What a dang waste and shame!

[leech~~]

If you get a chance to drive by the old Potlach paper plant up in Brainerd some time before they smash them all. You will see 1000's of recalled VW's being scraped for Volkswagen admitting to circumventing the emissions control system. I go by this just about every weekend and it is even more full now with all the open areas packed.  There are sites like this in other states as well. What a dang waste of lots of natural resources and labor.

Edited June 21, 2017 by leech~~

[RebelSS]

Wave a few bucks in a yard guys face, and drive off with a car cheap. Fix the emissions to comply and ya got a good car.....

[bobbymalone]

i thought the newer ones were getting fixed and sent back to the dealer.

 

What a bonehead move by VW to cheat the emissions tests.   The notion they claim that there were a handful of engineers that went rogue is total hogwash.

[rundrave]

i believe Volkswagen is waiting to see if they can get the EPA to approve fixes for the cheating cars or if they will be forced to send the vehicles to the salvage yard

[RebelSS]

It was a done deal in May. After buyback, they can do what they want with them, since it's now their vehicle. Except maybe put them back on the road. I'd like to know if those were all buybacks or dealer's inventories....

 

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2017/05/11/volkswagen-3-liter-diesel-settlement/101559112/

[leech~~]

I thought that I read somewhere it's around 550,000 vehicles!  You can also see a few Audi's in the mix when driving by.

[RebelSS]

Oofda! Trade 'em to Cuba for seegars. 

[delcecchi]

Problem is that there isn't a reasonable fix that would make them compliant.   So, what does one do with a bunch of cars that cannot be made legal to sell?   

 

Could they be allowed to be exported to less enlightened countries?    Better ask a bureaucrat!!

[RebelSS]

I find it hard to believe they can't make it compliant. Give me one and I bet I can get the right stuff. Hard to believe the buyout was cheaper than doing that...

[delcecchi]

The motor puts out too much NOx.  The engineers couldn't get it to run while meeting the specs is why they cheated in the first place.    They still can't figure out a way to make it compliant (other than bribing the EPA to retroactively change the rules.)   Now they can't do what they couldn't do then.   So they own a bunch of cars.  

 

Why do you think making them compliant would be so simple?  

[leech~~]

I think Reb is talking about making it run on chicken pooop (Scheisse) in German so the smell will trick the sensors! 

Edited June 21, 2017 by leech~~

[RebelSS]

*Burp* I just finished my grilled chicky thighs....not a bad idea leech! Maybe pig guts....knockwurst! Del, can you get right on it, maybe try for goose poop....

[delcecchi]

I think running a diesel off methane would be sort of tough...... And the expense of the EPA testing,  out of my bracket. 

[RebelSS]

Oh, just stuff a goose in it, Del!! It'll work! I know it will!! 

 

https://youtu.be/DK8MN-wtOBs

[PurpleFloyd]

I would buy one and drive as is. All they did was make the engine more reliable with more power and better economy. It's a travesty that the government made such a big deal out of it and if Trump wants to do something positive he should do an executive order that allows those cars back on the road with no financial harm to VW and as long as he is at it he should allow the domestic truck manufacturers to get rid of the DEF and other engine killing tech.

[bobbymalone]

16 minutes ago, PurpleFloyd said:

I would buy one and drive as is. All they did was make the engine more reliable with more power and better economy. It's a travesty that the government made such a big deal out of it and if Trump wants to do something positive he should do an executive order that allows those cars back on the road with no financial harm to VW and as long as he is at it he should allow the domestic truck manufacturers to get rid of the DEF and other engine killing tech.

 

Any other products you are fine with the manufacturer lying to consumers? 

 

Whether you like the emissions regs or not, not sure why you are so supportive of liars and cheats. 

 

Besides, those VW diesels are librul yuppie cruisers. 

[PurpleFloyd]

3 hours ago, bobbymalone said:

 

Any other products you are fine with the manufacturer lying to consumers? 

 

Whether you like the emissions regs or not, not sure why you are so supportive of liars and cheats. 

 

Besides, those VW diesels are librul yuppie cruisers. 

If they make it better because of stupid government mandates it wouldn't bother me at all.

 

In fact, the Dodge ram diesel that I used to have had something from Daimler Benz that allowed it to meet the standards without DEF. I would not be surprised if they did something similar with those diesels and if they did I applaud them. The best thing anyone can do with the diesel trucks is delete the emissions and unlock the power and economy that are robbed from them. 

 

[delcecchi]

If you have been following the story, the reason VW got in this mess is they didn't want to license technology from BMW (or maybe Mercedes) and chose to develop their own.   When it couldn't be made to work properly, they chose to cheat rather than bite the bullet. 

 

Long discussions of what happened as the story broke

 

 

[leech~~]

46 minutes ago, delcecchi said:

If you have been following the story, the reason VW got in this mess is they didn't want to license technology from BMW (or maybe Mercedes) and chose to develop their own.   When it couldn't be made to work properly, they chose to cheat rather than bite the bullet. 

 

Long discussions of what happened as the story broke

 

 

 

Wow, Del I forgot all about that little discussion you started two years ago.  All the fun folks were in on it, even the LIMTOUT.

That's what happens when you have short term memory loss and pictures bring on new thoughts and emotions. 

Let's just call this threat the "What a dang waste and shame!" More of an aftermath threat?  K

 

And Del was there, and PFloyd, and Reb and Leech stop by and even the evil LIMTOUT was there! It was a nightmare!  

 

Edited June 22, 2017 by leech~~

[PurpleFloyd]

License what technology, this kind? 

 

 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp/2017/04/27/after-vws-record-fine-mercedes-benz-parent-daimler-could-be-next.html

 

 

"In light of the ongoing governmental information requests, inquiries and investigations, and our own internal investigation, it cannot be ruled out that the authorities might reach the conclusion that Mercedes-Benz diesel vehicles have similar functionalities," Daimler said in its newly released quarterly report.

The maker first acknowledged in January that authorities had begun probing its handling of diesel emissions. That was the same month that VW agreed to settle a criminal probe by the U.S. Justice Department, a federal judge this past week approving the payment of a $2.8 billion fine.

Almost 40 times the legal limit

In the VW case, the mainstream German automaker rigged the software controlling two diesel engines to recognize when a vehicle was undergoing emissions tests and then adjust pollution levels. In real-world situations, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency asserted, those powerplants would produce up to 40 times the legal limit for pollutants like smog-causing oxides of nitrogen.

Since the scandal broke in September 2015, regulators in the U.S. and the European Union have begun rechecking the emissions claims made by other manufacturers, including Daimler, General Motors, Fiat Chrysler Automobiles and others.

In January of this year, the EPA took aim at FCA, alleging that it may have used its own, rigged software on products like the Ram 1500 EcoDiesel which "appeared to cause the vehicles to perform differently when being tested" than when in use in real-world conditions.

That same month, Daimler said that what the EPA was concerned about "apparently includ(ed) functionalities that are common in diesel vehicles, as undisclosed Auxiliary Emission Control Devices (AECD)."

While the German parent of both the Mercedes-Benz and Smart brands did not confirm it had broken the law, it laid open the possibility that its own diesel emissions strategy could be in trouble.

"If these or other inquiries, investigations, legal actions and/or proceedings result in unfavorable findings, an unfavorable outcome or otherwise develop unfavorably, Daimler could be subject to significant monetary penalties, remediation requirements, vehicle recalls, process improvements and mitigation measures," Daimler stated.

[delcecchi]

Could be that others cheated also.   I was relying on memory about the BMW connection and hypothesized that Mercedes would also have been a possibility.   I did say "maybe mercedes".  

 

In any case, VW cheated on emissions for many years with the assent of the highest levels of management.  

 

Apparently making a small diesel that runs ok and doesn't make too much pollution at an acceptable cost is really hard.

[swamptiger]

18 hours ago, leech~~ said:

If you get a chance to drive by the old Potlach paper plant up in Brainerd some time before they smash them all. You will see 1000's of recalled VW's being scraped for Volkswagen admitting to circumventing the emissions control system. I go by this just about every weekend and it is even more full now with all the open areas packed.  There are sites like this in other states as well. What a dang waste of lots of natural resources and labor.

 

 

This is very earth friendly, and good tree huggers and bureaucrats everywhere love it...

[rundrave]

they will all probably end up scrapped then. you can probably expect the junkyards to soon be filled with Volkswagens that will be missing the ECU, DPF, and have holes in their engines.

 

cash for clunkers 2.0?

[PurpleFloyd]

1 hour ago, delcecchi said:

Could be that others cheated also.   I was relying on memory about the BMW connection and hypothesized that Mercedes would also have been a possibility.   I did say "maybe mercedes".  

 

In any case, VW cheated on emissions for many years with the assent of the highest levels of management.  

 

Apparently making a small diesel that runs ok and doesn't make too much pollution at an acceptable cost is really hard.

So, first you tell me " if you were watching the story closely" then when I posted a link supporting what I said to be fact, your response was that your memory is bad and you were making a hypothesis. Classic. 

[PurpleFloyd]

19 hours ago, leech~~ said:

If you get a chance to drive by the old Potlach paper plant up in Brainerd some time before they smash them all. You will see 1000's of recalled VW's being scraped for Volkswagen admitting to circumventing the emissions control system. I go by this just about every weekend and it is even more full now with all the open areas packed.  There are sites like this in other states as well. What a dang waste of lots of natural resources and labor.

I would guess it is going to create more pollution rounding up, transporting, scrapping and reclaiming those cars than the excess they would have emitted in their lifespan vs the cars that replace them.