Doe Permits

[NWKR]

My goal was to get the antlerless tag and not fill it. At least our area has a reasonable number of tags at 300. I have seen groups of 8-10 deer on some local fields, that must mean there are too many deer in our 830 sq mile permit area 

[Satchmo]

I got one, my dad got one and at least 3 others in our group got one.

Went out to my son's stand to scout and we ended up seeing nearly a dozen deer out at dusk. 

Now that a noisy few got the audit thing passed there is silence on the lack of deer that are supposedly out there. Do you suppose the whole thing worked so good that it caused the population to rebound before the audit even happened and a single change suggested by said audit was implemented?

So you take your specific situation, and conclude that all the fuss over the low deer populations statewide are all just hot air. Sad part is your whole group will probably now enter the woods with a "Brown it's Down" attitude. Your opinion is not only short sighted, but in my opinion, PURE IGNORANCE!!!

[PurpleFloyd]

So you take your specific situation, and conclude that all the fuss over the low deer populations statewide are all just hot air. Sad part is your whole group will probably now enter the woods with a "Brown it's Down" attitude. Your opinion is not only short sighted, but in my opinion, PURE IGNORANCE!!!

We have no woods. We harvest deer for meat, not antlers.Ignorance? How so?

So you go out and see a dozen deer at your son's stand and now the state is overrun with deer?  If you actually read all the DNR meeting and survey results, it wasn't a "noisy few".  It was a noisy majority.

I never said the state was overrun. Only that since the audit thing there has been literally zero threads on the lack of deer compared to the constant barrage that set the stage running up to it. The majority at the meeting was still a minority but when a select few have an agenda as was the case, they tend to have a higher participation rate. Nothing special.

Edited October 9, 2015 by PurpleFloyd

[Satchmo]

Floyd....you state that there has been a population rebound. You base this on what? ....... just the fact that your group got doe tags and you saw a dozen deer one night? That's preposterous! You obviously read the latest DNR press release. The only agenda that those vocal folks had was a concern for the health of our deer herd and transparency by the very government agency that WE fund to manage that herd.

 

As far as the lack of threads about it on this page, I can assure you that those voices are still out there advocating for better herd management for all of us. You may never see it here, which is sad. This page was the premier MN outdoor page for years after I signed up in 2001, but doesn't have near the participation it used to. You could learn a lot from those guys if you had more of an open mind.

 

Edited October 9, 2015 by Satchmo

[nofishfisherman]

We have no woods. We harvest deer for meat, not antlers.Ignorance? How so?

I never said the state was overrun. Only that since the audit thing there has been literally zero threads on the lack of deer compared to the constant barrage that set the stage running up to it. The majority at the meeting was still a minority but when a select few have an agenda as was the case, they tend to have a higher participation rate. Nothing special.

I'm not sure the number of posts on the topic or the lack thereof really means anything.  if you haven't noticed there are a lot less posts on just about every topic outside silly town.  There just isn't as much chatter on any topic as there once was.

Besides I think the biggest complaint most people had was that hunters felt deer populations were low and that the DNR wasn't adjusting their management plan accordingly.  This has changed somewhat with an increase to the number of lottery zones and the creation of buck only zones.  The DNR has gone as far as saying the harvest last year was going to be the lowest in many years and that it was by design.  I think that satisfied many hunters at least for the short term.  Now we wait and see how the herd rebounds and what the DNR plans to do long term.  While we wait we can enjoy the excitement of checking out if we were lucky enough to draw a doe tag.  I think most of us aren't too upset if we don't get one as most understand its for the greater good of the herd.

[SmellEsox]

You are the minority Purple Floyd.  SMH.

[NWKR]

I'm not sure the number of posts on the topic or the lack thereof really means anything.  if you haven't noticed there are a lot less posts on just about every topic outside silly town.  There just isn't as much chatter on any topic as there once was.

Besides I think the biggest complaint most people had was that hunters felt deer populations were low and that the DNR wasn't adjusting their management plan accordingly.  This has changed somewhat with an increase to the number of lottery zones and the creation of buck only zones.  The DNR has gone as far as saying the harvest last year was going to be the lowest in many years and that it was by design.  I think that satisfied many hunters at least for the short term.  Now we wait and see how the herd rebounds and what the DNR plans to do long term.  While we wait we can enjoy the excitement of checking out if we were lucky enough to draw a doe tag.  I think most of us aren't too upset if we don't get one as most understand its for the greater good of the herd.

I hope most hunters out there are also thinking about whether or not they should be shooting a doe in the area they hunt. We have a few acres more than most and we will not be taking does this year. We are lottery and bow hunting so we could take a few. If we had new/youth hunters in our group we would be ok with them shooting 1-2, but we don't have any this year.

Maybe in PF's view I am just in it for the antlers since I will shoot young spike buck if I get a good shot with the bow this year, but I won't pass up a bigger buck if it gives me a shot first  

[leechlake]

Moderation is the key.  This past month I've got too much grief for shooting a few grouse (I shot two grouse)and keeping some fish from my buddy and neighbor up north.  It almost seems like an envy thing.  He has anti-PETA bumper stickers and is completely pro NRA beyond belief.  As long as he's doing the killing it's fine, if it's someone else he's turned into some Hollywood leftist vegan.

If he wants to shoot a doe this year I will congratulate him and give him a pat on the back.  It's no fun getting hacked on for choosing to do what you think is right when it's legal.  Same thing on HSO. 

 

 

[nofishfisherman]

I agree with NWKR.  The DNR does its job by managing the herd by limiting doe permits for an entire zone.  However, its up to the individual hunters to assess the herd in their immediate area.  If you don't think the herd in your specific location can sustain additional doe harvest even though you have a legal doe tag then its up to you as a hunter to make that call and let the does live another year.

The area I hunt in zone 259 seems to have a good population of does based on what we saw last year and most of the does were still being followed around by sets of twins.  If I were to have drawn a doe tag I would have felt ok filling it.  In years past I probably wouldn't have filled it even if I had drawn it.

[reinhard1]

Doesn't it really matter where you hunt as far as deer population.  Can't speak for any other area except the area I hunt.  I hunt in northern Minnesota in area 180.  The two winters prior to last year were very hard on the deer herd there along with the toll from the wolves in my opinion.  I don't think that there is anyone there that will say the herd has rebounded or anywhere near to it.  Just cant happen in one season.  I was glad to see our area bucks only.  This year it's lottery.  Would have been happy if it was bucks only for another year, but it is what it is.  I have hunted the same spot since the 60's.  I have seen this cycle happen many times.  I think the DNR is doing the best they can with the information they have.   Last year I haven't seen the sign's of wolves or head as many as years before.  Only seen one loner set of tracks and we had snow.  I know there are a lot of hunters who are frustrated, but things will stabilize over time.  good luck.

[nofishfisherman]

It for sure matters where you hunt.  Even within a single zone you can see major differences from area to area.  Thats why its important for hunters to make some decisions based on whats best for their area.  The DNR may say your zone is ok to support Hunters Choice because of overall deer populations within the zone but if your specific land isn't showing enough deer then hunters need to take it upon themselves to self limit their harvest.

That might mean passing on a doe in a HC zone or leaving a doe tag unfilled in a lottery zone, or tagging only one doe instead of 2 or more in managed or intensive zones.  The DNR can only do so much, in the end its up to all of us to pull the trigger so we have the final say in what deer get taken on our own land. 

[leechlake]

RH1 is right again.  I've hunted what is now 259 (used to be 245) between Walker and Bemidji for 36 years.  Last Winter we never had the driveway plowed once so that helped and the year before was a good one for the deer too.  The 3 Winters before were no good for the deer if my memory serves.   Even in the better years deer numbers are nothing to "write home about" in my opinion.

I can tell the good years looking back in our journal because that's when some of our guys that don't hunt too much have some luck merely due to deer numbers.  The food and camaraderie is always good but it is more fun when you have more deer around and you can sit in your stand with more "hope" than the years when you feel like you may as well be hunting on the moon.

When in doubt I will pass on does, overpopulation in our area has rarely if ever been an issue.  The red squirrel population always seems healthy though?

[nofishfisherman]

I also hunt 259 over toward Lake George.  The last 4-5 years have been tough although much better numbers last year although only saw 2 bucks (one spike and one 6 pointer).

However, those red squirrels sure sound like a 10 point buck plowing through the brush at times.

[icehole10]

I hunt in 184 nw of Bemidji, and we are seeing quite a few more does with young ones this year. A couple of years back we saw does, but not one had a fawn with her. This would be before season, while up bear baiting and just general driving around in the evening looking for deer.  The deer population is definitely not where it was before the intensive harvest took place, but I feel in the area where we hunt that it has rebounded slightly. Mother nature has a lot to do with that, as well as predators. I drew a doe tag this year, and if I wasn't going to be sitting with my nephew would have no problem filling it.

Edited October 10, 2015 by icehole10

[SmellEsox]

Here's the deal.  This year's yearlings (1 1/2 year olds) were born after one of the hardest winters in the last 100+ years.  Yearlings make up the vast majority of the buck harvest in MN.  It will be very interesting to see what buck harvest is like this fall as a result.  In theory it should be down as that year class should be smaller due to winter mortality or does that aborted fawns.  We shall see I guess.  The good news is that it appears there are quite a few fawns this year in central MN.  The bad news is, I suspect these fawns will make up a pretty good percentage of the antlerless harvest this year, especially in the managed permit areas around my neck of the woods..

[Satchmo]

I hunt in 246 near Nimrod. Granted, we have more than your average amount of predators running around my place, but the deer herd is definately coming back from what it was a couple years ago.   A big part of that, I believe, is the fact that my neighbors to the south are like minded. We all believe that to get the deer herd to where it needs to be to have a sustainable doe harvest, we need to manage for the conditions on the ground even if the DNR paper models say we can shoot them.

Our eastern and northern boundries are protected by large swamp areas, so we have no outside pressures there. The western boundry is a swampy creek area that has 3 - 80 acre parcels butted up to our properties. These 3 groups have continued to shoot everything they possibly can, because the DNR says the herd is coming back. Then they all complain that they are not seeing many deer. Come on people, where have all the independent thinkers gone? Do yourself a huge favor. Manage your own deer herd and practice some restraint.........Rant over!!

[leechlake]

Frankly, a lot of the choices groups make are dependent on their hunting party.  I'm 48 years old and through bow hunting, rifle, muzzy over the years I' wager I've killed 25 deer give our take.  Mostly smaller bucks in Minnesota, a couple nice ones in So Dak, and probably 8 does.   If I hunted with 3 others guys that were the same age and had done the same things it's easy to not shoot a doe or small buck if we don't want to do that.

If you have a kid in the group (which we've had) or someone who hasn't shot many deer (which we still have) our decisions ending up being different.  Frankly, my son started hunting with me in South Dakota where the farmer has a strict "big buck" policy.  First morning we hunted there he saw 12 bucks and I couldn't let him shoot any of them.  Next year, same thing happened.  Guess what?  He doesn't like deer hunting anymore.  I thought he had the Golden Ticket for deer hunting and I should have just brought him to a spot where he could kill a deer.  He was twelve-14 years old.

[O.T.C.]

I'm with you nofishfisherman, within a given zone it can vary a lot. Living on a farm and being good with my neighbors we talk year round about deer and observe and eventually hunt. This AM minutes ago, had 7 deer on our gravel so sped down there a bit to check them. Very obviously a doe with 2 fawns together, the other 4 were definite does, not yearling does, adult doeheads and apparently their fawns are gone and not by vehicles in this area. So mild winter isn't a slam dunk on fawn survival, I'd assume the large coyote population, bears, bobcats, and timberwolves have all been sighted more then enough since April and yes had wolves across the gravel and coyotes behind the house yipping on the same evening, pockets of thick predators can hamper things a touch.

[Chuby Minnow]

I know it is what it is but the frustrating part of this for me this year is the enjoyment of taking out kids during rifle and helping them get their first deer only to find out that even youth are not allowed to harvest a doe in our area. After all the hype built up and the preparation of food plots etc, the child that I am flying up from Ohio is buck only as well. Arg!!!! oh well, hopefully a buck steps out for him......

[Satchmo]

O.T.C.

I have a very similar situation in the fact that, while my herd along the edge of big swamp country is coming back, it is slower than in many areas. With the wolves, coyotes, bobcats, & bears, I have seen a couple adult does with no fawns and have not seen a set of twins yet. A couple miles south in the pasture lands, there are several sets of twins. The rancher and his buddy trapped 35 coyotes out of that area last winter though.