APR 2013?

[MOSSY]

My point exactly the way it was done was not very accurate

[Spike76]

APR's and experimental slots are wrong. It is not the D.N.R.'s job to limit size of deer and fish, so others can have bigger ones. Work hard or go without.

[PEATMOSS]

APR's and experimental slots are wrong. It is not the D.N.R.'s job to limit size of deer and fish, so others can have bigger ones. Work hard or go without.

Big difference here. Fish slots are usually put in place to protect breeding sized females. We all benefit by having an increase in both the numbers of eaters as well as more large fish to catch. We also are all equally inconvenienced by having to return medium sized fish to the water.

APR's on the other hand benefit those for whom antlers have become their primary source of hunting satisfaction. They also disproportionately benefit those with their own land and those that have the luxury of hunting more days.

[NoWiser]

Seems you've changed your views a bit since last year, but looks to be because you are taking it upon yourself to go find your deer. Sounds very rewarding indeed.

It's actually been a few years since I've been harcore Pro-APR. The last few years I've been fairly indifferent. I've just realized that whining and blaming everyone else for my lack of success at hunting mature bucks was not doing anyone any good. You are right on about deer hunting being even more rewarding now. For me, the reward I get from deer hunting is equal to the work I put into it. Last year I didn't even get a glimpse of a big buck (I saw 3 deer in 7 days of hunting), but I sure had fun chasing them and knowing they were around! And, when I shoot a big one this November, it will be that much sweeter!

On a side note regarding the posts about the old deer not being as good of table fair. The last 4 deer I shot included 3 very mature bucks from northern MN and about a 2 year old doe from farm country. The best tasting was a 240 lb (dressed) buck I shot in the middle of a swamp. The worst, by far, was the doe I shot on the edge of a clover field surrounded by corn. Just an interesting note I thought I'd add....

[surewood]

It's always nice when people get labeled "horn porn" guys or the guys that don't want to hunt hard to get a mature buck. Nice way to get your point across. Holds no water. All the Apr guys I know are some of the hardest working deer hunters I've met.. Hey, here's a fact. They're called antlers, but horn porn rhymes so insult us with that. Maybe I'll call some of you the "brown it's down guys". Wait, that doesn't hold water, but it rhymes and is used for dramatic effect to get my point across. Or maybe I should speak my opinion which I'm entitled to without insults cause it's okay for other people to have different views on issues.

[TruthWalleyes]

So the heavy Apr crowd that works hard have not been rewarded with big antlers... Must be time for legislation then

[flipper]

The problems come in when one group of hunters tries to force the other group to do things their way through regulations. I don't see anyone telling you that you have to shoot bucks you don't want to. My point is that hunters should have the same choices they have always had. If I wanted to see a change it would be an end to party hunting but that is another topic completely.

[surewood]

So you're assuming that people that are pro Apr haven't killed mature deer? Wrong again. Once again and this is from personal experience, the pro Apr guys I know that work hard have been rewarded with mature deer. Even with that we have a different views then others. Been here done that so I'll end my last post about Apr the way I've done before. I'm not gonna worry about it unless there is a vote for it in my area.

[james_walleye]

Waste Of Time Surewood. Your Dealing With Someone That Doesn't Even Understand The Basic Math When It Comes To Polls And Sample Sizes.

[surewood]

One last thing. Forgot my emoticon to stress my criticism of other peoples views.

[james_walleye]

Truth Do You Have Any Facts Straight? Feel Free To Investigate Who Went To The Legislature On This Issue Originally And Then Maybe You Will Understand Why It Had To Go Back To The Legislature To Be Straightened Out....

[TruthWalleyes]

So you're assuming that people that are pro Apr haven't killed mature deer? Wrong again. Once again and this is from personal experience, the pro Apr guys I know that work hard have been rewarded with mature deer. Even with that we have a different views then others. Been here done that so I'll end my last post about Apr the way I've done before. I'm not gonna worry about it unless there is a vote for it in my area.

I've heard this statement many times. Why the push for APR then? So I can shoot superior deer? Is it because you want bigger horns than your already very successful hunts?

James, enlighten us on the origins of APR. In sure I'm not the only one who doesn't know, and if you include a mailing address you guys could send them pictures of your deer as a thank you.

[surewood]

It's a waste of time arguing with you about it. You won't change my mind, I won't change yours. It's not like you've brought in a new interesting fact about this then the last 20,000 posts. I only chimed in cause of the b s labeling.

[PEATMOSS]

It's most certainly ok for all of us to have different points of view surewood. What one side is doing is forcing their way on everyone else by force of law and that is what draws out the emotional responses, name calling and sarcasm.

If hanging antlers on your wall is what floats your boat, cool. Just don't force the rest of us into your silly little game and we'll all get along fine.

[surewood]

Many regulations/ laws force their way on all of us. Nothing new. I'm not asking anyone to "play my silly game". I'm not worried about it unless there is a vote that would effect my hunting. Then it wouldn't be forced on all of us, just whoever ends up being the minority. All I did was defend Apr guys from the name calling/labeling.

[PEATMOSS]

There are people like you who believe that the majority has a right to impose their beliefs on the minority and their are people like me that believe that personal freedom and liberty should rule.

Be careful with this "majority rules" line of reasoning you are pushing. As our society becomes more urbanized, things like gun ownership and hunting are becoming increasingly minority activities. By your own reasoning, the city folk should be able to dictate an end to hunting and gun ownership by simple majority vote.

[tfran123]

Would you rather fish a lake with all walleyes capped out at 13" because of over harvest or fish a lake that gives you the eaters and chances at bigger fish as well.

I know, can't make the connection can you. It's really not that hard and furthermore you're in a box. . . .

[mntatonka]

My point exactly the way it was done was not very accurate

actually, the theory behind the survey was pretty good and based on accepted practice. However, I personally believe the questions on the survey were written in a way to get a specific result (like most surveys)

[TruthWalleyes]

I practice qdm myself, just don't like the legislation. I might be in the minority of those against Apr. If much rather see hunters choose to pass than be forced too. I would love to see the DNR or registration stations collect information like antler points and inches.

I bet many of you would like to see that info also... It will likely go up and down year to year depending on a lot of environmental conditions like nutrition as well as early/late births due to high doe to buck ratios and you would likely not see a continued increase in points and inches due to continued practice of Apr.

[TruthWalleyes]

actually, the theory behind the survey was pretty good and based on accepted practice. However, I personally believe the questions on the survey were written in a way to get a specific result (like most surveys)

My brother filled out that survey with no knowledge of the Apr that has taken place in se mn. Of course he responded YES to the question " do you want bigger bucks"

When I told him that meant Apr, he was disappointed he answered it that way. I was surprised he got that survey, but I think it was a state wide survey and not the zone 300 that I got.

[surewood]

I don't think hunters voting on a deer reg that still gives everyone the right to hunt deer just a different way compares to getting our guns and hunting taken away. Gun vs anti gun is a very different group then pro Apr and anti Apr.

[picksbigwagon]

Well this is earlier than expected, but after the past five years (?) there is still quite a divide on this topic. I don't like the DNR instituting this while still allowing the firearm season to occur during the rut but that is my opinion. There are vocal/active groups in SE MN that have pushed for this and from the people I have talked to in 346 and 349, the hunting is great. Now that being said, 346 and 349 are unlike 80% of the state of MN and there is a majority of zone 3 that probably shouldn't be APR either, due to their lack of deer density......

Yes my opinion has changed over the past five years, but this is year 4 if I am not mistaken, and I agree with truth, the DNR should be taking measurements or at least counting points, not expecting Jonny "ear gauge" or Suzie "inktopus" to show any hustle, motivation or desire to leave their spot behind the counter at the BP station in Houston.

[96trigger]

SEMN is a unique area in Mn. It can handle APR. I primarily hunt zones 342 and 344 and I can say that personally, the hunting is great. The hunters that I talk to are fond of APR, much more than they were 4 years ago. Not many of them have tagged the big bucks and I would label very few trophy hunters. What they are having is a more pleasurable experience hunting. There are more deer and a greater chance at seeing a nice buck. Many of them are in their 60's and in the last couple of years have seen the biggest bucks of their lives,even though none of them were successful, they commented on how great it was just to see those deer,even if they were 200 yards away through the binoculars.

If you don't believe the science behind it, fine, you are entitled to your belief. If you fundamentally disagree with the DNR regulating what we can and cannot shoot, you are entitled to your opinion. Even though i find that it is an odd one as the DNR has been regulating that since its inception.

I don't think APR should ever limit ones ability to harvest a deer. In SEMN, it is not uncommon to see 4 or 5 deer a day. I don't believe APR has limited hunter success in this area. If you want venison,it is here and not terribly difficult to come by for the average hunter and weekend warrior. I cannot speak for the rest of the state, nor would I push for statewide APR as every area is different and the goal of the DNR should be to regulate for population before age structure.

These are just my thoughts on it, I'm sure I will probably get labeled and verbally prosecuted for them by some of you that feel the need to call names, cut and paste snippets, and find witty pictures or quotes that depict pro APR guys as the evil hunting empire and the loud mouth group. In reality, we are hunters just like you, we take our kids hunting and enjoy time at deer camp with old friends and relatives. We enjoy being in the woods just as much as you, but have diifferent views on what we want our own hunting experiences to be.

On a side note, it's a bummer to come on here and read some of the garbage that gets posted, it has taken away some of The enjoyment of the site...there are a certain few that are essentially cyber bullies on this site,berating and belittling people for their thoughts and view points if it differs from theirs no matter the topic, but I guess that's part of being on a public forum.

[jdog]

well said 96

[NoWiser]

Good post, Trigger. I can't disagree with anything you said.