PLOTS & WMA Land for Non-Residents This Week

[marine_man]

Just a quick reminder to all non residents pheasant hunting in ND this week, access to PLOTS and WMA land is not permitted for non residents until October 21st.

I saw several non resident license plates parked near PLOTS land this weekend with orange hunters in the field... hard to be 100% sure, but thought I'd make sure you're all aware of it.

marine_man

[Wayne Sieber]

Thanks MarineMan - Do you know if this rule/law applys to waterfowl hunters also?

[marine_man]

Yes. It applies to all non-resident hunters unfortunately...

marine_man

[hill7410]

Does anybody know if MN has any special laws for non resident hunters? it seems that if the other states do this why isnt MN doing the same. Also why is the non resident price for hunting license's cheaper for MN and the dakota's are much more higher.

[shae1986]

Hill this is a debate that i dont want to get into. Im a non Res to ND and i have decided that i will live with that, and no MN doens't have any restrictions but did pass a law that makes it that the price we pay to hunt ND is the price they pay to hunt here, i believe it passed just last year.

Again the Res vs non-res debate is not fun, gets a lot of people angery and is usually pointless since it is all mainly opinion.

A. Shae

[Ufatz]

The right of a State to charge a different fee for non-resident licenses is well settled in law and precedent-many cases have gone through the courts. North Dakota can charge as much as it wants for non-resident fees. If it gets too high non-residents won't go. Some have already stopped going to NoDak and to other states. If you'll check other neighboring states you'll find similar fees. What is often far more onerous is the attitude of resident hunters toward non-residents.

[huntnfish]

I also saw a few vehicles with plates that were from out of state and wondered what they were doing on the PLOTS land. I believe the resident only thing applies to students going to school in ND also, but could be wrong on that.

[iffwalleyes]

I honestly do not understand ND non resident rules as they apply to plots. Marine_Man and I have spent several hours trying to figure out the game and fish thinking but we can't figure it out. But the rules are rules. So till this next sat. non residents can not hunt on plots whether it is water fowl or upland hunting.

[Ufatz]

My guess is the regulations on PLOTS are designed to assure that resident hunters get first opportunity on lands that were developed and maintained with THEIR tax dollars-presumably. It IS legal to do so and it gives the resident hunter assurance that HIS fish and game agency is looking out for HIS interests. Its okay if the resident guys get first crack at things. It has been tested in courts all the way up and confirmed. See what I mean? a resident guy is presumably paying state taxes and fees etc and he therefore SHOULD have the first chance at that fat rooster. I, as a non-resident-dont't pay those taxes and fees, other than my license, so I SHOULD have to be number two behind the resident guy.Non resident hunters should not get all bent out of shape about it; it is what it is and it will always be that way. I have hunted in many states. What usually causes trouble is a resident hunter attitude. With the number of hunters and fishers declining every year nationally it would be nice if outdoorsmen stuck together more. Now....I hope you ND guys ain't gonna holler at me next week if I come over to get a couple ducks and maybe a rooster! HA!!

[Springerguy1]

Just to make a correction, the PLOTs is not funded by the taxpayers in ND, the PLOTs is funded through license fee's paid by all hunters - both resident and non-resident. It's my guess that the increase in non-resident fees over the past few years is paying for the PLOTs. What I don't care for is a combination of the resident-only seasons (for waterfowl) and limiting access to public hunting. What that translates too is residents having a couple of weeks access to what are supposed to be public (or public access) lands. You can say that is OK, but heaven forbid if Minnesota ever took the same approach to fishing. For those that have followed this debate the laws were passed due to the increased hunting pressure in ND - which really translated to leasing and commercial operations that tied up large tracts of land that were open to hunting. It's a sad compromise, allowing commerical operations to prosper while leveraging public lands (or public access)to keep the resident hunters at bay. The losers are the "average joe/jane" nonresident hunters that can't afford the guides/outfitters and are being priced out of the game and frustrated with limited access. I don't know if PLOTS is open to nonresident college students but I did check with the Game/Fish Dept and I know for a fact that youth under 16 can hunt PLOTs. I was probably one of those vehicles parked around PLOTs this past weekend but was hunting private land bordering PLOTs. Also, my Dad is a ND resident and will walk some PLOTs while driving my vehicle with MN plates - although I have no doubt there were nonresidents (especially from MN) that walked PLOTs without knowing the rules.

[Ufatz]

Springerguy may be right about no DIRECT tax money going into the PLOTS program, but my intent was to show that the rationale for allowing advantages to resident sportsmen is that THEY support the State's fish and game agency,highway taxes and other State programs. The ONLY thing a non-resident spends is license money. Oh, I know, we spend money on beer and gas and grub etc. but the point is the resident sportsmen support their state in a number of ways.Springerguy is absolutely correct when he points out that the MAIN pressure on ND sportsmen has come from large commercial operators leasing up land the local guys used to hunt on. I believe I saw numbers a couple seasons back showing that the number of resident duck hunters, for example, was actually going DOWN...so they weren't out there competing with non-resident swamp strollers anyway. This issue is uncomfortable no matter which state is involved. How it is handled is DIRECTLY controlled by the individual sporsmen's conduct and attitude. But providing advantage to residents, of whatever state, is not going to change and residents should and will expect that it continues.

[wallmounter]

I graduated from UND in 2004, the license you buy as a student is a RESIDENT license and with it should come all of the privaleges equal to any other resident license. Minnesota and Wisconsin have been allowing full time students to get resident licences for years (both small and big game). Unfortunately for me ND didn't institute this until my last 2 years. It is a shame though that it took so long, as the outmigration numbers continue to rise, ND was keeping one of their great recreational opportunities away from their University students, something that may have been persuasive enought to keep some earlier graduates.

[marine_man]

In regard to Non-Resident students in ND, they purchase a resident license are entitled to the benefits as such. I wasn't trying to pick a fight, and understand the issue as when I went to college in ND as a MN resident I purchased non resident licenses and were subject to those rules.

Right, wrong or indifferent it's the law... and that's that I guess.

marine_man

[Springerguy1]

The whole nonresident/resident thing is what it is. - I'm just glad that all of us are civil on this HSOforum. I don't even go to some websites because it such a nasty conversation which is not reflective of the vast majority in ND. I grew up just a few miles south of marine_man and still consider it my home. By the way, if you're heading to SE ND to hunt this week expect to see high hunting pressure. The Melroe factory in Gwinner has laid off the work force all of this week so that's approx 1,000 folks on vacation - and most of them hunt. Big business has finally hit ND, they work those folks 6 days a week for 10 hrs. a day and then lay them off a week before contract negotiations.

[Ufatz]

Oh man.....thats great! I come over three days a year and I'm gonna get a thousand extra guys out there! And I haven't even found a pothole to hunt yet. Story of my life. I think I just threw $200 in license money down the drain....or in the swamp! HA! Thanks. Maybe I'll just sit back and watch and let my baby Lab run around.

[ReelTimes]

As others have said, not really worth the debate. There is no argument that it is the state's right. It just doesn't feel good when other states (such as MN) welcome hunters and fisherman with open arms for the same opening day as all residents, and then don't get similar treatment. But it is what it is.

[iffwalleyes]

Lets keep this on track. Marine_Man started this out as a reminder of the rules. This is not going to turn in to a ND vs. MN thread. It doesn't matter MN rules on fishing that is not applicable to this thread. We are talking about hunting plots land in ND. So after this next Sat non residents can get back on it but till then they are not to be there. Whether with resident family or by yourself.

[CAJ]

I'm a Montana resident with Plot lands in Divide County, and I can't even hunt my own land the first weekend. Isn't that the pits. I pay the taxes and still can't hunt. Now they say that they arn't going to keep my land in the Plots, because they have better places to put it. When it comes out of plots I'm going to have it open to everybody except fish and game people. I've seen them hunt there. CAJ

[LMITOUT]

Being a former ND resident I think that non-residents (which now includes me) should be happy there is such a thing as PLOTS land to hunt. Just think, if this land wasn't dedicated to hunting it would more than likely be posted and everyone would be scratching their heads wondering where to hunt and complaining about all the posted land.

One week to wait is nothing compared to what the alternative could be and was.

If I would have known how much land is dedicated as PLOTS I would have waited a week before heading back for the opener. It was still a good time as I had places to hunt anyway, but there would have been even more opportunities come this Saturday. It did frustrate me as I drove by knowing that I couldn't set foot in these areas, but I also realized instead of those yellow triangular signs in there place would be black and orange "NO HUNTING" signs.

[Shorelunch]

I agree with you LMT. I graduated HS in ND and went to college in SD. I've been a MN resident for 12 years. I go back to ND every year for pheasant hunting. Yeah the $100 license is a drag along with the PLOT land the first week, but like you said, at least that PLOT land is there.

I'm very fortunate that I still have family where we hunt who know the land owners.

[bigdog]

I believe that some of the plots land is open to non-residents the first week - such land is marked by additional signage to the std orange triangle. I have not run across any but I did see one that was marked "no hunting in unharvested crops" and another that additional signs allowing vehicle access.

[marine_man]

Quote:

---

By the way, if you're heading to SE ND to hunt this week expect to see high hunting pressure.

---

This is a good comment to point out... if you're headed up here to hunt during the rest of this week I would expect higher than normal hunting pressure due to the Bobcat plant shutdown through the end of the week and MEA/ NDFT/ etc being this week, which means more people out hunting Thursday - Sunday.

The same applies for deer rifle hunting up here. There is a chance that the factory will be shutdown during Deer Rifle season in November.

marine_man

[iffwalleyes]

Quote:

---

Being a former ND resident I think that non-residents (which now includes me) should be happy there is such a thing as PLOTS land to hunt. Just think, if this land wasn't dedicated to hunting it would more than likely be posted and everyone would be scratching their heads wondering where to hunt and complaining about all the posted land.

One week to wait is nothing compared to what the alternative could be and was.

If I would have known how much land is dedicated as PLOTS I would have waited a week before heading back for the opener. It was still a good time as I had places to hunt anyway, but there would have been even more opportunities come this Saturday. It did frustrate me as I drove by knowing that I couldn't set foot in these areas, but I also realized instead of those yellow triangular signs in there place would be black and orange "NO HUNTING" signs.

---

Right on plots are better than Posted Signs

[Captain B.R.K]

After driving by many different PLOTS areas this last week, they are definately good land to be on. I would say almost everything I saw was better than marginal for pheasant hunting.

ND does have something right with its PLOTS program. I just wish it wasn't closed to non-residents for the first week, week-half.