Twisted Line

[Azrael]

About two months ago I put 10# trilene XL on one of my spinning reels for mainly pulling cranks. Problem is its become twisted. I’ve tried to let all the line out behind the boat and reel it back in to no avail. Is there a better line to try? Or could it be the reel or just plain operator error?

[Team Otter]

Was the line spooled onto the reel backward? If the label isn't pointed up on the spool when putting on line, twisting will be your #1 problem.

[upnorth]

Don't crank on the reel if you aren't retrieving line or if the drag is splipping, and some sort of a swivel helps if you have any kind bait that may spin.

[glenn57]

i agree with team otter. that being the main issue.

[Team Otter]

If you're pulling cranks, go to a super line, like Fire Line or Power Pro.

[ec30_06]

What brand of reel? I have seen some cheap ones that twisted line real bad.

[fiskyknut]

Don't count on all spools to wind on correct with label side up, always check after 10 or 12 cranks of the reel. I see a few each year that are label side down!!

Seeing as the behind the boat method aint working I'd say you should maybe check the roller bearing thingy on the bail of your reel.. Sometimes they don't spin and will twist your line aweful.

fiskyknut

[slipperybob]

How much fishing was done? Like # of casts. 100 or 1000 or like 10,000?

[dan z]

otter hit that on the head either have a new spool spooled for you at local pro shops. or just buy power pro or suffix braid and you wont have ne problems. using a swivel helps but they fail sometimes to. mono is non existant on my combos, (oh I still use it for backing)

[Muddog]

If you have a bad eye on you rod or the roller on the reel is bad, it could mess up your line also. I had some mono get twisted once after trolling with a spoon. I never could get the line to lay flat afterwards. That was on a levelwind reel!

Go with a super brade.

[slipperybob]

I suspect the main cause is line memory...going to a braid will address that.

If you cast enough with any line it will eventually twist on you. That is just the nature of the spinning reel. Higher quality equipment helps to minimize those line twist as you reel. Don't really understand the science behind that, but there's an obvious difference in the reels that I use. I believe a grooved line roller with ball bearings in it makes a huge amount of differene.

If you fished all day, all weekend, for a whole month, it's possible that it's time to respool with fresh line. Try some copolymer lines - like Gamma or Silverthread. They may cost more than Trilene XL but their performance merits would justify it. They are less prone to memory issues associated with standard mono lines.

[Azrael]

Thanks for all the feedback. I’m going to try and respool with a copolymer line and go from there.

[slipperybob]

Sometimes lines takes a little while of getting it soaked for like 30 minutes of fishing before it becomes limp and then you can let it out. feather/pinch it between your thumb and finger and reel it back up.

[jigginjim]

I agree with Otter, I use superbraids on most all of my rods. For pulling cranks you can feel a rapalas vibration, sometimes as far as 160 ft behind the boat. It is easier to tell of you have weeds on your lure as you will not feel the vibes. You may need to use a softer tip rod, so you do pull the hooks out. I don't need the hard hook sets with braids as you would with monos.

[BobT]

Quote:

Don't count on all spools to wind on correct with label side up, always check after 10 or 12 cranks of the reel. I see a few each year that are label side down!!

Seeing as the behind the boat method aint working I'd say you should maybe check the roller bearing thingy on the bail of your reel.. Sometimes they don't spin and will twist your line aweful.

Partly correct.

The label up or down doesn't matter. The supply spool is not the same diameter as the spool on your reel. Therefore, as you wind the line onto your reel spool, it will twist because the reel is winding it onto a tigher radius than what it is on the supply spool. The best way to do it is to flip the supply spool over periodically as you wind it on to your reel. I usually flip mine about every 25 cranks or so.

Bob

[Team Otter]

Label up or down doesn't matter? Since when?

[BobT]

It's physics, plain and simple.

edit: Unless the manufacturers are pretwisting the line as they wind it up on the spool but I doubt that very much.

Line twist is caused by the way the line is wound on the reel. Label up always would apply only if the spool on your reel was the same diameter as the supply spool but I haven't seen too many 4" diameter freshwater reels lately. Your reel spool is making multiple revolutions for every rev the line makes coming off the supply spool. It's going to twist.

Bob

[slipperybob]

There's actually many ways the physics part will work for and against the line twist effect. One of the biggest line twist is the result of line memory. If it coils it will twist through the dynamics of physics itself whether the line moves through air or water or in a vacuum space. That part has nothing to do with label side up or not and has more to do with the line roller ball.

Not all fishing line spooled on comes off without twist. Just take the line off the spool and walk a little distance and let it go, it will twist and coil onto itself. Now that maybe line memory or something else like the 'garden hose effect', but it twists. Let's just say some spools are worst than others and it does vary from line type to manufactures.

Spool size difference. Now you'd think that same spool size would eliminate line twists but in fact it doesn't. It makes sense that the same spool size would reduce line twist just to do line memory coil. It's the same size, but distance that line travels from spool to spool and how that's manages can effect the line twists. Try taking line off of one spool and onto another spool of exact same size and you'll still get line twists. I think it's the 'garden hose effect' at work here, I can't be sure. Maybe it's the tension of line on spool and that being relieved while it's off the spool and then the tension from line roller onto spool causing line twist that's all a result of the reel itself.

Now that leads to the reel design itself. The nature of line twist by a spinning reel. All I can say is braid lines are terrible on cheap budget spinning reels. You get the absolute worst line twists that leads to a big fuzz ball of braid line you'll be convinced that braid lines users are dummies. Then again it could be the simple notion of operator error.

For some odd reason I get far less line twist from a small bulk spool rather than a single service spool like ice fishing spool. I can't figure that one, but maybe they've reverse twist it onto the bulk spool - now that's just wishful thinking.

[BobT]

I think many are confusing line twist with coil memory.

The line is spooled onto the supply spool without twist but over time will retain some of the memory of being curved around the spool. This is apparent in what we experience when the line coils up like a spring. This also happens to line that has been resting on a reel spool for extended time. Although I've noticed that Fireline doesn't seem to do this. Dragging the line behind the boat won't eleviate this problem any more than just using the line.

Line twist is caused by wrapping of the line horizontally around the reel spool and is very much the same twist you would get if you rolled the line between your fingers. Dragging the line behind the boat will eleviate this problem because it allows the line to unwind. This twisting is far more troublesome than memory coils because severely twisted line will wrap up on itself and cause the infamous bird's nest. This twisting is often the result of cast/retrieve action. Every time you cast out your line and retreive it, you twist it because of the way the reel wraps it horizontally around the spool. This is why baitcasting reels are better for cast/retreive. They don't twist the line around the spool. Try this. Cast out a jig on a spinning or spincast system, crank it back in but stop when you have about 6 feet of line still out and lift the jig out of the water. You'll see the jig start turning as the line unwinds.

Bob

[fiskyknut]

Well I'm no physicist so can't comment on the physics lesson, but I know for sure I can spool a spinning reel up all the way without twists and coils iffin I have the spool of line laying the right way, label up usually, label down now and then. I'd think cranking it on for X amount of cranks and then flipping it for another X amount of cranks again and again is only gonna make a twisted mess on my spool!!!

[looneyducer]

I've tried up and down and sideways, flipping and flipping again, on the same reel and different ones. What I have found is some spools of line twist bad, right out of the box, and others don't. I now tie on with an arbor knot and throw the spool into a trash can, feather and reel. It doesn't seem to be any more or less effective than anything else, but it sure is a whole lot simpler.

[Team Otter]

I'm sticking with "label up". Great discussion though.

[Jim Almquist]

When I would use Berkley XL or Stren Magnathin I would load up my spools in the boat with the label up and as soon as the spool was full I would let all the line drag behind the boat at about 5 MPH and then wind it back on. Now I tend to use Gamma just it just dose not cause the line twist problems.

[slipperybob]

It's true that the line memory coil twist is one thing and the nature of the spinning reel line wrap twist is another thing, both still lead to undesirable line twist in the end. Even I didn't believe the difference of an expensive reel vs that of the cheap budget reel, but when you don't have to even worry about line twist on the expensive reel after a whole day of fishing casts after casts, you begin to appreciate those minor details taken into consideration. All of that is a result of a combination of things like line type, rod, and reel.

That's why even when you have the spool lable up, that some reels will still get a considerable amount of line twists. That's also why that you eventually get line twists after fishing for a while even when you spooled the line on without any noticeable twists.

[Deitz Dittrich]

great debate!!!!!!!!!!!

The stiffer a line is the less it will twist...

I'm quite surprised you let out all your line and you still say there is a problem.. did you let out all your line with NOTHING on it? no clip nothing? That is what is needed.. NOTHING!!

Line twist in my opinion is 100% operator error in my opinion! I dont mean to be rude, dont want to hurt feeling, but its my opinion and I am sticking to it. Either the way you rig a lure, how you put it on, how you reel in the lure, how you reel against the drag, how you flip the bail over,, all affects line twist.

Some can help in this, but it really still falls back on your own shoulders!