Arrghh water heater

[upnorth]

OK bought a new water heater from Lowes and had it installed. 40 gallon natural gas the same as the last one as far as size goes. Now all of a sudden we start running into hot supply issues. Used to be we never had any issue with showering now with the new heater about 4 minutes into the shower the temp drops enough we have to mess with the hot/cold mix. Call Lowes and so far they are being decent about it they get the plumber who installed it back out and have them check the system. He ran full hot water into the slop sink and after 3 minutes could tell a temp drop. So he calls Whirpool and gets a run around and has to go through two hours of testing temps at various times and settings and scenarios.

Sounds like Whirpool is talking about BTUs and I can undertand BTU on recovery, but I just can't grasp how that is going to make that much of a difference on a full tank of hot water?

When the wife talked to the plumber he told he with that tank we should get at least 20 minutes of a normal shower before you see any real temp drop. He ain't happy, we ain't happy! Feels like we are getting a run around.

[PurpleFloyd]

Ahh yes.

You get convenience and some times lower prices at the big box stores but when you need service and need something done fast that is often times not going to happen.

I agree you should have more hot water than that and i find it hard to believe if it is doing it's job and heating the entire tanks contents to the proper temp that you would only have that much water before it goes cold. I am wondering if there isn't a sensor not working properly.

Is there a drain valve on the bottom of the unit with a garden hose end on it? If so, I would draw water from that and see what the temp is and how much comes out at that temp since it is on the opposite end of the tank from the inlet and outlet. If you have hot water at the bottom and at the top then I have no idea how you could have that little hot water before you lose temp unless they put a 3 gallon tank in a 40 gallon wrapper .

Otherwise if something is blocking the water flow in the tank maybe that could cause it.

Is the burner running properly? And how long does it run after you draw the hot water out of it? Is it a power vent unit?

[PurpleFloyd]

Is it tripping any codes?

[upnorth]

I have no idea if it is tripping anycodes. So far the plumber has been good to work with and Lowes has been helpful. Even the plumber is abit annoyed at what they want him to do.

I am thinking like you. We get more hot water out of our 6 gallon water heater in our 5th wheel. Much more B.S. and I am calling Visa to have them put a stop on payment. The plumber is supposed to be back tomorrow to run some tests that Whirlpools wants him to run. No joy and I will check to see what comes out the bottom valve.

[Redlantern]

Just a thought, did he hook up the incoming water to the inlet side of the water heater? If he didn't, then you'd be getting shorted on hot water.

[upnorth]

I looked at that right away they are right unless they are labeled wrong.

[Tom7227]

Maybe the dip tube got left out somehow during the manufacturing process?

[CAMAN]

What's the temperature set at? If its set too low you will run the tank empty of hot water pretty quickly without needing to mix with any cold water.

[upnorth]

It is hot enough that you need to mix cold in with the hot or you just can't take heat. But after about 4 minutes you need to turn the cold water off and even then it isn't really hot.

[upnorth]

Well the plumber came back out. Ran the tests Whirpool wanted. Had him run the water a couple minutes then check the temp. Started out at 120+ degrees, 7 minutes later it dropped to 110. According to the Whirpool folks that was within specs. Their solution, turn the temp up higher so you use more cold and less hot. Going to be talking to Lowes again tomorrow.

They have us setting what now is scalding hot. Don't have an accurate gauge but you run the water steam is rising out of the sink.

[dillrodd]

+1 on the dip tube. my bet is that is broken off..

[WallEYES]

+2 on the dip tube, or the water heater you purchased has a lower btu input than the existing one.

[Tom7227]

UpNorth - the dip tube is a plastic tube with a flare on the top. It sits in the cold water inlet and is about 3 feet long. It pushes the cold water down into the bottom of the water heater. The hot water comes out of the top. The idea is that the cold water has to rise to the top but that takes a while and so you get hot water longer. If the dip tube is kaflooey it could allow the cold water to mix up higher in the tank. If you can remove the cold water inlet and see if there is a tube there. Take it out and see if it broken or anything. If that isn't it then I don't know what it could be. Tom

[upnorth]

I may wind up going that route, but the dang thing is new. So far not getting much help from Lowe's. I have made a stink on Whirlpool's facebook page and they gave me an email address to send info and contact info to. I just sent a nasty gram to Lowe's corporate and let them know I am about to work with Visa to put a stop payment on the purchase.

Let's just say neither will see business from me after this point.

[Archerysniper]

Sounds like the dip tube to me also. Is it a gas heater? The gas heaters have a baffle that drops down the flue in the heater to help heat loss and distribution,it could be missing or out of alignment also.

[upnorth]

It is gas. I am hoping to not have actually start turning any wrenches on this myself as the dang thing should work out of the box and I am reluctant to mess with it unless the vendor asks me to check on something.

So far Lowe's has the absolute worst customer service I have ever dealt with, they make Menards Customer support look the Golden Child.

[nobody05]

sounds like dip tube... perhaps he sweated a connection right on the heater and got the fitting to hot so the dip tube melted and fell off.

[Tom7227]

upNorth

Seems to me that you can spend however long fighting with Lowes via VISA but in the meantime you're going to be taking some cold showers. Checking the dip tube shouldn't be a big deal if there is a union or some way to unscrew the pipes. I'd go for it and see if that's the problem and get it done for a half hour of your time and maybe $10.

[Ice Wolf]

I don't understand why you don't drain the water out of the water heater, disconnect it throw it in your car and drive down to lowes and return it! Get your money back. Let lowes deal with the manufacture.

Take controll of the situation and do it your self DONE!!

[upnorth]

Well 2 things, no union they did some sort of a crimped fitting on the pipe right at the heater. I would have to cut and put a union in or re solder a splice in.

But after emailing Lowe's customer service sternly but not outright nasty, voicing my displeasure with this and the stores service I got a reply today Lowe's customer service. Below is what I sent them.

Quote:

We purchased this heater about 1 1/2 weeks ago. Our old water heater was also a 40 gallon water heater. We never had a problem with the old water heater and the water cooling down during a shower. Now after about 4 to 5 minutes we have to start adjusting the amount of cold water to maintain a comfortable shower. This is a 40 gallon water heater rated for a household of 3 to 4 people and is just my wife and I. I have also posted on home improvement forum about this and there is no agreeing with the Whirpool tech that this should be expected. I heard the line about the BTU and I can agree that as far as recovery goes or an extremely long shower BTU and water recovery can easily an issue, but short shower shouldn't tax that water heater at all. I don't want make threats, but I am about to talk to Visa about a stop payment on this purchase. I have no intention of accepting a defective product like this

Lowe's reply.

Quote:

Hello Scott,

Thank you for your email.

I appreciate you taking the time to bring your dissatisfaction with your recent water heater installation from the Lowes of Hibbing, MN to my attention. I apologize for the lack of professionalism and service you received.

I want to ensure this is addressed promptly. To do so, I have documented your email and sent it to the attention of the Senior Store Management at this location. I have requested that a member of management follow-up with you within 24 hours to further assist you.

We value you as a loyal Lowes customer; if you need additional assistance, do not hesitate to let me know or you may call Lowes Customer Care at 1.800.445.6937, Monday Saturday, 7:00 a.m. 11:00 p.m.; Sunday 10:00 a.m. 7:00 p.m., EST or you may visit your local Lowes. www.lowes.com/storelocator

Thank you for shopping with Lowes,

Matthew M.

Lowe's Customer Care

The store Manager also called and left a message stating they would start the process with Whirlpool to return the water heater.

I will post more as the process goes.

[Tom7227]

Hope it works out for you. As the new one gets installed put some shut off valves on both sides as well as a union on each. Makes the switch out a lot more simple when the next one has to be put in.

I am curious to know what the problem was. As it comes out see if the tech will check the dip tube.

[upnorth]

If I am here I will, but mostly likely will be my wife as she gets done a lot earlier in the day.

[fishwidow]

Hi, I am a former Lowe's employee. The situation you have is you are dealing with the manufactuer Whirlpool. Had you purchased an extended protection plan with Lowe's they would be the ones to deal with fighting with Whirlpool. Unfortunately, most people decline the extended protection. In your case, it would have paid off.

Secondly, I left Lowe's and found a much better place to work. Lowe's management is a huge joke and none of them deserve to be employed. The Hibbing store is run by a tyrant, the regional manager that runs Hibbing and all the Twin Cities stores is an stubborn-one and gets his directives from the morons in corporate. None of the managers there have guts to stand up to their directives. May advice, stick to your local business owners and keep your money in YOUR community.

Try going to Lowe's and ask if they will contribute to your local boy scouts or any other non profit, they turn everyone down. Lowe's is a place that should never be shopped, they are like WalMart and are complete vultures. Stay Away from Lowes. And they pay like [PoorWordUsage]......

[fishwidow]

Official Disclaimer here--that was Mrs. Fishwidow. You might detect that she's bitter and angry with her former employer.

[jwhjr]

Hope it works out for you. As the new one gets installed put some shut off valves on both sides as well as a union on each. Makes the switch out a lot more simple when the next one has to be put in.

Yes unions and shut off valves on each side is an excellent way to install them as you can swap very easily for sure. That's how I did it when I replaced mine a couple of years ago.