What do you think?

[SuddenlySummer]

I mean we get laughed at for living in the middle of the country, in the middle of nowhere.

Hey, I like it here.

I don't live in a city that's six feet below sea level for a reason. I don't live in Florida, hurricane alley, for a reason. I don't live in LA or San Francisco, earthquake zone for a reason. I don't remember Grand Forks getting looted when they flooded.

They all laugh at us for living where we do. For having four seasons.

Should I pay for their ignorance with my tax dollars to rebuild their city that's six feed below sea level? Should my tax dollars be spent to rebuild Joe Blow's beach front house sitting on stilts ten feet from the ocean?

Not to be cruel but I think not!

This was predicted. This was enevitable.

[captkev]

I've had some gooood time in dem dar bayou! lots of memories in the big easy. but lets re-locate it to north La.

next time it won't wash away. I feel bad for them, but they should have learned a lesson back in 1969, I herd storys that the coffins were poping out of the ground. this is going to cost billions, and if they think of rebuilding below sea level, I might concider moveing to Canada...

[Riverratpete]

Spent some time down the Big Easy over the last 10 years, good food, good music. With that said, the city will be better off in a few years after everything is rebuilt, it's sad about the death,destruction and coming soon a public health nightmare. The thing that really torks me off is the looters, now I have no real problem with people who need food/water and essentials but do they really need the tv's stereo's and clothes? I say cap a few of them and that'll get the message through.

[MIKE IN lINO III]

"Should I pay for their ignorance with my tax dollars to rebuild their city that's six feed below sea level? Should my tax dollars be spent to rebuild Joe Blow's beach front house sitting on stilts ten feet from the ocean?"

Wait until your home owners insurance goes up as a result of this mess just like it did with Andew.

[Kab Dreamin]

The unfortunate reality is that if the insurance companies were to charge only the people in hurricane prone locations for the true cost of insuring them, the rates would be so prohibitively high that no one would be able to afford the insurance. There just aren't enough people to spread the risk over in those areas. Since they would be uninsured, we would still end up paying for it in Federal relief monies given to them to rebuild after a disaster. The rest of the nation will always end up paying for hurricane damage in their insurance rates.

[rundrave]

its an interesting topic. I sort of look at it, as it is "OUR" Tsunami, who is going to help us? Probably nobody, maybe Canada.

I feel for the people who lost loved ones etc.

The people down there knew this was coming, to see all of these people who didnt leave, what fools.

Its just an unfortunate event.

[mtreno]

no - only the people who could afford those extream insurance rates would live there. or if not no one. cant live in a home without insurance unless you pay for it in cash. which if you did that you would be crazy yet still to have no insurance. i really hope for nothing to be rebuilt there because it will happen again - but thats just wishfull thinking. it is like the whole grand forks thing - i love the guy on tv who says "well i will have to rebuild everything again just like last year and two years ago..... what a moran..... i know if i ever had to deal with a mess like that my new home would be on the biggest hill around.

all that being said and even with the fact they new this was coming i still pray for the people who still need to be saved. i hope that as many loved ones a possible get out unharmed.... and move to somewhere above sea level... and remember to leave town when there is a class 5 storm in there path!

[deeky]

Pretty sure my insurance won't be going up. My agent said they don't even sell insurance in the southeast for that very reason. Too much risk that would impact other customers around the country. Seemed logical but slightly far fetched at the time, now I'm happy.

[WxGuy]

They pay federal taxes down there too, don't they? Of course. Regarding other countries coming to our aid, the Governor of LA has said they have had numerous international offers of help. The question is whether or not we accept and how. i.e. forgiving debt, manpower, or food. We have almost all of that already, it's just a matter of how we get the help to the people who need it, and where they will be. Right now there are 4 Navy ships taking food and water to people in the city, and the Governor is figuring out how to get everyone out of the city because the levees can't be fixed right now and the city is still flooding.

[Eric Wettschreck]

First off, let us not forget that there are dead people floating around in the streets down there. There are dead moms and dads and dead children and dead aunts and dead uncles and dead cousins. Who knows, maybe a dead fiancée. Let’s throw in a dead grandma and dead grandpa and toss in a couple of real close dead friends. There are also a whole bunch more people that are probably going to die or become seriously ill. Did they make the wisest decision to stay? Did they have the means to leave? Do we know all the details of the who/what/why of every decision made? I’ll take a guess and say no.

Yup, it’s America’s tsunami and we’re more than likely on our own. However, we are one of the better off nations in the world so shouldn’t we be able to “Take care of our own?” I mean, I hear it all the time….why are we peddling around other nations when we have problems right here at our own back door. Well fellas we have a rather large problem right here right now. Not our back door, more like our basement door if that’s what we prefer to call it. Time to put up or shut up.

Should we or shouldn’t we pay to help rebuild? That debate will go on until the end of time. I ask this, if it were your home would you rebuild? Would you file an insurance claim? Would you move? Where would you go? Or is this just somebody else’s problem cuz it will never happen to me?

I suppose if millions of people from Louisiana and Mississippi migrated to Minnesota the next thing we’d hear is how all the locals are losing jobs, housing is too expensive, too many immigrants, can’t we do something about the huge influx of “Outsiders?”

We live in the land of 4 seasons and we’re lucky. However, we live right smack dab in the middle of tornado alley, mosquito haven, -20 winter, 110 degree heat index in the summer, soybean aphids, swamps up the ying yang, drought………..Yeah we’re the smart ones for being above sea level that’s for darn sure.

When times are the toughest is when we see peoples true colors. Shame on all of us if we’re concerned about our homeowner’s insurance rates in the wake of this natural disaster. At least we still have a home to insure.

Off my soapbox now, go ahead and let me have it.

[WxGuy]

You're right, there are many dead. There isn't a number of estimated dead out of N.O. yet because rescuers haven't had time to count or recover the floating bodies while saving the stranded. Who knows when people can go back to their homes? They have been told that in 1 week they can go back home for less than a day to get some personal belongings, then they can't come back home for 6-8 weeks. That amount of time might even get longer.

It sounds grim, but gas prices are only the start of the economic impact we're going to feel from this storm.

[buzzsaw]

If you gave that speech at a podium I'd stand up and applaud you!

[fiskyknut]

Hats off to you Boilerguy, very well said indeed.

3 years ago in June my wife and I lost our first real house to a flood, 2 vehicles and 90% of our possesions as well. Thank God for fema, the Red Cross, and the other agencies to numerous to mention that were here to help. Was'nt looking for a handout, but the hand sure helped and for this I will be forever gratefull to the American taxpayer as well as the agencies involved. This calamity was a giant step backwards in our lives, we now are back in a trailerhouse just as we were early in our marriage. NO the gov did not buy it for us. Though we got assistance to get our lives back together it surely was'nt enough to put us back where we stood a week before this happened with a real house, the 2 vehicles, and with all our loved and irreplacable keep sakes we lost ect. Basically we are living as we did 10 years before this happened, and that is okay, life goes on and what does'nt kill you learns you and makes us stronger.

I at one time wondered, as well as complained about where all those tax beans are going and to whom.

Suddenlysummer I pray you are never put in the shoes that those people down south are wearing at this time.....BUT if that F4 tornado comes to your town, turns your life topsy turvy, takes your home and possesions, or worse, I am certain you would be singing a completly different tune.

My hopes and prayers go to the folks down south. Bless the volunteers and agencies that are there to help them.

fiskyknut

[mtreno]

thus why we live in the greatist country in the world to have all these resources to help and take care of these issues that catch us off gaurd. but everything costs money. and that money comes from somewhere. and something happens once and you need help - by all means that help will be there to take care of you and get you back to running your own life. my only issue is if/when they decide to rebuild the whole city.

fiskyknut - sorry to here about your loss. i cant even imagine what that would be like to go thru. i am sure there are so many things that can never be replaced. there is no better way to say in other than that really sucks! but you did not build another house in the same place and then wonder why it happened again. and again. insted you took you loss for what it is and moved on to something else.

if an f4 torando came thru a town in minnesota (which we have all see what they can do) we would never have known for a week it was coming. yes i understand that there were tons of people who were stranded and could not leave but then you get the lady on the tv who says i would never leave me home and we have been just fine in the past. thats just stupid.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/research/1282151.html

from 2001 - kinda interesting -

******* disclaimer ******** this is a debate and i am enjoying reading both sides of it here and on another political site. please no one take my words as a personal or a group attact of any one person or any group of persons no matter of there are members of this site or poor souls stranded on a roof right now in new orleans.*********

[Eric Wettschreck]

Stab in the dark here, but let's say the population of New Orleans (Prior Katrina) is 250,000. This is a guess.

What should a quarter of a million people do? Move? Where they gonna go?? Got room in your back yard for them? Are you suggesting the Big Easy be totally abandoned and turned into swamp land? If that is the case then I guess the entire population of Grand Forks should be relocated to somebodies back yard and the entire area be turned into farmland.

Every area in our country has natural disasters that need to be dealt with. I honestly do not understand the logic behind what you're saying.

[wmn luv me walleye fearme]

It's one thing to be sore that our tax dollars are going to rich people that have multi million dollars houses near the coast that get destroyed every 10 years from a hurricane and get replaced at our expense. But we are dealing with 3 of the poorest states in the country. For the most part these people would have never had the resources to move from an area and I can't even imagine what its like to be going through that. If my insurance, taxes etc go up to help pay for it, so be it, I'd much rather it go for that then a lot of what it gets wasted on. I'd consider myself pretty lucky that i'm thinking about how its going to affect myself monetarily vs how I'm going to bury a family member

[Lip RIPPER!]

Amen. I don't think all of those babies who are in the neo-natal care units and were transferred to a safer area are ignorant at all for living there. I'm pretty sure they didn't have much to say about where they were living along with all the other children in the area who are now feeling the affects of this tragedy. Some people don't get to choose where they live.

[mtreno]

from what i have read there are about 450,000 people in the city/area. so just to give it more value for us lets just say about the size of mpls. what should half a million people do move? yes - they have to for the time being anyway why rebuild on that spot that we already no from its current condition is going to have serious issues. in theory you could spend the next 10 years rebuilding the whole city and dike system. the next year it could all be wiped out again. or it may take another 170 years who knows - but why take the risk. almost every major metro area in the nation has had a huge building boom in the last 5 years. i am sure we can fit in another half million without even a notice of the impact - unless they all decide to ge to the same area - but thats a whole nother topic. swamp land? sure why not - from my understanding its all mississippi silt runoff so it cant be too easy to build on in the first place.

grand forks i am not going to get into in depth today - but how many times do you have to rebuild a house to learn that in the spring the river will be up high and if you throw some rain on top of that-well we have all seen the devestation it creates. same issues at hand here why ask for it.

"Every area in our country has natural disasters that need to be dealt with."

so if you know you are going to have to deal with a natural disaster at some point why would you build a whole city below sea level.....twice.....

[Animal]

Kab Dreamin

If people in a certain area had to bear the risk of building in disaster prone areas of the country and couldn't buy insurance for thier property, they would be forced into smarter development decisions. Likewise, there would be less resulting damage caused by a natural disaster and far less tax money would be needed. Expecting taxpayers and insurance policy holders to shoulder part of the burden for dumb building and poor land use planning is rediculous.

[Eric Wettschreck]

If that's our mentality, we should get to re-locating half the nation......but to where?? Sauce for the Big Easy is sauce for the rest of the nation. No playing favorites.

Let's start evacuating everyone in the area stretching from LA to San Fran. As, we all know they live right smack dab on a fault line. Earthquakes have destroyed them in the past and are gonna hit them again. Enjoy your high tech stuff now as once everyone has been moved it will all be coming from Japan.

Next let's get to moving everyone in the outer banks of North Carolina and Virginia. Cripes, every couple of years they get swept away. No more fishin for blues.

New York is prime for yet another terrorist attack. It's probably a good idea to get everyone outta there too. Sell your stocks now!!!!!!!!! Gonna have to go to the local high school to see a play from now on I guess.

And so on, and so on.

Where next???? Where to? The mid-west? No way man, tornadoes will take them out if they move there. Where we gonna move em to??? I know, let's move them all to the twin cities. All however many millions of them. Ya think there's traffic problems now, just wait until all the mandated permanent evacuations are done. Glad I don't live there, 694's gonna be a big mess.

Why would you build a city anywhere???? Because it's your home that's why. Do you want the government employed evacuation police knocking on your door saying,"Dude, ya gotta go. Another natural disaster will happen eventually."

Who are we to dictate where people can and can not live?? Who are we to decide where another man should hang his hat?

If tax dollars rebuild, so be it. They pay taxes too. If insurance dollars rebuild, so be it. They pay insurance too. If companies from the private sector donate money to help rebuild, so be it. We all buy stuff from them.

[mtreno]

yep and everyone should get helmets and knee pads and live in padded homes..........

your right everywhere you go there is some sort of natural thing that can and will someday be and issue. but you can aviod the some of thoughtless ones. we could go on and on and on about every area of the country and its issues. but when you have a town you cant dig three feet down without water coming up out of the ground. thats not a good sign. why dont we build a house over a steam vent in yellowstone - or on the side of mount st. hellen. its like driving your truck at full speed over an ice breaker - most of the time you will make it - but is it worth the risk?

your right people have every right to build wherever they want. thats what this country is all about. but why build there? and if the goverment steps in and starts replacing everything or course its going to be a major city just like it was. but the fact is there will always be houses out in this area. thats a fact - the have been there from 1830's on. and somewhere down the road the same thing or worse will happen and everyone will wonder why.

CA - i get the same way when there is an earth does its thing and everyone in CA is like i can't believe this happened? what cant you believe it? why is it hard to understand. if you live in an area like that its one of the things that someday you are going to have to deal with. now if there was one in south dakota as big as some the CA has seen and came out of no where. then that would be an acceptable thing to dam about. but when your house sits 14 feet below sea level, someday your home will be under the sea. fact!

now i am not sure but i was told or read somewhere that the whole city is between 14 feet below and three feet above sea level. which if you think about it makes it a very level area. mpls has way more than a change of 17 feet. i am sure that has to do with it being a silt flat from the miss but it still seems weird and adds to the problem - there really is no high ground.....

these people/out southern friends need the the prayers they can get over the next few days. keep them in your thoughts they are all in a very rough spot right now. pray for as many of them as possible to get out safely and return to there loved ones.

[76k20]

Im in agreement with mtreno,

I can't imagine how badly this hits some and I agree as americans we need to take care of those in need. It's a shame it had to happen, but if It had missed by a larger margin then what? Life would go on the same day in day out until the most predictable type of storm blows over the bahamas and florida keys, then hits the gulf of mexico. fueled by water warmer than most peoples bathwater the storm grows into a catagory 5 hurricane. Its gotta make landfall somewhere...

Its only a matter of time before A tragedy like this happens to any city on the coast, but the big easy is particularly vulnerable due to its elevation as we can all plainly see.

I dont think rebuilding on the same foundations should be in order at all. I cant believe that the people who lost all of their personal effects or worse their loved ones, would consider rebuilding below sea level knowing statistically it will happen again.

I dont think they should all uproot and move to different cities, but if the entire city needs to be rebuild why not pick an elevation suited for human life without the use of levees, dikes, and huge pumpout facilities.

lifes most valuble lessons are learned from mistakes

[Dan Thiem]

Quote:

---

lifes most valuble lessons are learned from mistakes

---

Oh so true!

[ccarlson]

Even as a conservative who surely doesn't like to see tax dollars compensating for peoples poor choices in regular daily life, I absolutely can't believe what I read in the first posts on this thread.

I just got done watching an hours news coverage on the devistation. You are either not allowing yourself to comprehend the level of this disaster or you are not fully aware of how widespread the death and damage are.

As the newscast anchor said tonight, (paraphrasing): "Many people want to know how they can help and if you were here today to see what we are seeing, you would want to give everything you have."

I would like to suggest you get out of your day to day view of reality in your perfect world that you made all the right choices to belong to and take a good look at what really happened to these people. I'm fairly certain that you would regret your previously posted view.

Besides the lack of human compassion, there are also many other flaws to your theory. Our country and economy depend on natural and manufactured resources that the affected area provides. It is ignorant to assume that they are at fault for living where they do when in fact they are just getting by being part of the link that creates our great country.

I apologize for posting my first negative post on Fishing Minnesota but I'm not too proud to be a part of it today anyway.

ccarlson

[Aquaman01]

Boilerguy - yer a good man.

Stuff can happen ANYWHERE. Nobody is exempt from natural disasters. Didn't The Red River flood over a few years back and do some serious damage? All life on this 6" layer of topsoil is tenuous at best.

No matter where we choose live or hide, we're all a God-Phart from being in their soggy, filth-ridden, homeless shoes.

As for tax dollars (UGH, I can't believe someone here put a price on doing the right thing) my tax dollars subsidized private airlines after 9/11 to help compensate them for PROJECTED LOSSES! Billions of our tax dollars for money they HADN"T EARNED YET!!

I'm proud and satisfied to have my tax dollars help out my countrymen when they are in a time of need.

'nuff said