Landmark shingles blowing off roof

[Jigging Joe]

I've had my shingles come off my roof 3 times now in 8 years, the first two times it was on the garage, it would start on the ends and roll up the shingles in pretty big pieces, like a full square, 10' x 10'. The 1st time I replaced a couple square, then the 2nd time it was like 3 square, that time we black jacked the edges so the wind couldnt get to it.

Now, last thursday the north side on my house lost about 3 square of shingles, looks like it might of started on the end again and rolled the shingles over, not sure??? The shingles are stuck together well, they come off in huge pieces. The strange thing this time is that on this same side of the roof where I lost the shingles, I could see a line of tar strips all the way from the top to the bottom, after examining I could see the entire roof of shingles moved/twisted/pivoted on the roof. I only lost 3 square of shingles but the entire roof, 14 square twisted on the roof and now need to be replaced. Why did they twist??? Could it be that the nails went thru the shingles while installing 8 years ago or is the wind that powerful that when the edges lifted, the wind got under all the shingles, the entire roof 27' x 56'???

The shingles are Landmark 30 and were nailed, not stapled. Any thought on what happened, I'm thinking I did something wrong when we roofed it!!

[PurpleFloyd]

We used to see lots of this stuff in the mid 90's when the housing boom took off and there were lots of subdivisions without any trees or wind breaks. That was about when the older 3 tab shingles were being replaced by the "Architectural" laminated shingles.

Prior to that you would have a few tabs blow off and that was that, but with the "Single tab" (for lack of a better term) shingles you would have whole shingles or whole sections of a roof that would blow off when the winds hit hard.

I would suggest having your Ins agent come over and look at it and see what they will do. Generally a warranty on shingles is pro rated so by the time you get out 8 years they may give you enough to cover the cost of the roofing felt.

[soldoncass]

I have never seen a whole roof of shingles pivot on a roof. What I have seen is some of those arcitectural type shingles blow off, though, and it usually was because they were nailed in the WRONG place. That type of shingle is 12 inches high, with the bottom 7 inch a double layer. The nails HAVE TO BE in the doubled area... so between 5 1/2 to 6 inches up from the bottom, is where the nails need to be. I have had to renail some, because the installer was in a hurry, and put them too high. Warantees are VOID if they aren't nailed to the company specs(they are PICKY). If you have a bundle / package left, read the directions printed on there. edit: make sure there are 4 nails per shingle also...1 on each end, and another 1 foot in from both ends.

[reddog]

Pitch has alot to do with the seal down factor. The steeper the pitch, the less gravity on the shingle to seal it to the underlying shingle.

Im going to agree with the previous poster that it is improper nailing that is your culprit. If you nail it too high, next to the double layer, or above. there is a "fulcrum effect" causing a lift at the bottom edge of the shingle for the wind to get under. That fulcrum effect also severly hampers the ability of the shingle to seal down.

Post a picture of a few of the blowoffs.

Doesnt the Landmark have a large nailing area, like an inch and a quarter, unlike the Timberlines which is about 3/8" You must be very accurate with your nails with a Timberline?

[pike doctor]

Last fall I replace a roof in Gaylord that had the exact same problem as yours.

What I found was that the previous installer was overdriving the nails. The package is very specific that your nails should be flush with the top of the shingle after it is nailed on. It should also be nailed as close to the reveal as possible. It says use 4, I use five. Really cheap insurance if you ask me.

How hot was it the day you roofed it? That is usually the worst thing you can do for a roof is to put it on when it is hot out. People think you need 90 degrees to seal the shingles, but all it does is pull the shingles lose from foot traffic, mark them, and allow the installer to overdrive the nails.

I bet if you have 3/4 boards for a roof deck that almost all of the nails are still stuck in the wood.

[chad220]

You say your losing whole sectoins, so its not a sealing issue. As stated earlier I've seen and repaired many from not being nailed correctly. There is only about 5/8" area where you can nail. If you miss it high there is a small void where the layers overlap and nail will go though or tear. My money is on improper nailing.

[chad220]

Landmark also is a very small nailing area. Malarky is the only [arch]shingle I know of that has the wider area inch and a half I think.

[chad220]

Sorry, you are right a couple years ago landmark came out with a new nail line. You have the 2 narrow lines in the dbl area and another line about an inch above. The higher line can be used when its above 40 degrees. Although I wouldnt recomend it. Always hit the dbl area. Also as mentioned 5 nails cheap insurance. No money in callbacks.

[pureinsanity]

I agree improper nailing. who roofed it? you or someone else?

[Jigging Joe]

Thanks guys for the info, nobody to blame but myself. I've shingled quite a few roofs but this was first for the arch. shingles. After some of the snow gets off the roof, I will take another look at where we nailed them. It was warmer the day we shingled but not extremely hot, I think it was early june. Like I said, I'm thinking the nails pulled thru real easy, so like you all said, nailed in the wrong place or nailed with pressure too high??? Expensive learning lesson if it was my fault.

I did talk to insurance adjuster on phone today, he said landmark shingles had some issues about 8 or 9 years ago and changed there formula for the adhesive, he said if the wind did get under the gable end shingles, it very possible a 40 - 50 gust could off lifted all the shingles, but he said it was hard to say without looking at it.

[tonkapat]

running starter up the gables helps out also. Especially if your not protected by trees or other buildings. At least the shingles should be easy to tear off when you replace the roof.

[pike doctor]

running starter up the gables helps out also. Especially if your not protected by trees or other buildings. At least the shingles should be easy to tear off when you replace the roof.

Yeah, but have fun with all of the nails! And I wouldnt worry to much about adhesion. They stuck together and came off in big chunks. It is a problem with the nailing. If you werent swinging your hammer every once in a while to finish a nail that hit a rafter or truss chances are the pressure was too high. I intentionally set my pressure a little lower than I need so I dont overdrive. It will rip right through the single when it is too high. Some of your fastest crews are guilty of this. Ever notice that none of them ever carry a hammer when laying shingles? Cause they got the pressure cranked way up.

Next time you do it just nail them low as possible with 5 nails and make sure you are getting them perfectly flush and snug.

[Jigging Joe]

I looked today, yes, they were nailed wrong, way to high. Learned the hard way again, but I did learn!!!

[FWA]

Blown off shingles remind me of my Certainteed New Horizon shingles. Every summer I lost some. Even sent a sample in to Certainteed for warranty but was shot down. Oh well... New roof and not a Certainteed product.

[pureinsanity]

Blown off shingles remind me of my Certainteed New Horizon shingles. Every summer I lost some. Even sent a sample in to Certainteed for warranty but was shot down. Oh well... New roof and not a Certainteed product.

Hmmmm ive done a couple roofs with their products and have had no trouble.

[iffwalleyes]

My parents have both Landmarks on their cabin the first time we ever put these down and have had not problems there and then we have Certainteed on everything at there house and two out building all have work very well for us. From everything I have read though sounds like it is less of a product issue and more of the install. Wouldn't really matter which you use if not installed correctly.

[hanson]

Hmmmm I've done a couple roofs with their products and have had no trouble.

When did you do these roofs?? 15 years ago?? Didn't think so.

Certainteed had a heck of a problem 10+ years ago with their shingles that put them in a big class action lawsuit. The firm I work for spec'd and installed these things on lots of churches we built 10-15' years ago that resulted in claims against our company and then claims against Certainteed. I recently inspected a job with these shingles and couldn't believe what they were doing.

I helped my parents reshingle their house last summer with Certainteeds but I told my dad no way did I want them putting those shingles on their house.. I wasn't spending the money on them so it ultimately wasn't my choice. I'd have went with Timberlines.

[walleyeseeker]

Hanson, I agree there was a problem with Certainteed a few years ago. They were sued, lost, and had to pay. What you aren't mentioning is your other choice, GAF, also had a class action suit against them for shingle problems. They also lost and had to pay. Both products are good products today. The main difference is the length of time since each lawsuit.

[dougger222]

Hate to say it but sounds like a poor install or a defective batch of Landmarks. Are you sure they are not New Horizon? 8 years ago Certainteed sold 10 times more New Horizons than Landmarks and the New Horizons had a lot of issues with blow offs.

Going back 8 years ago with Landmark I want to say they could have been English and the tar was on the top/middle of the shingle. Want to say about 7 years ago they enlarged them to Metric size at which time the tar was placed on the back/bottom area.

Have roofed several hundred roofs with Landmarks and only had two blow off call backs and that was back when the tar was on the face of the shingle. One call back was an eave shingle blew off on a bluff on the St. Criox river, roof over. The other was on a very steep barn roof roof over cedar shakes.

Since the Metric Landmarks haven't had one blow off. We've done some hail tear offs with these shingles and they come off in huge sections.

What I can say for sure is if they are 8 year old Landmarks and you nailed above the double laminate section and have blow offs you voided the wind warranty. Also the wind warranty is only good for 5 years so even if properly installed the wind warranty is a thing of the past.

Call your insurance company if you haven't already done so and tell them to send out an adjuster. 8 year old Landmarks if English will be impossible to match.

BTW, 3 squares, wow! that's a big area!!!

[dougger222]

When did you do these roofs?? 15 years ago?? Didn't think so.

Certainteed had a heck of a problem 10+ years ago with their shingles that put them in a big class action lawsuit. The firm I work for spec'd and installed these things on lots of churches we built 10-15' years ago that resulted in claims against our company and then claims against Certainteed. I recently inspected a job with these shingles and couldn't believe what they were doing.

I helped my parents reshingle their house last summer with Certainteeds but I told my dad no way did I want them putting those shingles on their house.. I wasn't spending the money on them so it ultimately wasn't my choice. I'd have went with Timberlines.