2nd rut?

[Deerstalker]

people often speak of a second rut kicking in some four weeks after the first rut. is there any truth in this as evidenced by any of you?

[Deerstalker]

usually more so in mid-december i'm assuming?

[AuggieDawg11]

I would agree that it's usually mid-December. Not as crazy as the first rut goes but I have had success with normal 1st rut techniques.

[Neighbor_guy]

Does that came into esterus and did not get bread will come back into it a second time usualy 28-35 days after. So about 4 weeks give or take.

It is not realy a "2nd rut". More like a second chance for the does. A lot of your "late fawns" are a result of this second esterus. Also some yearling does will end up getting bred at this time.

But you dont realy get the crazy chasing around bucks going nuts type behavior you get in early Nov. You will still find bucks cruzing around scent checking bedding areas and the like, but I have found that the does actualy actively look for the bucks durring this second phase. Not like the playing coy bit they do early in the year. (the "second chance" does that need to get bred)

[Deerstalker]

sounds good. i'm heading out with my bow this weekend. never really hunt late season. just wanted to get some info. sounds like i might be a bit early for it... but i'll keep my fingers crossed.

[Deerstalker]

would it make any sense at all to use doe estrus this weekend?

[BeezeHound]

I used some last weekend and had a 1.5 year old come and check out the scent wick. From certain things I've observed in the woods through out the years I would say that from mid to late October through most of December there are probably doe's somewhere in the area coming in and out of heat. It just so happens that the majority of it happens within a few days period in early November, but not every single doe is on that schedule.

[Musky Buck]

My 26 seasons of effort I haven't seen it or my dad hasn't either nor anyone in our group, however, we weren't given the muzzy chance years ago like we can today so we weren't out much in December, but since the all-season tag came into play we haven't seen a buck chasing a doe then again we rarely see a daylight buck and most of the bucks are deceased by now in my area. My best 2nd rut guess in my area is it's happening near the feeding areas after dark. In my areas if you can't get way off the road you are not seeing any deer moving on their own during Muzzy season. But, it only has to happen once to be memorable.

[InTheNorthwoods]

people often speak of a second rut kicking in some four weeks after the first rut. is there any truth in this as evidenced by any of you?

It really isn't a second rut and you really can't time it as 4 weeks after the "first rut" because the rut is an ongoing process. Does enter estrus at different times in the fall, some as early as October and some as late as January, with the largest number of does entering estrus sometime in the first half of November in MN.

What then happens, is that some does that may not have been bred in their first cycle, may come back into estrus approximately a month after their first cycle (i.e. the second rut approx. 4 weeks later). It is also entirely possible that a doe will not come into estrus until December for the first time (including young yearling does or fawns).

What is a misconception about your statement is that not all does come into estrus at the same time and the rut is not a short identifiable event - it is a collaboration of many events generally identifying deer behavior during that period.

So in the end, yes, it is very possible to run into rutting activity in December. The intensity and liklihood for this depends greatly on the herd dynamics in your particular area (which affect when does will go into heat, if they will be bred, herd sex ratio, etc.).

[Musky Buck]

Checked in with the boys, the first 6 1/2 days of muzzy 4 guys, they haven't seen a deer and they have a 421 acre farm with no neighbors or no one bothering the land or bedding areas. I saw 1 deer in the first 3 days. This seems to be normal for us, we have to go make drives this weekend as they are very nocturnal and they have no reason to move until it's dark. Everything is happening at night and there's no way to go but drive em for us anyway. 2nd rut is a nightime affair, lots of main rut activity is at night also.

[BRULEDRIFTER]

Originally Posted By: deerstalker

people often speak of a second rut kicking in some four weeks after the first rut. is there any truth in this as evidenced by any of you?

It really isn't a second rut and you really can't time it as 4 weeks after the "first rut" because the rut is an ongoing process. Does enter estrus at different times in the fall, some as early as October and some as late as January, with the largest number of does entering estrus sometime in the first half of November in MN.

What then happens, is that some does that may not have been bred in their first cycle, may come back into estrus approximately a month after their first cycle (i.e. the second rut approx. 4 weeks later). It is also entirely possible that a doe will not come into estrus until December for the first time (including young yearling does or fawns).

What is a misconception about your statement is that not all does come into estrus at the same time and the rut is not a short identifiable event - it is a collaboration of many events generally identifying deer behavior during that period.

So in the end, yes, it is very possible to run into rutting activity in December. The intensity and liklihood for this depends greatly on the herd dynamics in your particular area (which affect when does will go into heat, if they will be bred, herd sex ratio, etc.).

Very well put, ITNw!

[featherslayer 1]

just an update on the rutting activity around the park rapids area, was out yesterday morning and seen a nice 10 pointer chasing a doe at 9:30 am. i was out and about checking out a new area. after 7 days of hunting i have seen at least 100 does and only 2 bucks, a spike this morning i passed on. mattter of fact my girlfriend had 5 does around her blind so close she could of poked them with a stick, there is alot of fawns with the does yet. have another 9 days left so good luck to all that is out after them.

[Arctic]

From what I have observed and read, the so-called "second rut" seems to be more about something for outdoor magazines to publish than what actually happens in the field, at least in northeastern Minnesota. At BEST, you might have 5 to 10 percent of young does that didn't get bred during the rut, but a lot of those deer were killed during the rifle season anyway, so the numbers are even lower.

[tracker x-2]

The doe i saw last night and the fork that came by 15 minn later didnt show any sign of breeding happing. He crossed her trail and went the other way.

[mabr]

It happens just not to the degree of the first. Seen a scrape hit on thursday evening fresh pee in it. All the others i know about in my area havent been touched in the last 2 weeks.

Saw a fork that night,a six pnt and neither of them were acting rutty in the least. Just browsing for food. They have started moving (at least from what im seeing) around 4-430.

[Musky Buck]

featherslayer 100 does, 2 bucks, might want to take some does out of the area and tell everyone else to too. I haven't seen a doe rifle hunting in 3 years. fawns and yearling bucks but not many of those either.

[Bear55]

Twice I have seen a buck chasing a doe in early December, you need to be a little lucky and of course be in the right place at the right time but it does happen.

[Musky Buck]

Right on Bear, I would think very lucky as 23 of us x 25+ years experience and we've never seen it with 10's of thousands of hours out there and we live among the deer on our farms. In my area it's a night time thing, heck regular rifle season is turning more into a night time thing. But, the muzzy buck I got who knows maybe he was hoping for a doe or fawn and checking for scent. With so many females being killed already etc. there likely isn't many does left to come into heat. But, I bet if one does the suitors aren't far behind but at 2 AM it doesn't help us out. The deer in many areas just don't travel like they used to because there are 0 safe havens for them today unless you go into the city limits.

[FISHINGURU]

the "2nd rut" is actually better in areas where there are more does then bucks...because with the lopsided ratio not all the does got bred.

the fawns will be getting bred now too....i'd say right now to about the end of muzzy season some does and fawns will be getting bred.

[Bear55]

I hear you Musky, I went about 15 years myself without actually seeing a 2nd rut and then I've seen it twice in the past 4 years. Both bucks were two year olds so they needed a little more seasoning but it was fun to see.

[Musky Buck]

Right on Bear, you know we may have seen it before if we were out more, my family is likely ice fishing some years by the time it happens. I don't doubt it, there is so little daytime deer movement where I hunt now compared to years ago. All the land is being hunted in many many sections compared to years ago, each deer trail has numerous stands watching them and I'm not surprised the last 10 years have been totally different comparing deer movement during shooting hours. I'm part of the pressure problem as well. 10 years ago I was the only stand in the section, now there are at least 19 that I'm aware of. That'll change deer habits in a hurry.

[jlm]

Perhaps it depends on the area. Last weekend I saw 4 bucks trailing and chasing one doe. It was a sight to see. That is pretty late for the normal rut and a bit early for the second round (when non-bred and yearling does go into estrous). I have seen chasing every season I ahve hunted with BP (and that is numerous). Some years its more than others but I have always seen it. I think a lot depends on the number of bucks left from the rifle season, the pressure throughout all the seasons, and food source relative to your hunting location (to draw in the does). In my opinion, it can be better than the rut as there is far less hunting pressure. You get to see the chasing with little disturbance.

[paul pachowicz]

it's the ugly ones that don't get bred during the rut. Those wenches get passed up but, out of sympathy some loney bachelor just do them a favor.

[Bear55]

I think it does depend where you hunt, I was near Brainerd and didn't see a thing. Game cams also confirmed zero daytime activity. Just too much pressure on the deer and they don't move unless they have to. I went up north and we had several deer sighting and a little late rut activitiy.

[Musky Buck]

I agree guys, it depends on where you are and how severe the pressure is. Our area has historically had a good distribution of bucks and does so I'm guessing most does are bred before the 2nd rut in my area or they are shot leaving very few to come into heat the 2nd time, a better chance might be that doe fawn, with intense hunting pressure no wonder they opt for nightime chasin.