traveler Posted February 20, 2010 Share Posted February 20, 2010 So we close on the new cabin next week:) Good times to come... And...we need a good dock. Heres the setup; we'll want to dock 2 boats most of the time, a 20 glass and a 16 lund. And still have room to fish off the dock. So, size and shape are considerations. We're on a channel off a smaller river, so no big waves, and from what I hear only minor fluctuations in water level. Level area for removal/winter storage. We did some looking at the baot show...2 main considerations: 1.roll in or modular? Pros or cons? 2.And decking material; cedar, aluminum, plastic(vinyl?) Our first thoughts are...nothing really on the first. As for decking, we like the look and feel of cedar, and understand it won't last forever. Aluminum makes good sense, vinyl seemed rough on the feet and didn't like the look much, but I'd say we're still open to anything. Price isn't the first consideration, but of course if all other things were equal we'd love to spend less. Any opinions welcome...! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Wiggum Posted February 20, 2010 Share Posted February 20, 2010 We've got 2 roll-in aluminums. One straight one that houses a pontoon lift on one side and 2 jet ski lifts on the other side. The other dock is L-shaped with a lift for a 17' tin boat. That one allows room for fishing off the dock.Overall, I like the convenience of the roll-ins. Our lot isn't ideal (we've got to get over a fairly steep bank), but they still go in and out fairly easily with a few guys. I think it took 5 of us just under an hour to get both docks and the tow bigger lifts into the water last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wbliceman Posted February 20, 2010 Share Posted February 20, 2010 i would go roll in if your shore line allows. It makes it easier to take out if you need to. I would say aluminum deck because it is light and durable both plastic and cedar can be very heavy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassmann77 Posted February 20, 2010 Share Posted February 20, 2010 We have a roll-in with cedar planks. We had a modular and the roll-in is just a lot easier to move in and take out. I would strongly recommend the roll-in. Ours is the straight dock which holds my Dad's 20' deck boat and my 18' Dominator, but fishing off the dock isn't that great.The cedar is really nice looking and I think a lot quieter than aluminum, but our dock is about 5 years old and the cedar is looking bad. My brother's in-laws have an aluminum dock at their cabin and it is starting to peel paint and gets a little slippery when there is dew in the morning.Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solbes Posted February 20, 2010 Share Posted February 20, 2010 Ours is modular, and I have to say I really dread the fall time at removal. Spring installation isn't so bad because I actually get to use it for 6 months.I see some of my neighbors with more manageable shorelines roll in their docks. Takes them 10 minutes. I quietly swear under my breath when I see how easy it is. Get a roll in if it can be done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coombia21 Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I would get a lift out dock 20 to put it in and 20 minutes to take it out after your first year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traveler Posted February 22, 2010 Author Share Posted February 22, 2010 Lift out dock? I don't think I know what you mean there...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fivebucks Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 We've got a aluminum rollout "L" with plastic decking that are about 1'x4' and kind of lock together. They are not slippery and work well for our area cause if big waves come in the can pop off without having the storm trash the dock. It takes 15 more minutes spring and fall to put them on but no big deal. We have a boatlift for my 1800 Lund and have no problem fishing off the end of the dock. It is very easy to hook up the ATV to put the dock in or pull it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom7227 Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 How old are you and do you have any help you can count on? Putting in/taking out a standard dock can be a lot of work and it isn't much fun. We have an association and everyone is getting too old to do that work in the cold, but they're also too cheap to go with rollouts.I priced rollouts for our group two years ago and saw a signficiant difference in quality. I don't think the prices were that much different but some really were built well and others not so much. I suggest that you shop around and litterally go and look at the various makes and learn from salesmen as you go along. Wood/Alum/Plastic all have +&- and you're going to have to decide which features you prefer and how much you're willing to spend.My search led me to V-Dock in Forest Lake for the quality and features of their product and to a fiberglass decking for ease of maintenance and durability. But you can listen to the Ford vs Chev debate forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walleye Guy Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 The aluminum Hewitt dock I own has a aluminum planking for decking. It is not loud and frankly I would say it is much quiter than my two neighbors who have cedar decking. It is also comparable from a noise perspective to a composite/plastic dock another neighbor has. Mine is about 10 year old and not one speck of the white coloring has come off of it. The surface is very durable and non-stick.I love cedar but cannot understand why anybody would want it on a dock other than to save some money in the short term. Just the fact that there is maintenance would make me look elsewhere. Lord knows there is already enough maintenance to do at a cabin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Wiggum Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 The aluminum Hewitt dock I own has a aluminum planking for decking. It is not loud and frankly I would say it is much quiter than my two neighbors who have cedar decking. It is also comparable from a noise perspective to a composite/plastic dock another neighbor has. Mine is about 10 year old and not one speck of the white coloring has come off of it. The surface is very durable and non-stick.We have two Hewitt's and I agree (although one is a bit noisy, but it's quite a bit older, as well). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Water Dog Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Seems funny that nobody mentioned appearance, stability, reconfiguring, or ease of adding on more dock as your needs change.IMHO, roll-ins look awful, and I care about appearance. If I had to put it in every weekend, a roll-in would make sense, but only touching the dock twice a year makes a roll-in less convenient. And my sectional dock stacks up in a nice neat pile on shore for the winter.I have added to my dock several times. A good sectional makes this easy. I now have 32 sections. (210 feet out with dock around 3 boat lifts, and a platform.) I love it. It's stable, and good looking.Check the decking warranty, and the comfort in bare feet. There's a BIG difference between materials. I could go on and on. I'm in the business, so I can't say where to buy it, but SHOP CAREFULLY! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traveler Posted February 23, 2010 Author Share Posted February 23, 2010 Thanks for all the opinions guys. Waterdog...being in the biz, a couple question? In looking at the boat show, I saw sectionals weighing 40 lbs per section and some weighing 75 for the same size. Am I safe to assume heavier is better? Obviously, they're both pretty light and easy to handle. I did like the "look" of sectionals better. How about adjusting them for changing water levels? Seems that would be easier with a roll in? Is the plastic decking worth the extra? After doing some more thinking (and listening) I'm leaning away from cedar...what do you think about powder coated aluminum? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Water Dog Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 Traveler... The lighter frames are probably weak. 3-sided "C" channel can flex. "Tube" or 4-sided frame members are stronger. If they have diagonal bracing from the leg to the frame...ask yourself "why"? The frame and pipe brackets should be strong enough that this isn't needed. Aluminum legs are tempting, but galvanized steel legs are stiffer, and not as soft. Square legs can bind if they are overtightened one time. A good dock will use set-screws instead of bolts on the legs. Some dock have no posts sticking up above the deck. I like the posts, but some people don't. I use them to tie up to and they give me a subconscious "border" so I don't get vertigo. :-)Frequent adjustment on sectionals is a pain. My lake level will change 12" or more throughout the season, but I don't change my dock height. If the water level changes a lot more than that, and you need a lot of dock, a roll-in is the only answer.Be aware of the plastic choices. A good VINYL will have a lifetime warranty. One popular decking is cheap, and has a 7 year warranty. We ordered some to experiment with, and it arrived cracked, right from the manufacturer. Choose something that is not too "flow-through" for comfort in bare feet and for sitting on. if you have dogs, consider their claws, and if they can get caught in the grating. Look at the fit of the decking panels in all cases. Some are really sloppy and poorly constructed. If you go with cedar, clean it with a deck wash every couple years. You can put a sealer on the board ends, but don't seal the tops. It'll be slippery, and may trap moisture INSIDE the boards, causing early rot. Powder coated aluminum decking is better than it used to be, so the big thing here is the fit of the panels. Ipe (ironwood) is another decking option, but the slivers and splits are like needles and razors.Good luck, and study hard. There's a lot I haven't covered. A good dock is a good investment. A cruddy dock is a pain in the wallet. (and more.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traveler Posted February 23, 2010 Author Share Posted February 23, 2010 Thanks a lot Waterdog, some things to remember. We close on the property next week, so obviously i haven't even spent time on the water there. The dock will be on an access channel off a smallish river...not sure how much water level variation there will be. They have an old dock there the owner says he was planning on replacing this year; possibly it's decent enuf we can live with it one season (but i doubt it:) Then we'd have answers as to water fluctuation. As is, I think we can learn a lot by checking out water level "stains" on other docks and shoreline structure along the river, and talking to other owners. One things sure, there won't be any high wind/waves or big boat wakes to deal with, which i see as a big plus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coombia21 Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 A lift out dock is a steel dock that has all the poles as a roll-in and same frame but on the back of the dock(shore side) there is a concrete block about 4ft x 4ft and there is a couple of hinges mounted on the lake side of the block that attach to the dock and when the time comes to lift out the dock you take the dock boards off and winch up the dock and you are set, or type in lift out dock on a search engine g@@gle and go to the second page down it is a site abbreviated as WCD and you can look around on their HSOforum and they will help you build one or let you know more about them If you ever go up to lake vermillion in the winter you will see what i am talking about, most of the docks up here are lift out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningBG Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 Wow. Never seen those lift out docks before now. Pretty slick.My parents have an almost all wood sectional dock. 4x10ft sections. Each section weighs about 250lbs and its a beast to get in and out. They end up hiring some guy that hires the a bunch of guys from the high school football team to take them in and out.My wife's parents have an aluminum framed dock with 4x4 wood panels that lift out before the frame gets pulled. It's a ton easier.If your getting a cabin to relax, make sure you get something that is easy to take in and out. Time is precious these days. And it really sucks wading into that 45 degree water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricD Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 This is a great discussion and I don't mean to highjack the thread but I wonder how long a dock needs to be to support a boat and lift. We were thinking of putting out a new dock with an 8ft square on the end for fishing but we also have a 17ft lund and a lift. How long does it need to be, I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningBG Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 This is a great discussion and I don't mean to highjack the thread but I wonder how long a dock needs to be to support a boat and lift. We were thinking of putting out a new dock with an 8ft square on the end for fishing but we also have a 17ft lund and a lift. How long does it need to be, I wonder? All depends on how deep the water is. We have to put our lift out about 40 ft just to get into deep enough water (3.5-4 ft). If it was a straight drop off from shore (a wall), could butt it right up to the wall (giving some space for the bow). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoxMN Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 We have a steel Hewitt 32' roll in. It is very old, but still works fine. I will get a new one some time and it will be alum and it will be roll in We have a hill to contend with so different than your Traveler. But I hook a 12v winch to a pole I have sunk at top of hill, and just hook up strap to pull it out, and gravity puts it back in. We currently don't have a platform at the end, and I want one. We are about 6-7 feet deep at the end, and our water level barely fluctuates more than about 3 inches - small d.a.m at end of lake, and good inflow at other end. This came with I think some sort of fiberglass covered plywood, and it rotted out (it was probably 20+ years old when we got it 10 years ago), so I replaced it with treated plywood covered with that green outdoor carpet (higher quality that carp stuff, but still looks kinda ugly). I just did it quick and cheap. Key thing I like about having big pieces with no gaps, is no stubbed toes, lures-keys-lipbalm-phones-hooks-bait-etc dropped through those big cracks. I personally like that feature. Some friends have the V-Dock, and I gotta say it is pretty darn nice, but very expensive IMO. Our 32' dock is perfect for a 20-24' pontoon on the side, or any size lift (out toon is 20'). I want to put a platform at end giving a 8x8 or 8x10 end, but havent decided if I want to add a platform or do a whole new dock. Even with a 8x8 platform, there would be enough room in front of it for a 16' boat to be tied up, but not a lift there. I have a little lift for a 16' boat of ot the side of my pontoon, right up near shore, but tie it up to the other side of the dock when being used. Make sure to get some support posts in between on roll in docks, and do your self a favor and put wheels on the front right from the start if you go that way or at least get temp wheels. If you are level enough, 32' + would be simple to keep in one piece. Regarding looks when it is on shore and covered with snow and nobody is around but ice fishermen, hehe, that doesn't matter to me Also, being in that age where grown kids aren't always around to help, definitely keep that in mind. Me and a couple friends (3 people) take out three roll-in docks and three pontoons in literally about an hour or so, and most of that time is driving the truck to next area. I put mine in with myself and my wife (holding the winch button!). Good luck! do search around and see which works best for you. Sorry for the looooong post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solbes Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 32 feet gets our boat plenty deep enough. I have a boat lift centered on the right side of the last section. I also have a trio of large floats tied to the left side for when guests want to tie up to our dock (or for my boat after lift is pulled in the fall). Plenty of room for up to 20' boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traveler Posted February 24, 2010 Author Share Posted February 24, 2010 What do you mean by "floats" Solbe? Dock bumpers or something else? I have a number of the blue plastic barrels I was thinking of doing something with...raft, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solbes Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 Yup, dock bumpers is what I was trying to think of. If you have blue plastic barrels that are heavy duty and leak free, you can make a swim platform pretty easy. Just be sure to put some reflectors on them for legality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom7227 Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 The cost of a new wood sectional dock can crawul up pretty fast. I think I spent $100 last year to get the 1 1/4 inch steel pipe and the hangers and feet for a section. You can get cheaper sheet steel hardware but I went with the cast iron cause the others seemed flimsy to me and I suspect they'd fail in a fairly short time.I'm getting old but I also don't think you can overstate the amount of work it is to put these things in and out. Pulling or pushing them in or out the bottom takes a lot of effort. My association has 2 docks that are about 150 feet long and the 8 guys that do this work are pretty well tuckered out by the end of the day. Strained shoulders and backs can take time off work or bucks for the chiro. This is a great thread and some really good info is coming out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoxMN Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 Tom good point about the effort. For flat land, if you have it, a truck or ATV works great if the dock is long or heavy. My bros in-laws (also on Bald Eagle) have the V-dock and push it in in spring, and use ATV to pull it out in fall. Also, if you (Traveler or anybody) get a lift, get wheels on it right away, get at least the two in the middle and if it has ability to have 4 wheels, go for it I have old steel stuff, wish I had alum lift, but I got mine for $25 haha! so can deal with it for awhile. If I do get new lift, it will have 4 wheels (the Otter brand wheels are great) on it, but I have hill to deal with, and a light boat that goes on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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