Saints paid players to hurt foes

[PierBridge]

Quote:

I don't see jail time but do think lawsuits are inevitable...not from current but from past players.

Could there be some frivolous lawsuits? Yeah it is America and if some Jock that blew all his moneys want to take a stab go for it but it's big Loser!

[nofishfisherman]

I wouldn't count out a lawsuit being brought by someone but I can't imagine them being able to win. They'd need to prove they sustained damages from a specific play and then prove that the specific play was a direct result of the bounty system. I just don't see how anyone could prove it.

[hawgchaser]

nofish,

Dangerous for me to speak as a non-attorney but I believe the two requirement to collect damages from "management" would be to prove negligence (given their knowledge that the bounty system was in place) and damages to the player. I think a good lawyer could spin that to a jury pretty well for a player injured in any game against the Saints during the bounty period.

[flipper]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/New-O...ypocrisy-030512

[ozzie]

Where do you guys get your reasoning and thinking that this is the norm for the league and has been for years? Yes there were guys that made "hit lists" and such back in the days but to say they were getting paid extra to take someone out and by coaches to top it off...where's the proof? The extent of the Saints haveing a pool in the amount of $50,000 or possibly more is just crazy....remember those guys on the other team were out there for the same reasons as the Saints...Trying to make a living for their families and win a game. To want to hit someone hard is one thing but having a dollar amount dangling in front of you if you injure another player is toatlly wrong. If you can't see the difference I sure hope you aren't out there trying to coach our kids on how to play fair!!!!

[flipper]

Ozzie, Which part of "Never said it was ok. It isn't" did you have such a difficult time grasping? Being aware of what goes on and condoning it are two different things. Living in a fantasy world is another.

[toughguy]

It's my understanding there are 3 issues here

1) the bounty program was in place not just to perform (tackles, interceptions, fumbles) but to injure. The performance bounties might (no proof) be in place on other teams but they are still against rules. I find it hard to believe that injury bounties are common. Paying to "cart off" of injure other players takes this to a whole new level.

2) The NFL heard about the program and told team officials to stop - they didn't stop

3) The team and team officials instructed players to lie to the NFL in an attempt to cover it up after the league began to investigate it the second time. Now you have guys like Sharper saying they know who the snitch is and that they will pay for their snitching. I don't think the NFL will act to kindly towards that either.

Each offence is bad enough on it's own in the NFL's eyes to punish severely.

[Scott K]

I wouldnt be opposed to eliminating the Saints. I think it is justifiable punishment.

[LMITOUT]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/New-O...ypocrisy-030512

We have a winner.

[hawgchaser]

Quote:

We have a winner.

Congratulations!! Will three chairs be enough for the "We" celebration or should I bring a fourth just in case?

[PierBridge]

Poor Teddy Bruschi must have lost the coin flip in the back room at ESPN. Somebody had to take the opposite side of the vast majority of players view here, just kind of ironic one of the cheapest SOB's from the Patriots of all teams was the one. He looked terrible trying to act like he was outraged over this. He got his arse handed to him by the rest of players he was debating.

The BOUNTY changes NOTHING NADA a thing as far as the hits or injuries go.

The only reason this is a story is because the NFL is trying clean things up and protect it's image.

Yes the coaches should not have been involved. They will pay a price and rightfully so for being so d u m b ~

I wonder if Nishi from the Twins who had his leg broken at 2nd base after being told by his coach to be careful because every base runner coming into 2nd base is going to try to break his leg can Sue somebody now..or maybe a basketball player who was INTENSIONALLY fouled could make some extra cash in court.

Go Vikes~

[Scott M]

Back in 2009 the Vikings should have taken a cue from the Saints and pounded Brees on handoffs or just as he released the ball (legal hits). Eye for an eye. They knew what was coming if they watched film and it was a good strategy. Instead the Vikings made too many mistakes and lost the game.

It will be interesting to see what the league decides. Spygate, the Joe Smith fiasco, Pete Rose betting. If you break league rules knowingly, the punishment is usually pretty harsh.

[flipper]

The vikings are always too busy with their sexcapades to think of much else.

[LMITOUT]

Hey now....that happened at Lake Minnetonka in international waters so they did nothing wrong.

[TR21HP]

Let's get back on topic. The thing that bothers me the most is idiots like Sharper and others saying that they are going after the "snitch" that leaked the story. This just reinforces the gangster, thug mentality that is all too prevelant in major sports today. I hope Goddell throws the book at the Saints as this has no place in football. And for those of you who think this is widespread you're sadly mistaken. Performance incentives, yes bounties, whose sole purpose is to injure a player, no.

[Scott M]

Peter King wants to give the Lombardi trophy to the Vikings,

*********************************

What could have been if Saints got called for Favre hit

by Peter King, SI.com

When Vikings coach Brad Childress returned to Minneapolis after the NFC Championship loss two-plus years ago, he got a tape together of eight hits on quarterback Brett Favre that were not flagged for penalties in the game. He was, I am told, very upset about what he saw as the excessive brutality in the game that left Favre bruised and hobbled afterward, and he wanted the league to look into the hits.

It's not uncommon for a coach, especially a losing one, to send several plays for the league to review after a game. Eight is a lot. And the league, led by then-vice president of officiating Mike Pereira, did look into them. Pereira found only one of the hits to be a play that, in his opinion, should have been flagged: the high-low hit by Saints linemen Bobby McCray and Remi Ayodele late in the third quarter on a play Favre rushed, threw an interception and was hit after he released the ball.

That play, clearly, should have been flagged by referee Pete Morelli. The league admitted it a couple days later, and ended up fining McCray $20,000 for that play and another earlier in the game when he drove himself into Favre after a handoff. (A handoff, mind you; not a pass. How often have you seen unnecessary roughness called on a defensive player for hitting the quarterback after a handoff? I can't recall ever seeing that, aside from this play.)

Interesting what might have happened had Morelli thrown the flag.

The game was tied at 21 when Favre threw the interception, then got chopped down. The resulting personal foul against McCray would have given the Vikings a first down at the New Orleans 24 with 1:59 left in the third quarter. Let's say Favre, who was helped off the field with his ankle injury after the play, missed the rest of that series and Tarvaris Jackson, the backup, entered the game. Let's assume, for a moment, that the drive stalled and the Vikings had fourth down from the Saints 20-yard line. That would have set up a weather-less 37-yard field-goal try by Ryan Longwell (28 of 30 in field goals that season). Would it have made a difference in the outcome of the game, which was 28-28 after four quarters? The game of course was won by the Saints, 31-28, in overtime.

Hard to imagine Favre, regardless how he felt, not playing in the Super Bowl two weeks later. I bet he would have, come hell or high water. But he wasn't sure about that when we spoke Friday. "I wonder if I would have been able to play in the Super Bowl,'' said Favre. "I'm just telling I could not walk on Tuesday. That was a bad one.''

Just another part of this story that makes you sit back and wonder a lot of things about that day in January 2010.

***

One more point about this story, on a personal note: Former Saints linebacker Scott Fujita is ensnared in it. I reported in my SI magazine story this week that Fujita is one of three defensive leaders who pledged between $2,000 and $10,000 that season toward the bounty pool. Fujita told me he has given money to players over his career for performance-related things like interceptions, forced fumbles and special-teams tackles inside the 20, but he said he never has pledged a dime to any cause that promoted injuring an opponent. There are still so many parts of this story that remain cloudy, and you can judge Fujita and his claims for yourself.

But I have gotten to know Fujita well over the past couple of years for his work as a member of the NFLPA board of directors and as one of the driving forces behind former Saint Steve Gleason's foundation and Gleason's struggle with ALS. With the NFLPA, I found him driven like very few on the board to work to improve player safety and to lessen non-game contact work that players must endure. His work was legitimate and dedicated.

He has done even more for Gleason, particularly on Gleason's trip to the Super Bowl with two fellow ALS patients. Fujita, now a Cleveland Brown, got a friend of Colt McCoy's to fly the Gleason group to Indianapolis for the game by private plane. He arranged for the tickets. He arranged for the hotel rooms, which was quite difficult. He asked for no credit and in fact eschewed credit when any came his way. All he wanted to do was something for his friend to make sure the roadblocks and detours that would normally make such a trip difficult for a man with Gleason's physical struggles would disappear. And they did.

Fujita didn't seek headlines for his NFLPA work, nor for the stuff he has done for Gleason. This is a very good human being who -- and I am not sure of this -- may regret today getting caught up in something sordid, but something so accepted in the private NFL world of bounties for making plays. I'm not talking about bounties for knocking foes out of games. I'm talking about payments for performance. Every player on that defense will face potential discipline for this issue, Fujita included. I just wanted to tell you what I think of the man."

[Rick]

It wouldn't matter if EVERY TEAM did what New Orleans did.

IT WOULD BE JUST AS WRONG.

Those who minimize what the Saints did are really out there in fantasy land.

Let's state it exactly like it is:

1. They had a bounty to knock out other players or injure them badly enough to be carted off.

2. They were told by the league to stop it and they did not.

3. They were investigated for it and lied about it.

It was wrong and unconscionable to do anyone of the three above.

Care to minimize that anyone?

Now there's a winner!

At least three of those in the Saints organization "have the decency and hopefully remorse to acknowledge their role was wrong and apologized".

Which is more than we can say for the minimizers.

[corncob]

Who cares, really?.....You think all NFL teams arent telling their players to smash the Quarterback.

[YiGGiN4SLoBS]

Who cares, really?.....You think all NFL teams arent telling their players to smash the Quarterback.

That aint the point! OF course all NFL teams are telling their players to smash the quarterback! But I garuntee they dont all have frickin bounty pools to injure people! its about the integrity of the league! You think that guy from the saints would have smashed Favre in the chin after a HANDOFF if their wasnt a bounty pool???? Not much... Nobody hits QB's after handoffs, especially with the rules now days!

Thats like pete rose saying, "yeah i gambled, but it was always for us to win! who cares?"

What dont people get about that?

Stick it to Whodat Nation for this Non Sense!

[hawgchaser]

Quote:

Peter King wants to give the Lombardi trophy to the Vikings

Said trophy to be delivered by the first available UFO!

[flipper]

This will just be another thing for the Queens fans can put on their list of excuses for their team not going anywhere.

[Scott K]

Not an excuse, we came up short for lots of reasons. That doesnt make head hunting OK!

[nofishfisherman]

There were too many reasons we lost that game, we can't pin the loss just on this. I doubt the head hunting accounted for the 12 men of the field penalty.

[ozzie]

we wouldn't have had to have 12 men on the field as we would have already won the game....I could care less what happened to the Vikes (shouldn't have won with 6 turnovers) but they should put the smack down on Saints for there actions.

[Nick Kuhn]

This will just be another thing for the Queens fans can put on their list of excuses for their team not going anywhere.

I'm guessing you are a Packers fan. Just speculating here, but what happens if instead of a pick 6 Rodgers throws an 80 yard TD in overtime? Now instead of Kurt Warner receiving the concussion against the Saints, it's Aaron Rodgers that takes it and he became a Justin Morneau or Sidney Crosby? Packers fans would be screaming just as loud if not louder at this. Clearly the hit on Warner was intent to injure. It's one thing to hit a QB hard to disrupt pocket presence; it's completely different to hit a QB who's out of the play after a pick.