Pretty Please Gardy?????

[Jarrod32]

Ben Revere will likely be holding down the #2 spot in a couple years.

It is interesting how things turn around so quickly...just last season, people seemed to be thinking that Span was the second coming and they couldn't run Delmon out of town fast enough.

[Big Dave2]

Plus Delmon could be perennial .300 25 and 100.

He should probably do it ONE time before we start talking about perennial!

[Big Dave2]

Thats a joke right? Lets look at what they have both done in the past 3 years.

Cuddyer could not even start to fill Mauers shoes even with a slow start.

Lets look at what they have done. What exactly has Mauer done that makes him worth 2-1/2 times more than Cuddyer who is already being paid a handsome sum?

Yes, Joe had a really good batting average last year, I get that but if you break down the numbers, how much more valuable is Joe Mauer really?

In 2009:

Cuddyer played in 15 more games than Mauer,

Mauer scored 1 more run than Cuddyer,

Mauer had 31 more hits than Cuddyer,

Cuddyer had 4 more doubles than Joe,

Cuddyer had 6 more triples than Joe,

Cuddyer had 4 more HRs than Joe,

Mauer had 2 more RBI than Cuddyer,

Cuddyer had 2 more stolen bases than Mauer,

Plus Cuddyer probably played 4 or 5 different positions in the field compared to Mauer's 1.

Is the performance difference between these 2 players really 9 mil. vs. 23 mil.? Those numbers look pretty similar to me.

[Rippinlip]

Big Dave I will not argue with your offensive points, but 1 little factor is his ability to work with pitchers and call games. Is it worth the Mega bucks difference, probably not.

[greebs]

in all fairness to Mauer, his salary is year is $12.5 mil and I believe harvey lee mentioned three years worth of stats as opposed to just 2009.

either way, both of them are coming up short so far this year with the production that was expected of them. time to get it going boys. the tigers are right on your tails and if playoffs started today, there would be no home field advantage for the Twin with 5th best record in A.L.

[Nick Kuhn]

He is also comparing RF, where you expect 100 RBI/season out of, compared to a catcher which most teams hope to get 50RBI and a 250 avg out of. It would be the equivalent of saying a 30 goal/50 assist defenseman is the same as a 30 goal/50 assist winger.

As far as Delmon's impatience goes, that's the way he needs to hit. Go up there, swing aggressively and hit the ball hard more times than not. If you start taking pitches you start thinking, and while that may benefit some hitters it certainly hurts others. Besides, the first pitch is often the best pitch to hit.

[DonBo]

As far as Delmon's impatience goes, that's the way he needs to hit. Go up there, swing aggressively and hit the ball hard more times than not. If you start taking pitches you start thinking, and while that may benefit some hitters it certainly hurts others. Besides, the first pitch is often the best pitch to hit.

Hey, don't knock his impatience. He's already got more walks this year than he had all last year. He's a much improved hitter than he's been in the recent past.

[Big Dave2]

He is also comparing RF, where you expect 100 RBI/season out of, compared to a catcher which most teams hope to get 50RBI and a 250 avg out of. It would be the equivalent of saying a 30 goal/50 assist defenseman is the same as a 30 goal/50 assist winger.

No, I am comparing Mauer to other Marquee players because of the contract he signed this year. He has now opened himself up to being compared with players like A-Rod because of the contract, not just other catchers.

[Big Dave2]

in all fairness to Mauer, his salary is year is $12.5 mil and I believe harvey lee mentioned three years worth of stats as opposed to just 2009.

His salery is 12.5 this year and last but those numbers were what the salery increase was based upon. I doubt that his production can get much higher in the future.

[Coach1310]

Lets look at what they have done. What exactly has Mauer done that makes him worth 2-1/2 times more than Cuddyer who is already being paid a handsome sum?

Yes, Joe had a really good batting average last year, I get that but if you break down the numbers, how much more valuable is Joe Mauer really?

In 2009:

Cuddyer played in 15 more games than Mauer,

Mauer scored 1 more run than Cuddyer,

Mauer had 31 more hits than Cuddyer,

Cuddyer had 4 more doubles than Joe,

Cuddyer had 6 more triples than Joe,

Cuddyer had 4 more HRs than Joe,

Mauer had 2 more RBI than Cuddyer,

Cuddyer had 2 more stolen bases than Mauer,

Plus Cuddyer probably played 4 or 5 different positions in the field compared to Mauer's 1.

Is the performance difference between these 2 players really 9 mil. vs. 23 mil.? Those numbers look pretty similar to me.

Funny how you only put into NUMBERS the stats that favor Cuddy or are almost the same in favor of Mauer...... someone could easily write...

Joe Mauer is a far superior hitter to Michael Cuddyer regarding average, but is basically the same regarding other offensive statistics.

In regards to Mauer... there are a lot of reasons he is getting PAID..

#1. He is the hometown boy and when it comes to marketing that is a HUGE factor.

#2. Having him on the Twins results in a LOT of $$$ regarding jerseys, team apparel, merchandise etc...

#3. As far as super stars go he is as solid and squeaky clean as they come.

#4. He plays a position where world class hitting and offensive skills are very rare.... His abilities at his position can't even be discussed except when mentioning some all time greats... no catcher in the majors even comes close to him... and to use the same arguement vs. Cuddy... Right fielders with stats like his are kind of a dime a dozen

#5 And as far as stats go... IF you locked up Cuddy for the same $$$ for the next how many years, what would the stats look like. It is easy to look at just one year and say this or that, but the TERM of the contract is pretty important in this case

[Big Dave2]

Funny how you only put into NUMBERS the stats that favor Cuddy or are almost the same in favor of Mauer...... someone could easily write...

Joe Mauer is a far superior hitter to Michael Cuddyer regarding average, but is basically the same regarding other offensive statistics.

In regards to Mauer... there are a lot of reasons he is getting PAID..

#1. He is the hometown boy and when it comes to marketing that is a HUGE factor.

#2. Having him on the Twins results in a LOT of $$$ regarding jerseys, team apparel, merchandise etc...

#3. As far as super stars go he is as solid and squeaky clean as they come.

#4. He plays a position where world class hitting and offensive skills are very rare.... His abilities at his position can't even be discussed except when mentioning some all time greats... no catcher in the majors even comes close to him... and to use the same arguement vs. Cuddy... Right fielders with stats like his are kind of a dime a dozen

#5 And as far as stats go... IF you locked up Cuddy for the same $$$ for the next how many years, what would the stats look like. It is easy to look at just one year and say this or that, but the TERM of the contract is pretty important in this case

The reason I used those certain stats are because they are the big ones. They are the ones that actually tell the story. I stated right in my post that Joe Mauer had a superior batting average, that is obvious. What I wanted people to understand is the real difference between a .276 BA and a .365 BA. It is 30 hits in 523 ABs for Mauer. The real numbers that actually show production are Runs scored and RBI which are almost identicle in both players. Please tell me what stats am I leaving out that I should have included? Please don't bring up more averages because that is not as true of an indicator as these stats are. If a guy plays in one game and goes 2 for 4 for a .500 average does that make that player more valuable to the team than Joe Mauer? I don't think anyone would say yes so averages are not the answer. Cuddyer played in 15 more games than Joe last season and had 65 more at bats. That alone makes him a valuable player.

As far as your bullet points above go, I get it that he is a squeaky clean hometown boy makes good and thats the main reason for the contract but we were talking about player production only and the reason why some members of this board want to kick Michael Cuddyer to the curb even though his production is not that far off from the baby jesus himself.

[SledNeck]

Joe Mauer is the best catcher in baseball.

Cuddy isn't even the best OF on the Twins.

[Stratosman]

Perfectly stated right there!

[Harmonica Bear]

With Mauer and Morneau batting in front of anybody, run production better be good (if not great).

[Big Dave2]

Joe Mauer is the best catcher in baseball.

Cuddy isn't even the best OF on the Twins.

You can no longer just compare Joe Mauer to other catchers. He now needs to be compared to the BEST players in the league with a contract like his.

[JacobMHD]

Why can Joe no longer be compared to other catchers?????

Joe's contributions to the team are greater than that of some high paid third baseman or shortstop. He is involved in every pitch during the games he plays. If you want to compare Joe to AROID or JETER go ahead, but they don't contribute to the team like Joe does.

[Big Dave2]

Why can Joe no longer be compared to other catchers?????

Joe's contributions to the team are greater than that of some high paid third baseman or shortstop. He is involved in every pitch during the games he plays. If you want to compare Joe to AROID or JETER go ahead, but they don't contribute to the team like Joe does.

because Joe is now making an absurd amount of money that puts him in the class with the best players in the league.

If A-Rod and Jeter don't contribute to thier team as much as Mauer does then how come the Yankees humiliated the Twins in the Playoffs and went on to win the world series?

[Big Dave2]

Some could even argue that Mauer because of being a catcher contributes to his team even less than a shortstop or 3rd baseman. Joe played 15 less games last year than some of the other starters on the Twins roster. If your team loses the division by 1 or 2 games wouldn't it be likely that if your best offensive player could have played an extra 15 games that he might have helped you win 1 or 2 of them?

[PierBridge]

Quote:

He should probably do it ONE time before we start talking about perennial!

True. I'm just hoping for it to happen. The trade thus far for Delmon has been a disaster of epic proportions until the brief glimmer of hope lately so I'm trying to look on the potential positive side.

But yeah you're right.

[Coach1310]

If A-Rod and Jeter don't contribute to thier team as much as Mauer does then how come the Yankees humiliated the Twins in the Playoffs and went on to win the world series?

First off... this point is completely laughable.... you are now saying Mauer contributes MORE to a team by himself than 2 first ballot hall of famers do... NO PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL can do that....

Secondly.... I think it is pretty to compare the rosters and show that New York's roster was more talented, deeper and had a better pitching staff. On paper, every GM in the league would have taken the Yankees roster in that series...

Lastly.... Since we are all arm chair geniuses, we should be able to figure it out, but if you polled every GM in baseball and said, you can have Mauer and his NEW contract OR all of Cuddy's current contract meaning he starts his contract over today.... NOBODY would say that Cuddy's is a better contract.... I would say the VALUE lies in what a club is willing to pay a player for their services and obviously the Twins along with the rest of baseball find Joe's services more valuable...

[Coach1310]

True. I'm just hoping for it to happen. The trade thus far for Delmon has been a disaster of epic proportions until the brief glimmer of hope lately so I'm trying to look on the potential positive side.

But yeah you're right.

I understand that so far the trade hasn't been what we hoped, BUT for the most part you can't fairly evaluate the trade until all parts are done with the respective teams. If Delmon turns into what we hope, I can't say the trade is laughable, but once again we are talking IF...

Garza was leaving soon anyway... he didn't like the way the Twins handle pitchers so we were getting something for him instead of losing him outright. The only issue I had and still do with the trade was Bartlett... We still haven't completely solved our SS issue since he left and he has been pretty darn good for the Rays... oh I forgot, we got Harris.. nevermind

[Big Dave2]

First off... this point is completely laughable.... you are now saying Mauer contributes MORE to a team by himself than 2 first ballot hall of famers do... NO PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL can do that....

...

I wasn't saying that, in fact I was saying the complete opposite.

[JacobMHD]

Backspace

[Coach1310]

I wasn't saying that, in fact I was saying the complete opposite.

Sorry Dave, misunderstood your point.

[SledNeck]

.310 .346 .507

booyah!