Fourwheelers?

[PackerBacker12]

We have been hunting a public land for years and have always driven wheelers in it. Within the past 5 years it has been posted NO ATVS and we can no longer drive wheelers in there. I have also read and heard more people saying that they can no longer drive their fourwheelers around their hunting areas anymore. What are your thoughts on the anti atv rules? Minnesota wants to encourage hunting but they are really limiting some peoples areas they can go. We have older guys in our group that cannot hunt the same areas they have hunted because it is way to far to walk in the mornings or drag deer out of. It is very hard to drag deer 2-3 miles out of the woods. I really think that (or hope to believe) that most of the deer hunters that ride the wheelers are respectful and just drive the wheelers close to their stands without tearing up the trails or woods. Then leave the wheeler there till lunch or till dark and drive out of the woods. I guess what I would like to see is a 1-2 week window where ATVs are not allowed in some spots, to let the deer hunters drive fourwheelers. Heck even just for opening weekend! The deer hunters are not the ones tearing up the trails and making huge ruts. We go to our stands park and hopefully be dragging a deer on the way out of the woods after dark. What are your thoughts on the topic?

[muskE]

Last ice season in the Cities anglers were prohibited from driving cars on the ice before the end of the last season due to poor weather conditions and many had a conniption. The attmpt by the county sheriff to save people from themselves was noble but underappreciated in general.

I'm sure there are elements of this in play with the ATV rules that have been set in motion. Ruts, off-trail riding, and land destruction are chief reasons for many ATV policy changes and, while it's sad, there are just those people that don't care about the rules to remain in compliance and ruin it for others.

[charliepete]

I'd be happy if they banned wheelers from deer hunting completely. Somebody is always breaking the law about when they be operated etc. I'd rather have more peace and quiet in the woods. I have a wheeler so not jealousy on my part. I just don't want yahoos riding on every square inch of northern mn. Any place wheelers are allowed becomes a mishmash of spider webbed trails after a while.

[pikerliker]

I'm not a big fan of 4 wheelers and deer hunting. I think that they make the wild areas less wild and increase the noise/traffic in areas that most of the people driving them would not venture without one. I was hunting in Chippewa National forest last week and had 4 wheelers drive near my stand no less than 3 times during "non drive times". At least 2 of those times were during what I consider somewhat of a prime time for deer movement. As far as older hunters go my dad who is 68 and was out hunting with me was also complaining about the 4 wheelers and walked everywhere he went. I don't have a problem with people using them occasionally to pull out a deer, set up a stand before the season, etc it just seems that the rules get abused a lot and there is too much area for the CO's to cover to stop the people driving at off hours, etc. Just my 2 cents.

[Getanet]

My group is in the exact same situation as the OP, except ATVs have been banned for 3 years, not 5. It's getting tougher for the older guys in our group to get back to where we hunt.

When we came out of the woods opening weekend we ran into the CO and my dad asked him why they don't come up with a system where hunters could drive back after legal shooting hours are over to retrieve a deer. The CO basically said my dad was barking up the wrong tree and he just enforces the regs. That's understandable.

What makes us scratch our heads the most is the worry about rut and tearing up the trails. At least where we hunt, it's not the ATVs,it's the logging equipment that tears up the trail.

[Pinusbanksiana]

My group is in the exact same situation as the OP, except ATVs have been banned for 3 years, not 5. It's getting tougher for the older guys in our group to get back to where we hunt.

When we came out of the woods opening weekend we ran into the CO and my dad asked him why they don't come up with a system where hunters could drive back after legal shooting hours are over to retrieve a deer. The CO basically said my dad was barking up the wrong tree and he just enforces the regs. That's understandable.

What makes us scratch our heads the most is the worry about rut and tearing up the trails. At least where we hunt, it's not the ATVs,it's the logging equipment that tears up the trail.

Ok you need to be educated here with these accusations. The only reason that those roads are there in the first place is because of the loggers. Without a timber industry you would have no access at all. Simply put, the roads exist because of logging. They are not there for you to be able to get back to your deer stand, they are there to bring logs out. Got it?

[Getanet]

Easy Pink. Who peed in your Wheaties this morning? I'm not making an accusation, I'm simply stating a fact. People complain about ATVs causing ruts. A multi-ton piece of logging equipment causes a lot more ruts than an ATV on the trail we go in on is all I'm saying.

[maros91]

I'd be happy if they banned wheelers from deer hunting completely. Somebody is always breaking the law about when they be operated etc. I'd rather have more peace and quiet in the woods. I have a wheeler so not jealousy on my part. I just don't want yahoos riding on every square inch of northern mn. Any place wheelers are allowed becomes a mishmash of spider webbed trails after a while.

+1

[laker1]

We have been hunting a public land for years and have always driven wheelers in it. Within the past 5 years it has been posted NO ATVS and we can no longer drive wheelers in there. I have also read and heard more people saying that they can no longer drive their fourwheelers around their hunting areas anymore. What are your thoughts on the anti atv rules? Minnesota wants to encourage hunting but they are really limiting some peoples areas they can go. We have older guys in our group that cannot hunt the same areas they have hunted because it is way to far to walk in the mornings or drag deer out of. It is very hard to drag deer 2-3 miles out of the woods. I really think that (or hope to believe) that most of the deer hunters that ride the wheelers are respectful and just drive the wheelers close to their stands without tearing up the trails or woods. Then leave the wheeler there till lunch or till dark and drive out of the woods. I guess what I would like to see is a 1-2 week window where ATVs are not allowed in some spots, to let the deer hunters drive fourwheelers. Heck even just for opening weekend! The deer hunters are not the ones tearing up the trails and making huge ruts. We go to our stands park and hopefully be dragging a deer on the way out of the woods after dark. What are your thoughts on the topic?

My brother age 69 and I 63 just dragged a 185+ pound buck out 1.7 miles yesterday. That's part of the hunt for us. There are actually few areas that are blocked off. So there is plenty of areas ATV's can still go many places.

I had to move because too many ATV's.The woods became to small.

[Chef]

I'd be happy if they banned wheelers from deer hunting completely. Somebody is always breaking the law about when they be operated etc. I'd rather have more peace and quiet in the woods. I have a wheeler so not jealousy on my part. I just don't want yahoos riding on every square inch of northern mn. Any place wheelers are allowed becomes a mishmash of spider webbed trails after a while.

+2 and do the same for Grouse hunting.

[Pinusbanksiana]

Easy Pink. Who peed in your Wheaties this morning? I'm not making an accusation, I'm simply stating a fact. People complain about ATVs causing ruts. A multi-ton piece of logging equipment causes a lot more ruts than an ATV on the trail we go in on is all I'm saying.

There are policies in place that restrict how and when equipment can be used. If a road is damaged by a logging operation, it is repaired. Nobody peed in my wheaties, I just support the logging and timber industries and don't like someone not educated like yourself to put the blame on roads closed to atvs on loggers when atv owners are to blame. Don't try to kid me either because I see atv damage every day. I see logging roads repaired after logging every day too.

[CANOPY SAM]

Thanks Laker1. Appreciate your input as a veteran hunter who's been thru it for a long time.

This argument just doesn't hold much water because it might make things easier for a few people.

What did people do prior to the introduction of 3-wheelers, 4-wheelers, etc.? They walked. They dragged their deer out the same way they'd done for 100's of years.

It's hard to accept our limitations as we get older, and our strength and stamina aren't what they used to be. But to make an exception for some in this regard, is to make an exception for all in this regard.

ATV's do a lot of damage to our natural world where they don't belong. They disrupt normal wildlife movement, and disrupt other people when they only want peace and quiet while hunting a semi-remote area. I'm glad that our state officials drew a line in the sand on ATV usage, and I own two ATV's.

If I can't walk into the area I want to hunt, and drag out a deer after I've pulled the trigger, then I've probably gone too far in. If I'm with someone that needs help getting into, and out of a stand, or dragging a deer, I'll happily help them.

[Pinusbanksiana]

Sam, I think you and I could get along just fine!

[Getanet]

Just so there is no misunderstanding Pink – I have don’t have a problem with loggers. I understand they are trying to make a living like anyone else. I don’t think they are environmentally irresponsible, or damage our forests. Nor did I put the blame on loggers for roads being closed to ATVs. I don’t think loggers or logging companies pushed for ATV restrictions.

I am simply saying that I don’t see “ATVs cause ruts” as being a solid reason for not allowing ATV use during the hunting season. Just as you say, “there are policies in place that restrict how and when equipment can be used”, policies for ATV use during the hunting season could be put in place that would minimize the impact they have – both on the terrain and disturbing other hunters.

[monstermoose78]

Where I hunt they block off every new logging road with tress,rock, and dirt so no one can drive on the road. Why? If the loggers can use the land so can I its public land. I am for loggers I like hunting clear cuts, but it discriminates against people with disabilities!! Disabled Americans are over 43 million strong and the last thing logger will want is disabled people blocking their access to the timber stand. It can happen just keep pushing the issue. I have rode a wheeler into the same tree for 13 years and every year when bring my stand in I can not tell where I drove the wheeler in the year before. The only way I know it is the same tree is that someone spray painted it with big blue circle. I go into my stand over a half hour before legal shooting time and I don't come out until after legal shooting hours. I do not put ruts in the logging road. I do not race around tearing up the grass. I only use my wheeler to get 2.3 miles off the main road if they did not block it off so bad I would not need a wheeler I would drive my truck in there. For grouse hunters how many times has a wheeler gone by and you walk around the corner to find a grouse that just walked out on the trail. If you say never I call your Bull dump, because it happens a lot for me. Also if it was not for the wheeler keeping the grass down on some trails you would not see the grouse standing on the trail. There is plenty of trails where wheelers can not go. Just because you chose to not hunt them its not the guy on the wheelers fault.

I think the Forest Service is missing out on a lot of money. I know that everyone in my hunting party would pay 20-30 bucks for permit to use their atv on any forest service road or in the forest. They may need to close season for atv use like in the spring say april 1st to july 15th so that things have a time to dry out and build a stronger root system. With the money they get they could then fix any major issues they have from people causing damage. Also they would be able to ticket people for driving their atv in a destructive manner and or causing damage. This way berry picker could use a wheeler, mushroom hunters, and hunter.

The bottom line is why do we have Discriminate against other hunters! It does not make sense to me. Just because you choose not use a wheeler that is your choice. I know not every has the means to buy one, but you could try saving for one. It makes me sick to think we as hunters can not help each other out, but we divide into groups and bash each other. It is time to have hunters rally and support each other even though we do things differently!! Please Stop and get along together we could get more important things done!!

There is laws already in place for when a atv can be driven, so if some one is breaking them. You can call it in or you could be the guy to warn them about what they are doing wrong!

[Pinusbanksiana]

Moose78, if you are hunting federal land there are plenty of areas where you can legally use an ATV. Stop by an office and pick up a map.

There are others who don't like to see ATV use, and there are areas for them too. We all have to get along and the forest service has to accommodate everyone, not just you and not just hunters.

[monstermoose78]

You are right I am not asking for them to just accommodate me. On forest service land you can only ride on a ride not off it. Look it up! Once off the trail you can get a ticket. I got one because I pull off the trail and parked my wheeler. Just happened a Forest Protection Officer happened to come down the trail and leave me a nice note and ticket. I called and told them I just pulled off the trail so others could get by. HAHA No good! Ticket stands so from now on my wheeler sits on the trail. That is why I said Berry Pickers, Mushroom hunters, Hunters, I forgot fisherman, and everyone else. For people who want complete remoteness the BWCA they have million of arces to play in.

Pinusbanksuana I do have a map and that is how i got my ticket. The map I picked up at the forest service office said I was on state land but the map was was off by 342 feet which my note said and that is why I got a ticket. If there map had GPS coords on it I would have been able to figure out the map was off but it is not like the they post the lines this is state land this National forest land this is county land. There is pletty of places for people who don't like atvs BWCA, Nation wildlife Refuges, Some state parks, some WMA. But if the forest is open to all people to use a person with a disability should be able to use it too!!! Their atv is their legs.

As you said "There are others who don't like to see ATV use, and there are areas for them too. We all have to get along and the forest service has to accommodate everyone, not just you and not just hunters."

Same to you.

I agree we need to get along. Now I got yelled at by a guy one morning for riding past him. He did not have car truck or anything on the road. So how would I know he was in there. He yelled at me. I just kept going. I heard a shot that evening on my way out I see this guy trying to drag his nice buck out. I am a nice guy so I stopped and he say go around me. I say can I help ya out and get the nice buck to the road. This guy was dumb founded that offered to help him. We put his buck on my front rack and I had him sit on the back rack and I hauled them out to the road. He did say thank you. I did run into him the next year but he had a wheeler then.

[BobT]

For those that are supporting the idea of banning ATV's for hunting I would ask a question. One of the arguments used so far is that we should be going back to what we did prior to the widespread use of ATV's. I understand what you are suggesting but I have to ask. Are you willing to take that all the way? Prior to the invention of all terrain vehicles we used our feet for sure but we also used our trucks. Where I drive my ATV now, I make a trail that is roughly 4' wide, maybe a bit more. Before that, I used my truck and my trail and the impact I made was twice as wide. Are you willing to give up your vehicle when you go hunting? Imagine how much more hunting area and animal habitat there would be if we would outlaw automobiles and all the roadways that we have built to facilitate their use?

An ATV is just another method of getting around.

[monstermoose78]

Go BobT

[Bear55]

Plenty of land out there to get away from ATV's if you really want to. The funny part is most aren't willing to put in the effort to get away from the roads and trails.

[bowhunternw]

I most certainly don't want an atv to come buzzing by me when hunting on public grounds. In fact I wish atv's were banned from existence. It really isn't that difficult to walk and dragging out a deer from something tough = great memories. In fact some of the hunts that mean the most to me were absolute misery getting the deer out.

[Musky Buck]

This topic reminded me I never heard a 4 wheeler this season, that was awesome ! Then again there wasn't many 4 wheeler type of deer taken this year in my areas. Told the neighbor guy how he's been deerless for 6 years, I told him if I can hear that machine loud and clear and you park it under your stand, these deer are hearing it also in this thin creek bottom, walk you'll have a better shot.

[Getanet]

I most certainly don't want an atv to come buzzing by me when hunting on public grounds. In fact I wish atv's were banned from existence. It really isn't that difficult to walk and dragging out a deer from something tough = great memories. In fact some of the hunts that mean the most to me were absolute misery getting the deer out.

For argument sake, what's the difference between an ATV driving by on public land, or a boat driving by you on a lake?

If they are that much of a disturbance, are you really that far off the beaten path?

[Jeff13]

Where I hunt people can't obey the rules with the wheelers, so I personally hate them.

I know many of you use them properly out there deer hunting and that's fine, where I hunt people can't read laws and its irritating. No offense to those who use them properly.

[CANOPY SAM]

Seriously? Two weeks later which one of the two can you tell drove by?

ATV's definitely have a place and time. I love our ATV's. They're work horses, and I'll be honest, I never thought I'd need one, or own one for that matter. Now that I've been an ATV owner for many years I don't know what I'd do without one.

The only thing I ever use my ATV for while hunting is 1) retrieving a deer off of private land (with landowner permission) and 2) hauling a trailer full of decoys into and out of the field (with landowner permission). Beyond that, I don't really need it for anything else.

If you own the land, hey, ride wherever you want...on your land. But State and Federal lands are reserved for EVERYONE, and as such we need to be good stewards of the land, and respect others while there. We don't have the right to damage, manipulate, or alter these properties in any way, shape or form, even if that makes it a little easier for a few people to enjoy the resource.