What did I do???

[kc0myy]

I have no clue what I did today to my ATV. Its a sportmans 350L. I just put some seafoam in it. and then I brought it out fishing. But this summer/fall I got water in the recoil. Well $300 later it was fixed yay. but today when I got home. It died really quick. Went in the house and I came back out to start it up and move it. I COULD NOT PULL THE ROPE OUT. the rope would move about 4-6" and that was it. The recoil is working I think because the rope comes out and recoils but its like the engine to froze or something. My battary is dead. So I hook the jumpers up WITH CAR OFF and try starting it that batt is really dead like no power at all. It still didn't turn over with car off and jumpers from the car bayy to my atv batt. So I whent to the hardwear store and got some good lube. I sprayed the [PoorWordUsage] of the recoil (I think its called counter balence SP). Oh yeah I also check the oil because it oil injected and it was full. So I dont know what I did. This summer I took the skid plate off to see if I could fix the atv myself. well I could not fix it so I brought it to Mies Outland and had it fixed. PLEASE HELP I DONT WANT TO SPEND $300 ON MY MACHINE AGAIN.

[fasternu]

When you jump started it did it turn over at all? If the engine didn't even turn over, and the recoil doesn't work at all, well, I hate to be negative, but it sounds like a broken rod/piston. If it is totally frozen, you may be looking at a new motor. How old is the machine, and how many miles?

[knoppers]

that was the first thing that came to me, the motor is seized up. 2 strokes are a good motor to work on, do not bring it to a dealer, try a small engine shop.

[Guest]

sounds like the engine locked up to me too.

[JohnMickish]

Id say the same thing, especially if the lights and stuff work that will tell you that the battery is still good.

[stumper]

first thing you need to do is pull the spark plug out and see if it will turn over.MAKE SURE THE KILL SWITCH IS IN OFF POSITION.or fire may occur. The needle may have stuck in the carb,filling the engine with gas.If it still wont turn over,its siezed,any good small engine place can do the work.good luck.

stump

[mechanictim]

If the oil reservoir is still full on a two stroke machine after you have been riding, it sounds to me like you have a problem with the oil injection system. After you get the motor running again make sure to get the oil system fixed. You should also add some injector oil to your first couple of tanks of gas to get a 50:1 mix.

[kc0myy]

Well the exhaust manifold has a leak in it. but the batt is good it just dead becuase the batt is outside. I think it has around 22,000 miles I am not sure. Its around 12 years old. I did fill the oil up and its lower because of me riding it I forgot to add that. Well I got a friend whos really good at small engeins. so I'll bring it over there is see what the &%*& is up with it. It just makes me mad we spend $300 on it 3 months ago and is broke again. Well thanks for the help.

later

[Neiko]

Don't know if this will work but my Bro-in-law likes playing with engine and he has told me in the past to pull the spark plug and pour in some Mystery Oil and let it sit for 24 hours and supposedly it will work itself in. Just a thought.

[fasternu]

The problem with that Mystery oil is that the engine froze up for a reason, such as the metal grinding against metal caused so much friction that it can't move. By forcing the engine to move, you are very possibly going to make even more damage. The cylinder head must be pulled (at a minimum) to see what it is that caused it to freeze up in the first place. Being a racer and small engines tinkerer, I'm guessing the ring broke and the pieces got caught betweeen the piston and the wall, or the piston somehow became somewhat twisted and jammed against the cylinder wall. If you try to free it, it could mean the difference between replacing something fairly cheap (a ring for instance) and replacing the entire block, because it got gouged and is too damaged to fix. I learned most of this the hard way when my generator did almost this exact same thing. For the record, I did end up wrecking the cylinder wall, so now I need a new block. (but please take it easy on me, I am not a pro mechanic, just trying to be helpful)

[kc0myy]

I am new to engines and stuff. If you mess up the wall of the block can't you just boar it out bigger? and just today I brought it into the small engine repair shop. I don't know if any of you know Tom Magnuson. Thats who I brought it to. Tom and I live in Annandale.

[stumper]

If the motor hydraliced like I stated earlier,you have a carb probem and most likely no internal damage to the motor.I have seen this alot with 2 strokes that dont get run alot.

[fasternu]

yes, you can bore it out a little bigger, if there is just minor damage. If the metal is scratched deep enough though, no you can't. Sometimes it's because the cylinder wall will get too thin and would break while being run at higher rpms, and other times it's because some pistons only come in certain sizes. I'm staying hopeful that it is something else causing the problem, I just didn't want it to get hurt worse by seeing somebody force it to move. Then you have turned a repair bill from maybe $150 to upwords of $1000.

[tomfromblaine]

I think I would go with Stumper here to start out, the fact that you said you initially could pull the recoil rope out a few inches before she locked up really sounds like a hydraulic lock ( fuel in the crank case) pull the spark plug then see if you can pull it over, if you can then yank the heck out of it for several pulls put in a clean dry spark plug and see if it will run. then start shutting off your pet cock till you get the carb issue semi-diagnosed and keep using seafoam that will more than likely take care of your problems. keep us posted.

P.S. I would probably disconnect the exaust at the cylinder prior to the big yank, you dont want to blow a bunch of fuel into the pipe.

[Dave]

I suspect that initial "few inches" of recoil rope he's pulling out is just the slack until the recoil engages.

[kc0myy]

Yes it was the slack intell she engaged. I talked with my friend Tom today. He said its not froze up because turn the clutch (something the turned the engine) with a pry bar and that turn the engine. He said he heard something in there a noise. Tom also looked at the spark plug and it didnt look like anything was damaged and it lookrf normal. I did tell him about the problem I had with water in the recoil and I said it happend again this winter. He said it could just but that. but why would the machine for shut off very quick when I slowed down it a stop?? Because of ice I dont think so. He said to stop back in like 2 days to see how far he got. I'll keep you guys posted. THANK YOU for all your help. You are a good bunch of guys and possablie gals

Thank you later

[tomfromblaine]

What's the verdict?

[kc0myy]

Umm I don't know. I just got down talking with Tom. He said he took off the clutch cover and put a heater on it for a few hours he thought it would be water in there he found no water. So he took pry bar and bust loose the engine and got it turning. put it all back togethere and started it up. Then he mixed some oil in the gas. Tom ran it wide open and nothing seemed to be worng. My ATV is oil injected he said the oil pump could be bad or going out. Tom said as long as there is oil in the gas there should not be anything worng with it. But he does not know how long my ATV will run. I am stuck between a rock and a hard place. Tom said if that was his machine he would sell it at a acution and take that money and but it on a down paymant on a newer ATV. My ATV is 15-16 years old. Thanks for any help guys!!

[tripper]

Well kc as fare as selling it at an auction goes let me ask you this, would you like to be the one getting stuck with a atv that has a bad engine. If you are going to let the bidders know the engine is bad , fine go that route and pick up new or newer one.

It sounds to me that to repair yours you will have to the cylender bored or replaced, new rings, maybe new piston. With a machine as old as yours they may also find that the crank bearing are wore and need replacing and the crank itself may need work or replacement. A new oil pump is for sure. A friend of mine took his 2 stroke into a shop last summer. They bored the cylender 10K replaced the piston and rings, this run him close to $1000. What you do only you can decide but I could not sell the machine without the buyer knowing it had a bad engine.

[kc0myy]

yes thats a good Q&A. I would not like to buy an ATV with a bad engine and not know about it. Would you guys now how much a used 350Lcc would run for? Every thing eles on the ATV runs fine. I am in between a rock and a hard place.

[tomfromblaine]

12 years old? just mix oil into your gas, doesent sound cost effective to do a proper rebuild I hate it when I have to make these types of decisions. sounds like mechanic-Tim hit er' on the head.

[castmaster]

not sure what i would do, but i second the previous post on NOT selling it unless the buyer or bidders are made aware of the problem!!

i would be leery on just mixing oil in the gas. if it seized up, there is most likely damage done internally. i'd either get it fixed, or sell it to a KNOWING buyer who feels like they can fix it and still be happy with what they have into it for $$.

i agree its a tough spot to be in, but dont stick the next guy in the same spot.

as far as value goes, i'd suspect its not worth a whole lot, maybe a couple hundred bucks, in the condition you describe and the age of the machine.