Why keep baiting illegal for deer? Read this article!

[lakevet]

here are a few quotes:

"At present, there are at least 4 issues surrounding the deer baiting and feeding debate: 1. Ethical

concerns regarding placement of bait for the purpose of shooting deer, 2. Disease transmission

concerns caused by repeatedly concentrating animals to a small patch of food, 3. Concerns about

the impacts of the artificial energy on deer productivity, survival, distribution, and natural

processes, and 4. The wildlife privatization-effect that baiting and feeding causes."

"Though baiting and feeding do not cause these diseases, the potential for disease transmission by

these practices and the economic consequences of disease cannot be ignored. A 1998 study by

Michigan State University estimated that the loss of TB-free status could cost the economy of the

state $156 million during the ensuing decade (Wisconsin State Farmer 2000). The recent find by

the National Disease Laboratory at Ames, Iowa that TB bacteria remained infectious on foods for at

least 28 days has added new alarm as it was formerly believed that nose-to-nose contact was

necessary for TB transmission. Though formerly ambivalent about baiting and feeding because of

the market for cull food products, the Michigan Farm Bureau at their annual meeting in 1999

overwhelmingly voted to ask the Natural Resources Commission (NRC) for a statewide ban on

both baiting and feeding of deer."

"The uneven distribution of hunter access to the deer herd created by the patchwork of public and

private lands results in uneven distribution of deer, i.e., hot spots and cold spots. This likely is one

factor affecting hunter confidence in the accuracy of deer population estimates and their

willingness to accept antlerless harvest quotas prescribed by the agency. Because baiting and

feeding tend to attract and hold deer to the food sources, these practices seem to exacerbate the

patchiness of deer distribution, the problems of hunter confidence in population estimates, the

acceptance of harvest quotas, and in turn the difficulty in effectively managing the public’s deer

resource."

lakevet

[Big Dave2]

Baiting and Ethics

Most of the baiting debate in the popular literature has been about ethical considerations. A recent

Michigan DNR report (Witcomb 1999) also indicated that the controversy among hunters was

initially driven primarily by their perceptions of hunting ethics and only recently became a

biological issue as a result of disease concerns. This pattern seems representative of most “Deer

2000” discussions in Wisconsin from 1996 to 2000.

While there clearly are ethical aspects to deer baiting, these debates have added more heat than

light. Other than Law Enforcement records of violations (late hunting, cabin shooting), there is

little guidance for this discussion other than hunter opinions. More objective discussion is likely if

it is focused on the biological concerns of baiting. These involve primarily disease transmission

and artificial energy impacts. And, these biological concerns apply equally, if not more, to feeding

practices. Thus, both baiting and feeding practices must be addressed together.

[Archerysniper]

[Gordie]

This explains it best

http://www.hotspotoutdoors.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/2756838/1

[Musky Buck]

Beat that horse. I wish we could bait waterfowl. Beat that horse. They can legally bait in city limits for sharpshooter's and it looks to be very effective. Beat that horse. Maybe if a 1/2 million of us can legally bait, each bag 2 deer they'll be eradicated and no TB or CWD, it'll be gone then we can start over with a new crop of deer. That's the last right hook my horse can take. If you can't shoot 1 deer in 25 days of gun hunting give it up if you can't find any joy in being an unsuccessful hunter, quit, sell gear, and play tons of cribbage while joining the venison donation program.

[Musky Buck]

The bottom line is baiting isn't best for the Whitetailed deer. Part 2. It wouldn't be best for our over 1/2 million deer hunters. The DNR is already giving us too many days in the field with a gun, is it your goal to just polish off what you can. You want bait, hunt the rum river state forest cornfield, eastnortheast of Morris MN the pheasants forever foodplots/standing corn. There you go, open to the public, I often drive by the rum and see 0 blaze orange by the cornfield, have at it. Enough is never enough so those in favor are in favor of a higher kill count so the following year or years mean nothing, forget about wolf kills and winter kills, lets dump em while they eat out of the trough. Sounds like a thrilling highly thought through hunting scenario, where you gonna sit, " By pile Number 9 of course " Good choice, how long you plan on watching the pile, till noon, back to the pile by 2 and then if snow after shooting light I could still crack 1 because my stand faces east away from the sun and is perfect for pile 9. They'll be easy shots standing shoulder to shoulder mauling the pile. Hey we had a first I got 7 of em on pile 6 haha.

[walleyehunter80]

MB I wish HSO had a like button!

[psepuncher]

The recent find by

the National Disease Laboratory at Ames, Iowa that TB bacteria remained infectious on foods for at

least 28 days has added new alarm as it was formerly believed that nose-to-nose contact was

necessary for TB transmission.

Does the DNR now about this?

Kinda makes an issue about using mineral licks. Not to mention the enabling and promoting the use of baits and feeding in any retail store that caters to hunting. Maybe we should boycott all those retailers.

[lakevet]

"The uneven distribution of hunter access to the deer herd created by the patchwork of public and

private lands results in uneven distribution of deer, i.e., hot spots and cold spots. This likely is one

factor affecting hunter confidence in the accuracy of deer population estimates and their

willingness to accept antlerless harvest quotas prescribed by the agency. Because baiting and

feeding tend to attract and hold deer to the food sources, these practices seem to exacerbate the

patchiness of deer distribution, the problems of hunter confidence in population estimates, the

acceptance of harvest quotas, and in turn the difficulty in effectively managing the public’s deer

resource."

What do you think about this part of the article regarding deer distribution being even more patchy with feeding/baiting?

lakevet

p.s. as to beating a dead horse, the "baiting horse" keeps getting up and trying to run again in the legislature!

[Big Dave2]

"The uneven distribution of hunter access to the deer herd created by the patchwork of public and

private lands results in uneven distribution of deer, i.e., hot spots and cold spots. This likely is one

factor affecting hunter confidence in the accuracy of deer population estimates and their

willingness to accept antlerless harvest quotas prescribed by the agency. Because baiting and

feeding tend to attract and hold deer to the food sources, these practices seem to exacerbate the

patchiness of deer distribution, the problems of hunter confidence in population estimates, the

acceptance of harvest quotas, and in turn the difficulty in effectively managing the public’s deer

resource."

What do you think about this part of the article regarding deer distribution being even more patchy with feeding/baiting?

lakevet

p.s. as to beating a dead horse, the "baiting horse" keeps getting up and trying to run again in the legislature!

Baiting is a lot smaller part of the equation than recreational feeding or food plots.

[Big Dave2]

Quote:

The bottom line is baiting isn't best for the Whitetailed deer.

LOL! I'm pretty sure that the whitetailed deer would tell you that what is best for them is if we didn't hunt them at all!

[Gordie]

Baiting is a lot smaller part of the equation than recreational feeding or food plots.

Probably coulnt say this if it were legal.It would be alot bigger part than the equation IMO.

[Big Dave2]

Probably coulnt say this if it were legal.It would be alot bigger part than the equation IMO.

Even if baiting were legal, there would still be WAY more people recreationaly feeding deer than baiting. Plus, baiting only takes place for a week or 2 where recreational feeding goes on for 365 days a year. Food plots feed deer for most of the year as well so I think it would be safe to say that food plots and feeding do a LOT more to permanately relocate deer than baiting ever could do.

[Basseyes]

Baiting is a lot smaller part of the equation than recreational feeding or food plots.

Numerous unknowns, many assumptions.

I would rather error on the side of caution. I want the DNR to keep baiting illegal. Based on what my views and ethical ideas of "fair chase" is. MN's have seen fit, to keep it the law and have accepted it as such. Established by the traditions and ethics of the present day sportsmen, the DNR and our states legislature. They have deemed baiting as unaccepted behavior. If it is brought up and presented as a viable option, to the legislature, as to not harm the health of the resource as a whole or the quality of the hunt as a whole, for the majority of law abiding license holders and is proven to do so, then I would at least consider it. But at the present time, I see it to be detrimental to the experience of the hunt and the resource as a whole in Minnesota. Modern day sportsmen have better tools and equipment, that's a given. Regulations are not an exact science. There are many gray areas to traverse. Recreational feeding, baiting and food plots are some of those areas. We will not all agree on everything. But the fact of the matter is baiting it illegal. Food plots and recreational feeding are still legal and I am alright with that. If you don't like it and see it as such a injustice of personal freedoms, then you had better get out of your arm chair and right that wrong as you see it. In this great state and country of ours, that is your freedom and dare I say, your duty to do so. Or you define hypocrisy and are part of the problem you are complaining about.

[Basseyes]

Even if baiting were legal, there would still be WAY more people recreationaly feeding deer than baiting. Plus, baiting only takes place for a week or 2 where recreational feeding goes on for 365 days a year. Food plots feed deer for most of the year as well so I think it would be safe to say that food plots and feeding do a LOT more to permanately relocate deer than baiting ever could do.

Where are the facts and numbers to support that assumption? There is no way to know for sure that recreational feeding would be more than baiting for hunting purposes.

[Gordie]

Plus, baiting only takes place for a week or 2 where recreational feeding goes on for 365 days a year. Food plots feed deer for most of the year as well so I think it would be safe to say that food plots and feeding do a LOT more to permanately relocate deer than baiting ever could do.

If it were legal baiting would go on way longer than 2 weeks

when you bait deer you condition them to feed at a certain spot and even a certain time.

Its all about conditioning.

You would reloacte deer to the feeding areas food plots are just a big bait station IMO deer have been conditioned to feed in that spot.

Feeding deer the deer have been conditioned to feed at a feeder because its easy supply of food for them.

Baiting would be more than simply piling up some corn.

yea its starts witha pile of corn and ends up in a electronic feeder and when it turns on the deer tend to show up.

If you make it easy for the deer to find food thats where it will show up.

This is where most of the people find it repulsive to bait.

[Big Dave2]

Quote:

I want the DNR to keep baiting illegal. Based on what my views and ethical ideas of "fair chase" is.

Exactly, based on YOUR views.

Quote:

If it were legal baiting would go on way longer than 2 weeks

when you bait deer you condition them to feed at a certain spot and even a certain time.

Thats funny because I was told that one of the reasons baiting was bad is that it did nothing to sustain feeding deer. I thought that lazy baiters just piled out a truck load of corn and didn't do anything else except shoot every deer in the state. Now you are telling me that baiters but out feed for deer for an extended period of time during a critical period of time right before bucks start to chase does and the weather starts to turn colder and other food sources disappear?

[Gordie]

YEP DAVE THAT WHAT I SAID

[Gordie]

I also said: "Baiting would be more than simply piling up some corn.

yea its starts witha pile of corn and ends up in a electronic feeder and when it turns on the deer tend to show up".

and I forgot to say that this is unetical and if you dont think it is ask that question and you will find more than one person feels tis way and I would say that more feel it is unethical than ethical

[Big Dave2]

I also said: "Baiting would be more than simply piling up some corn.

yea its starts witha pile of corn and ends up in a electronic feeder and when it turns on the deer tend to show up".

and I forgot to say that this is unetical and if you dont think it is ask that question and you will find more than one person feels tis way and I would say that more feel it is unethical than ethical

Would you not say that ethics is a personal issue best decided by each indevidual?

[jay83196]

So many arguements for both sides , make it 100% legal or illegal, as it stands the rule is [PoorWordUsage]! The argument spread of disease is plain ignorant if that were the case why isn't it illegal to recreational feed... I'm a big time hunter gun and bow but the ethical argument I also think is ridiculous, who decides what is or is not ethical? Is shooting a deer 200 yds away ethical or should we all use a bow to be more sporting, or how about a spear its easier to bait but so is rifle hunting in general...way to many people judging when they should look in the mirror, if you don't like it then don't do it!

[Musky Buck]

A good reason would be for the 1st time in my 40+ years I have 0 wintering deer, none, gone, done. Thin em out a little more with bait ? They are beyond thinned.

[Bear55]

Would you not say that ethics is a personal issue best decided by each indevidual?

Dave I think everyone knows they are posting their own opinion on the issue but thanks for continuing to point that out for us.

Now if you can come up with an argument why we should bait please post it here. If you can convince most of the guys on this site, the legislature, and some DNR people you might just get this law overturned. If not I would hope you could just let it go.

[Basseyes]

Even if baiting were legal, there would still be WAY more people recreationaly feeding deer than baiting.

Prove this statement based on facts vs assumptions.

[Muskie456]

Thanks Bear I was on my way to writing something along those lines and then read your post.

Can you imagine what baiting would do to the whitetail landscape. It would promote hunters dropping out of the sport more than recruiting them. It would turn into a sport for people that could afford to bait and typically that is not the youth of our society.

Baiting is for lazy chest pounders that have a hard time figuring why they can't shoot a deer in the ten minutes that they have been sitting in ther box blind.