably mean a 300 grain bullet

[rkhinrichs]

Questions was the rage full connected to the rubber band? It could have opened early! Im sorry. dont give up!

[harvey lee]

I would never be into making this shot with a mechinal or fixed broadhead. Too small of a target zone and almost sure to hit bones.

Not looking to bust anyone's chops but that shot is a low percentage shot and I would rather let that buck go for another day before I would take that shot.

The biggest thing that bugs me about these type shots is way too many deer end up being crippled and crippled deer from archery bother me alot. No, I do not like it with a gun either but I would guess alot of people take low percentage shots like this without the needed skills to make a clean killing shot.

[Bear55]

In 2008 I shot a bull elk and it ran about 120 yards and bedded down. My first shot was tucked in tight to the shoulder, but the elk was quartering slightly (but more than I realized) towards me on the initial shot. I'm pretty sure I got the onside lung, but not the opposite lung. We sneaked up on the bull and I felt like it was most ethical to try put a finishing shot on him ASAP. I took the first shot at slightly more angle than your picture (not one I'd ever take on an initial shot, but all bets are off when an arrow is already in an animal in my book). The arrow entered exactly where I aimed- just in front of the onside back quarter. Then it simply skidded along under the skin, but never entered the body cavity of the bull. It ran from the front of the back quarter all the way to the very front of the front quarter, never going any farther in than just under the hide. ...and, this was with a G5 Striker. So, it can happen with fixed heads too. However, I think there's a lot of support for the notion that it'll happen with mechanicals much more readily.

Perfect example Scoot and exactly what I was getting at. At a steep angle any broadhead could hit a wall and ribs and kick out. Or slam into the front shoulder and really go nowhere. I agree that mechanicals might be more prone to this kind deflection but overall I think it is the angle/placement of the shot that causes the most problems and not necessarily the broadhead.

[TruthWalleyes]

Thanks for clarifying MB.

[Bear55]

I would never be into making this shot with a mechinal or fixed broadhead. Too small of a target zone and almost sure to hit bones.

Not looking to bust anyone's chops but that shot is a low percentage shot and I would rather let that buck go for another day before I would take that shot.

This isn't an ideal shot from the ground no, however if you were up in a stand you have a larger window. Plenty of room to slip an arrow in there when the hind quarter isn't in the way.

[Archerysniper]

That is the exact reason why I do not shoot a 2 blade rage. I have seen this happen many times with 2 blades of different manufactures.