9mm HANDGUNS

[Dave S]

Svinekotelett OP in this thread

Are 9mm handguns really legal for deer hunting now? Is there a clip restriction? where can i find this in the regs? Dont want to sound like a skeptic or start a arguement, just find this really hard to beleave.

[Svinekotelett]

I spoke with three different DNR agents whom all said they were absolutally ILLEGAL, (shell casing length requirements.)They all said there is many misinformed hunters in the state who will be getting tickets.

[Eric Wettschreck]

By the way my question was where can i find definitive proof of this?

97B.031 USE AND POSSESSION OF FIREARMS.

Subdivision 1.Firearms and ammunition that may be used to take big game.A person may take big game with a firearm only if:

(1) the rifle, shotgun, and handgun used is a caliber of at least .22 inches and with centerfire ignition;

(2) the firearm is loaded only with single projectile ammunition;

(3) a projectile used is a caliber of at least .22 inches and has a soft point or is an expanding bullet type;

(4) the muzzleloader used is incapable of being loaded at the breech;

(5) the smooth-bore muzzleloader used is a caliber of at least .45 inches; and

(6) the rifled muzzleloader used is a caliber of at least .40 inches.

Subd. 2.Handguns for small game.A person may take small game with a handgun of any caliber in a manner prescribed by the commissioner.

You stated in your original post that you didn't want to start an arguement but refuse to no argue. I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish from here on out.

[Dave S]

Sure doesn't look to be a minimum case length in those reg's.

Thanks for posting them BG.

[knoppers]

that would be a ticket I could protest in any court.

what about the ammo, there are fmj and hollow points. I guess I would use the hollow points, they are supposed to be more lethal. still with a 9MM, shots would have to be within 20 yards.

[picksbigwagon]

knoppers, the regulations strictly say that soft point or expanding type bullets, FMJ are not considered legal for big game hunting

[knoppers]

thanks for that info, I did not know that.

so I would have to get hollow points for my 44 mag.

[picksbigwagon]

expanding type or soft point ammo for your 30-06 too, the regulations do not make seperation of rifle or handgun ammo, it is all defined as ammunition now.

[Big A]

Case length has nothing to do with handgun use for big game. So long as your shooting soft point or hollow point and a center fire cartridge that is .220 or larger.. your good to go.

And yes. 9mm is perfectly legal and used by many with success. Both in hunting and personal defense.

Put the bullet where it supposed to go.. and you will have success also.

[BobT]

thanks for that info, I did not know that.

so I would have to get hollow points for my 44 mag.

I'm not a bullet expert in any sense of the word but I've heard that a problem with hollow points is that they tend to fragment on impact. If true, I don't know if I'd want all those lead fragments scattered throughout the meat.

[Svinekotelett]

with that muzzle velocity the lead distrubution would be less then a slug.

[RumRiverRat]

Standerd 9mm handguns ARE NOT LEGAL HUNTING CARTRIDGES!!!! Nor Is the .45

Yes they are.

[sparkydm]

BobT

Yes, sometimes there are lead fragments left behind when the bullet strikes a major bone. California has banned lead projectiles to protect other critters that may feed on lead infested carcasses. The latest uproar was last year I think when lead fragments were found in food shelf ground venison. The trend is toward lead-free bullets such as the Barnes all copper X bullet. Other manufacturers are following suit. I tried these bullets in handloads for deer this season and two deer died as a result. I was unable to get opinions on their performance from the dead deer however.

[Fishpondc]

You might be able to kill a deer with a pellet gun or stern look, but it doesnt make it ethical... use common sense

[Big A]

Absolutely nothing wrong with using a 9mm to take a deer. Regardless of the size of the cartridge.. its about Shot placement. Thats the key factor in everything. Ethical hunting is shot placement... every true sportsman knows this. From Bow hunting, handgun hunting, and rifle hunting. The horror stories and the stories that make you are the ones that involved horrible shot placement..

You put a deer within 25 yrds of a competent sportsman yielding a 9mm handgun, and Id say you will have some venison on the table. Given the correct scenario. Im not talking launching rounds through some brush and hoping for the best. I am talking true and correct, clear shot.

A 9mm is a wicked effective round.. I have seen the damage a 9mm round can do to a person. It works. VERY well.

I have yet to see a deer taken with one. But all this talking about it certainly has me interested in grabbing up the Sig226 and giving it a shot.

Fishpondc - you watch the "men who stare at goats" movie? just made me laugh thinking of a guy dropping a deer with a good stern look

[Dave S]

A 9mm is a wicked effective round.. I have seen the damage a 9mm round can do to a person. It works. VERY well.

Not a valid comparison between shooting humans and deer with a 9MM. Many LEOs switched from using a 9MM to using a .40 or .41 or any other "more powerful" round for a reason.

[sparkydm]

Not a valid comparison between shooting humans and deer with a 9MM. Many LEOs switched from using a 9MM to using a .40 or .41 or any other "more powerful" round for a reason.

[Big A]

There are many who still carry a 9mm.. and live by it every day. The switch to .40 made sense to some. And not to others. Bullet size and power is all in relation to the shooter.

Im not looking to argue about a 9mm being an effective round. Human vs deer.. matters not. That round works. And will get the job done. For sure.

I am looking forward to shooting a deer with one so the thoughts there can be validated 1st hand. Figure with the car/deer scenarios out there. Shouldnt take long for that opportunity to arise.

a lot of power is generated from the velocity of a round.

hence the reason many more who work the streets are switching over to the FNH 5.7x28mm

THAT IS A WICKED ROUND !!

Gonna be happy to shoot a deer with that also

[Dave S]

a lot of power is generated from the velocity of a round.

Velocity isn't the only thing that determines the effectiveness of a round. Bullet weight and design also play a major role.

Velocity alone will only yield pass through shots with danger to anything beyond the target with the wrong bullet choice.

[Big A]

Did I say velocity was the ONLY THING that determines effectiveness? nope. I did not..

But with the correct bullet choice..

its amazing.

and Hydrostatic Shock = good stuff (velocity)

you ever get the chance to see a wound channel from a hot 9mm round?

how about a 5.7x28mm round?

.40?

.357?

How about the differences from a +p round vs reg?

Soft point vs Hollow point?

if so id love to hear it.. cuz I could discuss that all day. I live it and breathe it. It involves every aspect of what I do and how I do it. I like to stay as educated as possible and will take any chance available to learn more.

the higher the velocity.. the more destruction. as you said.. with the CORRECT bullet choice. The soft point 5.7x28mm bullet is incredible.. as are many other soft point options for a higher velocity choice..

notice i did not mention a .45

that round is to slow to mention when talking about velocity.

Size yes. Then we would start talking larger caliber bullets.

This thread was about 9mm bullets. Those rounds can zip. and with the velocity and correct bullet choice. WATCH OUT

[picksbigwagon]

Big A, is the 5.7x28 a centerfire cartridge?

I lauged when you said the 45 is too slow to mention when talking about velocity, you are correct sir. I have toyed around the idea of max loading some 45's for my 1911 and using it next weekend in Iowa, I think I will stick with my 357 for the side arm, it shoots the Hornady leverrevolution ammo extremely well.

I thought I saw somewhere that the 1911 in 45acp was created to to shoot the horse out from underneath cavalry soldiers in WWI, but I am getting old and my memory is not as good as it used to be. (according to my that is)

[Big A]

Yep. the 5.7x28mm is center fire.

Its also a blast to shoot if you ever get the chance.

[picksbigwagon]

A blast to shoot? that means a new addition to the gun safe doesn't it...........I will have to look into it, but will probably hold off for a couple months (haha)

[BobT]

BobT

Yes, sometimes there are lead fragments left behind when the bullet strikes a major bone. California has banned lead projectiles to protect other critters that may feed on lead infested carcasses. The latest uproar was last year I think when lead fragments were found in food shelf ground venison. The trend is toward lead-free bullets such as the Barnes all copper X bullet. Other manufacturers are following suit. I tried these bullets in handloads for deer this season and two deer died as a result. I was unable to get opinions on their performance from the dead deer however.

I wasn't relating my question to last year's fiasco. I just heard that hollow points have a tendency to shatter on impact compared the a solid bullet. Is there any truth to that or is my information wrong? I'm curious because I do have some hollow points for my .44 and have hesitated to use them for this reason.

[Big A]

and not a cheap choice either.. lol

thats $960+ dollar handgun. And the rifles are almost double that..

But its awesome. VERY VERY low recoil. handgun will shoot flat for 200yrds. So the rifle.. wow.. lol that thing seems like it would shoot forever.