New electronics question

[CigarGuy]

Going to buy a new sonar for the bow of the boat tomorrow. I'm kinda set on either a Lowrance® HDS-5 or 7, Gen 2/StructureScan™ HD LSS-2. I'm going move my 332 & GlobalMap 3500C from the bow to the dash. My 332 is sonar only. Can I link my new hds to my 332, so I'll have gps also? Would like to sell the 3500. I have to buy it at the big "C", because I have about 1/3 of it covered with points. Anybody know of a good price on the unit, so I can get them to match? Or, would it be better to wait and see if they go on sale closer to the opener?....Thanks

[Esox_Magnum]

No you can not get GPS on the 332, LSS is sweet but you need to be moving 2+mph to get clear imaging, when I add it to my rig I'll have a unit on the console dedicated to just SI/DI and keep my 5 on the dash for GPS and 7 up front in splitscreen gpraph/gps...

[CigarGuy]

Thanks...I was originally going to buy a Elite HDI 7-sonar/gps, put it on the bow and add structureScan later, but found out you can't add S/scan to the Elite series. The 2mph deal changes my plan on the bow. I have a side console, so it might be better to buy the Elite for the bow and later add the HDS-5 with S/scan & the 3500 to the console. Going the cheaper route will save me an argument with my better half! That is until next year, when I upgrade What do you think about this plan? What is the difference between the Elite HDI and the HDS-gen 2 models?

[delcecchi]

I'm sort of behind the curve, but remember none of that fancy stuff other than regular sonar works with the US2 transducer if that is what you have.

I am pretty far behind in the electronics personally, but I thing the elite 7 would be a terrific unit for the bow. And I am interested in how all the down scan and side scan and all that works on Vermilion.

[CigarGuy]

I missed the Lowrance seminar at Cabelas this morning. Got stuck in an accident backup on I35 and turned around, it was too slick on the roads. Now, I have a little more time to research my buying decision. Del, I also really want to see how the SI will work on the side of deep drops/rock shelves, etc. My wife would kill me if I brought back both units!!

Thought I was a fairly decent walleye fisherman, but Vermilion is humbling me in the walleye catching department, I need all the help I can get. My first time fishing it was last year after buying the cabin, I have a lifetime to learn it. I can't believe the difference in fishing(catching) between the west and east sides of the lake!

[ClownColor]

Going to buy a new sonar for the bow of the boat tomorrow. I'm kinda set on either a Lowrance® HDS-5 or 7, Gen 2/StructureScan™ HD LSS-2. I'm going move my 332 & GlobalMap 3500C from the bow to the dash. My 332 is sonar only. Can I link my new hds to my 332, so I'll have gps also? Would like to sell the 3500. I have to buy it at the big "C", because I have about 1/3 of it covered with points. Anybody know of a good price on the unit, so I can get them to match? Or, would it be better to wait and see if they go on sale closer to the opener?....Thanks

Fleet farm had them on sale. I got my hds 5 gen2 ss/ds with insight package last year at gander for $699...i think thats the best deal i've seen for a current new unit.

[JohnMickish]

What is the difference between the Elite HDI and the HDS-gen 2 models?

If your just wondering what the bells and whistles difference is, you can look at the specs. If you want to know the hardware/software differences I don't think you will get your answer, but I have to assume that they are NOT the same on the inside. I would bet that the Elite units use older or cheaper processors to same money.

[delcecchi]

If your just wondering what the bells and whistles difference is, you can look at the specs. If you want to know the hardware/software differences I don't think you will get your answer, but I have to assume that they are NOT the same on the inside. I would bet that the Elite units use older or cheaper processors to same money.

I would bet that the processors are the same and the units and or software are defeatured on the less expensive unit. I base this opinion on my experience working for a large computer company that sold very similar units that had a significant premium for more performance. Examine the "interactive performance units" or whatever they were called on AS400. Pay more and some more of the performance is enabled. Mainframe Z series works the same. Includes a bunch of unused processor chips which will be activated for a fee.

So maybe no ethernet, or maybe just some capability disabled. Maybe underclocked.

But for them to use multiple chip and software development would be not cost effective. I don't think they sell enough units to make it worth while.

[delcecchi]

I missed the Lowrance seminar at Cabelas this morning. Got stuck in an accident backup on I35 and turned around, it was too slick on the roads. Now, I have a little more time to research my buying decision. Del, I also really want to see how the SI will work on the side of deep drops/rock shelves, etc. My wife would kill me if I brought back both units!!

Thought I was a fairly decent walleye fisherman, but Vermilion is humbling me in the walleye catching department, I need all the help I can get. My first time fishing it was last year after buying the cabin, I have a lifetime to learn it. I can't believe the difference in fishing(catching) between the west and east sides of the lake!

Yeah, west end walleye fishing sucks. Guess I will have to make the trek east a few times this summer. And I will be eating a lot more largemouth (unless they turn out to be too disgusting) since one hypothesis about the walleye recruitment problem is the increase in Largemouth numbers. So save a walleye, eat a largemouth is my slogan for the summer.

I have noticed that the evening shallow rock reef bite totally vanished about 10 years ago. Don't know why. Duane doesn't either and he is paid to know this stuff.

[JohnMickish]

Del, you are probably right. I was just thinking that they would be using some older technology stuff, like from the LCX27 days. I do know that the slow speed tracking on the Elite line is slower than on the HDS line.

[delcecchi]

Del, you are probably right. I was just thinking that they would be using some older technology stuff, like from the LCX27 days. I do know that the slow speed tracking on the Elite line is slower than on the HDS line.

I guess they could be. Just seems unlikely, given the volumes that I am guessing they sell.

[PerchJerker]

Your 332 is a gps/sonar combo. It will do GPS for you as long you have it connected to a gps antenna though the N2K nmea network .... it can be a separate gps antenna, or it can be an internal gps antenna in an HDS or an Elite 7 ..... but it needs to be connected to an antenna though an N2K nmea network.

I don't know the techy details about processors and update rates, but the big difference I know of between the Elite and the HDS series is no ethernet networking with the Elite series. I'm guessing that's a difference in control board and processors but maybe not processing speed? The Elite 5 can not do N2K nmea networking but you can do N2K with the Elite 7 (basically allows you to share gps related info and waypoints).

StructureScan is connected though ethernet so that's why it won't work on Elite units.

Elite HDI units do conventional sonar and down scan sonar. No capability for side scan. HDS units do conventional sonar, and you can connect the LSS-2 to HDS units to add side scan and down scan.

Hope that helps!

[CigarGuy]

Thanks for the info. I ended up purchasing a Elite 7, HDI. My wife caught wind of my impending purchase and lets just says, I had to re-think my plan.... They just don't understand-I was doing it for her to put more fish in the boat!

[Wish-I-Were-Fishn]

Just get it for her for Mother's Day

[Lemr]

check out thorne brothers they are having their 30th anniversary sale this friday thru sunday on sunday at 12:00 chris meyer from lowrance and tim winterhalter from hummingbird will be talking about electronics they also will have vendor reps on hand all weakend

[delcecchi]

Thanks for the info. I ended up purchasing a Elite 7, HDI. My wife caught wind of my impending purchase and lets just says, I had to re-think my plan.... They just don't understand-I was doing it for her to put more fish in the boat!

That is what I would buy if I was in the market at this time. It looks like a very nice unit at a reasonable price. (why a depthfinder costs more than a tricked out ipad is another question. )

[Kyhl]

(why a depthfinder costs more than a tricked out ipad is another question. )

Because we keep paying for them. They stayed under $1k for a long time then suddenly jumped past $2k and we bought them like they were candy.

As a business they have to be asking, why didn't we start charging $3k a long time ago?

[delcecchi]

Turns out there are companies already making sonars and gps's that connect wirelessly to an ipad or a computer or monitor.

And those interphase scanning, forward looking sonars look really cool.

[JohnMickish]

(why a depthfinder costs more than a tricked out ipad is another question. )

Throw your Ipad in the lake and see how well it works. Solidly mount an Ipad in a boat and see how long it takes the vibration too.

Now if Humminbird was to sell the same number of 1198 sonars as Apple does Ipads I bet the price wouldn't be that much different either, aside from the water and shock proofing.

[h8go4s]

+1

[delcecchi]

Throw your Ipad in the lake and see how well it works. Solidly mount an Ipad in a boat and see how long it takes the vibration too.

Now if Humminbird was to sell the same number of 1198 sonars as Apple does Ipads I bet the price wouldn't be that much different either, aside from the water and shock proofing.

I will buy the volume explanation, and all that sponsorship and advertising and other marketing expense adds up I am sure. As to the vibration and waterproofing, not so much. That doesn't add that much to the cost of manufacturing. And there are no batteries in a humminbird so that reduces the cost.

I wonder how many of those 1198's they sell in a year at almost 3k each. And how much they pay all those pro fishermen and tv fishermen to use them and to show them in their videos and shows.

I bet the marketing costs more than the manufacturing. And the markup in the sales channel is considerable as well I bet.

But if they can get it, good for them.

[CaptainMusky]

Why does an iPad cost double what a Google nexus or kindle fire? Overpriced gimmic in itself that sheep buy.

No different with boating electronics.

[JohnMickish]

I can tell you they pay those periods way less than think. With basically only two players in the game neither one is willing to go to far out on the limb and offer "big money" to more than just a handful of people.

I'd also like to know why an Ipad costs almost the same as a 40 inch smart TV?

[delcecchi]

Same deal. People will pay it. Look at Apple gross margin in their annual report.

But in defense, the electronics in an ipad, not counting the screen, probably cost significantly more than those in a smart tv.

[Brad B]

Throw your Ipad in the lake and see how well it works. Solidly mount an Ipad in a boat and see how long it takes the vibration too.

Now if Humminbird was to sell the same number of 1198 sonars as Apple does Ipads I bet the price wouldn't be that much different either, aside from the water and shock proofing.

John,

I will tell you how it works out after this summer. I just got a I pad this spring and plan to mount it in the boat on the console and run navionics on it, plus since the one I got has the cell service in it I can post reports live from the water on here. the water won't be a issue since I purchased the Life Proof waterproof case for it and the floating life jacket that goes over the waterproof case. Ram sells mounts specifically for I pads to be placed in vechiles. these same mounts should work in the boat too. the nice thing about the Life Proof cases is that they are suppose to be shock proof too. they were tested by the manufacturer by dropping a i pad in the case from a 6 foot hieght. the i pad did not have any damage after the test. The sales person told me that people buy the Life Proof cases and life jackets for them and then they put their Ipad in the pool with them and listen to music on it while in the pool. I asked a Humminbird rep if they or lowrance would ever get to the wireless point and start using things like bluetooth. he told me they or lowrance are not currently doing any thing in this area but he did say there was a aftermarket company out there working on a app and transducer to work with ipads. My guess is that future fish finders will eventually be wireless. It's like any technology it is always changing.

[Wish-I-Were-Fishn]

Brad, you're going to want a sunshade on that iPad. The screen is impossible to see in the sun. Also a non-reflective screen protector, which you may already have on your Lifeproof case.