Taking up the enitre lane of traffic

[irvingdog]

Minnesota is ful of professional protestors.

there is a core of cyclists that are anarchistic, revisionists regarding our society in general. Perhpas they also have been to a local CM ride......

[Reynolds]

Nofishfisherman,

Indeed I did look up the national HSOforum of Critical Mass. From what I had read on that site it did not seem to be consistent with what you had written. Now having looked into the MN Critical Mass site I can understand why you posted that information. Like you said, it appears that the MN branch is not necessarily representative of the ideas of Critcal Mass. My apologies to you Nofishfisherman.

[say_der]

Quote:

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2). Bicyclists should ride on the road, and must ride in the same direction as traffic.

It is illegal and unsafe for bicyclists to ride against (facing) traffic. Motorists do not expect, and therefore are often unable to see, bicyclists riding on the wrong side of the road.

Why are bicyclists encouraged to ride on the road, even when adjacent sidewalks and bike trails are available?

A 1996 study determined the likelihood of a bicycle accident by facility type. (This is the only major study that adjusts crash data for the number of miles bicyclists actually travel on these facilities.) The study found that riding on the road is not only safer—but much safer—than riding on these other types of facilities.

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I am a causual biker. I put on a few hundred miles per year. 95% of those miles are on MN state designated trails - it's a great way to utilize abandoned railroad lines. I don't understand how I am more likely to get injured on one of these than on the road. The only other people on these are other bikers, roller bladers, horses once in a while and people on foot. I stop at stop signs on these trails and check for vehciles at these crossings. This is about the only chance I'd ever have of being hit by a car unless someone really doesn't know how to drive!

Unless I am misunderstanding what is being said, seems to be that bike trails should be safe. What am I missing here?

[Hammer Handle]

The study says it is safer to ride on the highway than beside it. Comparing trails to this is totally different....

[irvingdog]

If you are properly illuminated, and follow the rules, then you are an anticipated part of traffic. If you are on one of the many bike trails, eventually you cross roads at places cars do not expect one to be crossing.

WHAM!

[Ely Lake Expert]

I don't mind bicyclists, but it (Contact Us Please) [PoorWordUsage]es me off when they think they own road and won't move over or at least go single file in busy traffic. It was even worse when i was out in Colorado. They were all sponsered riders that went up the mountain. They were really (Contact Us Please). Ahhhhhhh I just get angry thinking about it. You don't know how bad I wanted to do a drive by with a paintball gun sometimes. Anyway I don't even want to talk about it anymore. ahhhh

[Shack]

Did'nt Critty Mass have a rally last weekend. I heard one of their members (not sure if it was a member or just some one in crow at rally) flicked off a channel 5 news camera! What a nice bunch!

I also heard at another gathering some of the Critty Mass people had to be roughed up by police and arrested.

Again, sounds like a nice group of people.

I am all for pedle bikers rights and such, but I would never go to that length. I observe a bikers way as much as I would a peddy! give them the right of way! But when I am on the other end of the stick, I sure respect cars and trucks. I would not want to battle with any of those things on a bike.

This group is sure making a name for them selves!

[Hammer Handle]

Yea, they try to run away from the police and resist arrests. They just video taped the fight with cops and got the police in trouble. No comment on the lack of respect and resisting arrest though. So, now the police let them get by with their "rally".

They should ticket them all for breaking the law!

[TimR]

I don't ride a bike to work. My bike is a rack in the garage that wet items from the boat dry off on.

What I don't understand is the ire from all these drivers about bikers that split lanes, run stopsigns, run lights, etc. Everytime bikers do this, they (while they are a legitimate part of traffic) minimize their effect on the rest of traffic.

I don't care if they follow the rules if the don't cause an accident. Every biker you see out there is one less car in front of you at the light. Every time they pull up to a red light, wait for an opening and cruise across a red light - that is one less spot in traffic they are taking up at the light. Same think when they split lanes.

I see them blow through stopsigns all the time - after first checking to make sure there is no conflicting traffic. Who cares? It is one less car on the road.

That means you and I get to work faster 99% of the time.

Tim

[irvingdog]

Very interesting perspective, and kinda tough to dispute.

[Hammer Handle]

But, read my post on "almost hit a biker". When making a right turn at a stoplight, I look to the left and right and start to go...but how many look back way behind us on the right? How many people will see the biker blocked by a car as he buzzes through?

You need to stop for pedistrians, but they are easy to see as they are on the sidewalk...and they don't just suddenly appear as they come out of nowhere and buzz through.

If the lane is all open and you slow way down and don't stop...well...maybe that is fine (not really)...but when traffic is there and you are hidden as you drive where people aren't looking and shouldn't be expected to look...you better not buzz through!

[irvingdog]

Yeah, I wouldn't dispute that point either Hammerhandle. If bikers have any brains at all, they have their head on a swivel every second they are riding, otherwise they will have their head on a morgue slab.

[Hammer Handle]

I guess I would be rather 30 seconds late for work then hit a kid (or adult) on a bike and seriously injure them.

[Flatlander]

But, read my post on "almost hit a biker". When making a right turn at a stoplight, I look to the left and right and start to go...but how many look back way behind us on the right? How many people will see the biker blocked by a car as he buzzes through?

[Scott M]

Well, guess what. I'm trying to get to downtown Minneapolis with my wife after picking her up from her work on the Minneapolis Univ. of Minn. campus. We carpool, as we do the majority of the week. And guess what? It was my misfortune that it was the last Friday of the month, the date that critical mass selects for one of their rides. And I was stuck in traffic while they rode through about 5 light changes on the intersection of Oak Street and Washington avenue. No police in sight. It took about 10-15 minutes.

Could somebody have made a citizen's arrest? What can people do about this? I guess if you try and stop their protest they will key your vehicle, bang on and surround your vehicle, etc. The U's campus is about as bicycle friendly as any part of the state, and yet they choose to ride through there? They want bicyclists to be considered part of traffic and are required to follow traffic laws, yet they go through 5 red lights?

After reading about critical mass at Wikipedia I just want to puke. Bicycles serve a purpose for those who use them and are close enough to where they live and work, but they aren't an option for most. I probably would have flipped out if this was a 1 hour NYC display. For an "organization" or "movement" that has been around for 15 years, what progress have they made? What progress do they hope to make?

Get a life!

[Shack]

I wonder what would happen if they did try this stuff in New York. I think things would be a little different.

I am all for biker’s rights and such, but this critical mass group is board line a violent mob at times.

[yakfisher]

There was an article in Bicycling last month about critical mass. They do have the rides in New York and other major metro areas. As I recall from the article the rides have gotten out of hand on several occasions. It really was an interesting article about the rides. According to the article there is no organizational structure, which eliminates law suits against the organization since it doesn't exist.

[Kodiak]

look at them idiots in the first post they are trying to make people mad!!

[irrequietum]

When there is no designated bike lane, single file close to the side of the road is not safer for cyclists, whether alone or in a large group. The reason: it encourages car and truck traffic to pass them in the lane in which the bicyclist is operating, increasing the likelihood of the vehicle hitting bicyclists. It is safer for a single cyclist or a group of cyclist to ride more in the lane, taking their space. Further, if a group of cyclists are riding three across in a lane, they take up a shorter length of the road making it easier for other traffic to pass safely when there is a passing lane and the oncoming traffic is clear (easier than if they were stretched out single file).

I understand that some car and truck drivers get annoyed by being delayed by a bicyclist or group of bicyclists. But I cannot recall it ever haven taken me more than 10-20 seconds extra to get to work because I had to wait for a bicyclist. I know it can sometimes delay you more than that. For me, 20 seconds extra is laughable given that I sit on a bucket ice fishing, and sometimes am out there for an hour or two and don't catch a thing!

[Hammer Handle]

I guess I disagree. The biker must be towards the shoulder of the road. It is safer for them and the car driver.

I see cyclists on 101 in the western suburbs a lot, which is great. But, if they rode in the middle of the lane on this winding road...you could be delayed a lot more than 20 seconds. If I drove my car at 15 mph in a 40 mph...I would get nasty looks too.

Also, cyclist have to obey the laws. Stop signs do not mean look and go....

[shizzy]

Quote:

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Minnesota laws calls for cyclists to ride with the flow of traffic and as close to the right side of the road as practical, except in the following situations: 1) when overtaking another vehicle proceeding in the same direction; 2) when preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway; and 3) when reasonably necessary to avoid roadside conditions (fixed or moving objects, vehicles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards, narrow lane widths) which make it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge.

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Quote:

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From MN State Law, 169.222:

Persons riding bicycles upon a roadway or shoulder shall not ride more than two abreast and shall not impede the normal and reasonable movement of traffic and, on a laned roadway, shall ride within a single lane.

so what Im reading here is a bicyclist is entitled to the whole lane. They are encouraged to ride to the far right side for saftey, but the way I view it the cycclist gets the whole lane. just like a Motorcyclist (which I am) only takes up half the lane but is entitled to the whole lane. In all reality, you should be passing a bicylist just the same as you would pass a motorcyclist. yo u change lanes, drive past them and then move back over. No where does it read Cyclist must ride single file, it states they should only ride in one lane on multi laned roads.

[Hammer Handle]

But, what does it mean when it says they "shall not impede the normal and reasonable movement of traffic".

[shizzy]

I think that basically means to not intentionally block traffic. it almost sounds like one of those "catch alls" they toss in so a Cop has a reason to jump in if needed. in all reality, a lone biker will ride on the far right and cars will drive by.

[mikejodi]

Here is something I don't understand. We have spent millions on getting bike lanes and bike paths, but yet some cyclists still want to ride in traffic? I myself feel safer off the road than on. Now there have been some cyclists I have seen in Mpls., and they are awesome in traffic, but others, man I just don't see how they have not been seriously hurt by an automobile yet.

Me, give me a bike trail ANY day. I am afraid of cars. Btw, has anyone witnessed the brave soul who rides his mountain bike in the winter around Ft. Snelling? Now there is a hardy Minnesotan!

[mmeyer]

Bike trails are great unless they are clogged up by slower cyclists, walkers and runners. They can be very dangerous if that's the case. Roads can be plenty safe as long as you make yourself visible and follow the rules of the road. Cyclists are allowed to use the road the same as automobiles. If the trails don't get you to where you need to be, then you have no choice than to take to the roads.