rage broadheads

[koonie]

It may not be ethical for you but that doesn't mean it isn't ethical for someone else. It's not up to you to decide what's ethical for someone else. I like pass through shots as much as anyone but it isn't the determining factor when it comes to an ethical shot.

Another sight has this same conversation going on right now and you'd be surprised at how many experienced archers would take this shot. Right or wrong, that's for you to determine for yourself but not for someone else.

You talk about picking a specific spot. Why would this shot be any different. You pick a specific spot and shoot. In all actuality it is a very lethal shot if you are good enough to aim and hit the right spot.

I wouldn't shoot this shot but I'm not going to pretend I'm as good a shot as some of the other archers here.

It all depends on your ability. A 25 yard broadside shot may not be ethical for some people but for others it's a chip shot.

[Fishfanatic]

When reading the previous posts about the Rage Broadheads, I started thinking about my experience with them and wanted to share my opinion.

DO they work? Yes, But so does every other broadhead I've used.

It comes down to Shot placement on the animal.

Last Fall, I shot a doe with a 3 blade Rage. The shot was slightly more than quartering away, at the release, the doe moved slightly. I hit the doe in the rear quarter and passed completely through the animal and came out the front far shoulder. I estimate my arrow went through 34" to 38" of Hide, flesh and some bone (shoulder). Due to the angle, the hole was

almost 4" across upon entry. The exit hole was about 2-1/2".

Looking back, I have seen many other bow kills with different braodheads with very similar wound channels.

Rade Broadheads do work. SO do Muzzy's, Tekans and on and on.

It comes down to comfort level and your confidence in your own abilities. Are Rage Broadheads any better? Not necessarily.

Fish

[Bear55]

Vister did what he had to do.... It's ALL about confidence and he got the job done!

Very nice shot on a very nice deer! Congrats!

As for Rage's..... Watching the video someone posted on this or another thread promoting Rage's, I noticed that aside from the bad shot deer(through the guts) and the antelope next to the water, not one was a clean pass-through. Sure all deer were recovered, with amazing entry holes and bleeding like a seive, but don't we want to use a head that consistently shoots through the animal?

I'm asking this because I'm a newer bowhunter and have yet to shoot a deer with an arrow. I always assumed you were looking for a clean pass through, and with Rage's it seems you don't get that. Not sure I will make the jump until I nock a few deer down and gain some of the confidence I previously referred to.

Brule I have had nothing but complete pass throughs using the Rage 2-blade heads, I have taken 5-6 deer with them and every one was a pass through. Often it would break ribs on entry and exit, followed by a short tracking job. When shooting expandables you also have to take into consideration how much energy you are producing, I usually pull 60lbs and have had no problems, if you are pulling 40-50lbs or have a slower bow you might want to pass on using the Rage or use the smaller 1.5 inch Rage.

[BRULEDRIFTER]

Cool! Thanks!

I pull around 65lbs. I may dive into the Rage next season, but this year, I'm going to stick with my Slick Trix! I got 'em dialed in and I'm ready to go..... to late in the game to make that major of a change, IMO.

[vister]

a guy almost gets tired of being told what is right or wrong, ethical or unethical, big or small, etc. thanks to those who supported my post. for the record, the deer was shot in the neck. not the chest. so many things can go wrong on the perfect broadside "ethical" shot. deer can duck, or jump every shot. what does it matter what angle the deer gives you, either it works, ya miss, or the deer is wounded. every time you release an arrow, theres a 33% chance you will kill the animal.

I did take a lower percentage shot, but the angle i was given, i knew it was a good shot to take. i didn't need to follow up with a second shot. 70 yards later, the deer was dead, 1 hour after i took the shot it was recovered. sounds to me like an ethical shot.

if i told you i made a perfect shot, the animal went 70 yards and died, and we found it an hour after i let the arrow go, you'd assume i shot it in the heart. But no, i shot it in the neck, with the exact same results, and people think they can call me an unethical hunter, and cry about the fact that someone took a shot like i did.

I guess i'm just glad that i have never done anything just to make other people happy! if i was presented with that oppurtunity again, who knows, i'd probably take the shot.

results are in the freezer and on the wall!! if someone was talking about taking that shot, and they never recovered the animal, you would just tell them it was a risky shot and a lesson learned. but when it is a successful shot, i'm still told how its a "bad" shot to take, with no congrats given. thanks guys

the fact i was shooting rage had nothing to do with my decision making at 7:30 pm, opening night last fall!

[00rowe]

I doubt anyone has passed on a 180" deer, good shot or bad, archery or rifle, there just ain't many of them around.

Vister, do you have anything located that size for this year? I saw one cross the road by your Uncle Brad's last week, HUGE frame, I was heading west and he crossed just as I crested the hill, he was headed north. Should be able to start patterning them in a few weeks. Good luck, post some pics if you get any biggun's with the camera.

Mike

[vister]

mike, i just posted some pics. any look familiar? i have some pics on a different memory card of a very wide and heavy buck, but i cant find the card! many people have seen that buck on the card, as he has spent a lot of time near that apple tree in the ditch in the area you are talking about. that woods south of the highway, at the bottom of the hill you are talking about is where i bow hunt. on the southeast side of that hill

[Neighbor_guy]

I think I will stick with my Snuffers..... or mabe bring the Magnus 2's out of retirement. When you shoot a big scary blade, there are no worries about "opening" or not. Shot angle is not a problem either......

Mine are sharper than anything you will ever buy in the store anyways......

[00rowe]

Vister, might have been the one in the 1st pic you posted, at a quick glance looked tall, but I thought he may have been a little longer in the main beams, seemed like they were out farther on the nose, but it caught me off guard and it was only for a second. Nice pics, how high are your standards this year? I've had only one chance at a decent buck (archery), but if it ain't big enough for the wall my tag will go unfilled again, that's why I'm still upset over the no intensive harvest deal, I like shooting does.

Mike

[vister]

I haven't got the standards set too high. a few years ago I shot my first buck with a bow, and last year I shot my big one. I guess the only way I'll shoot a buck is if I'll put it on the wall. otherwise I'll tag a doe! I guess the first pic i posted is the one i'm gunning for. I wish I could have posted a pic of him zoomed in. He has tremendous brow tines, we're talking 10 inches or better! I think he'll go mid 140's if everything goes as planned. Just gotta hope he shows himself. If he does that, I'll try to take care of the rest. It kinda does suck being in a managed zone this year. I'd prefer to take a deer with my bow or ML, so maybe I'll be doing a lot of drive makin come rifle opener to leave my tags for that!

[96trigger]

I'm having a hard time switching. Mainly due to cost. But that has burned me before. 100's of dollars on trailcameras and treestands, but the one thing that actually kills the deer I am too cheap to buy. I might just have to buck up even though I already bought my broadheads for this year. After looking at my trail cam picks, I don't want to have to answer to what if this year. The broadheads I use are great, don't get me wrong, with perfect shot placement, any broadhead will work, but I really want to get the most out of my broadhead and many of you're testimonials are getting me close to buying in. Many peope that don't use them are the ones that are knocking them, most that do use them love them.

[B-man715]

......... so many things can go wrong on the perfect broadside "ethical" shot. deer can duck, or jump every shot. what does it matter what angle the deer gives you, either it works, ya miss, or the deer is wounded. every time you release an arrow, theres a 33% chance you will kill the animal...........

What? Are you saying you recover 1 out of 3 animals?

I think you need to start looking for closer and better placed shots.

[harvey lee]

Yes, any broadhead will work. The great thing that Rage head has is, in over 35 years of archery hunting, I have never seen a head leave a hole like the Rage does which in turn gives the hunter a better chance at recoverig the deer due to the huge blood trail the deer leaves.

In regards to recovering shot deer, I would guess that my percentage over the years of archery hunting is close to 90%. Yes, we all lose some.

[charliepete]

I'm with you Harvey...I'm probably 90% recovery all time, with most of the losses and misses early on. If a guy is only recovering 30% of the animals he shoots at something is very wrong, but I'd bet Vister just made a typo.

[crown_seven]

Not to get too involved with the numbers but if you take a shot at an animal you will either kill it or not kill it...wouldnt that be a 50/50 shot? I would bet that the overall average is much higher then that but if you talk strictly percentage its got to be a 50/50 chance of harvesting that animal. I Love how weird some of these topics get it makes this interesting!lol

[96trigger]

I understand where vister is coming from.

Every time you take a shot, you have a 33 1/3% chance of killing it, 33 1/3% chance of wounding it, and a 33 1/3% chance of missing completely.

[Flatlander]

But that only equals 99%. What happens 1% of the time?

[B-man715]

I understand where vister is coming from.

Every time you take a shot, you have a 33 1/3% chance of killing it, 33 1/3% chance of wounding it, and a 33 1/3% chance of missing completely.

If that were true, then you harvest one out three animals shot at, period. It's called math. If I drew back on a deer and felt I had a one out of three chance in harvesting it, I would let down and let the animal walk. I only shoot when I am positive I can make a quick clean kill. But guess what, even then there is a small chance of the animal jumping, hitting a twig etc. But nowhere near a 66% chance of something going wrong. If thats the case a person should find another hobby.

We as bow hunters should strive for a fatal shot. But some don't. I have met people that wound deer as often as I change underwear (once every couple weeks ) They look for a 1/2 hour, wipe the dirt off the broadhead and go hunting again the next day Unbelievable.....

[sparkyaber]

I have been reading this thread since the beginning, and have a question. Now bear with me, I have only been shooting a bow for a few months and have never taken a deer regardless of weapon, including cars. Everyone is talking about these broad heads like they are the best thing since sliced bread because of the huge entry holes/exit holes... Now I was looking for some fixed blade rocket broadheads (they don't make them anymore) and found trophy ridge made them. On TR's web site I came across these meat seekers, seem basically the same as the Rage to me, 1.5" on the 3 blade, 2" on the two blade. Are they similar to the rage? If so, why not the big hubaloo for these broadheads? Thanks.

[vister]

I think you are reading into what i said too deeply. I was letting off some steam about a few others telling me that my shot wasn't ethical because the deer died 70 yards later. only because it wasn't the perfect quartering away shot. Math is math. isn't what I said right about the thirds? Of my years hunting, I have only wounded one deer. every other deer I have shot at was killed. only 2 misses!! and I've shot 35-40 deer. remember, I'm 28!

So I have to believe that I have taken many of these so called "ethical" shots.

Doesn't a quick humane kill come to be as a result of an ethical shot! If you don't like my theory on thirds, then how about halves. either you kill the deer or you don't. end of story! 50/50

yes, my lone deer that I wounded was by a bow. read back through the pages and you'll find that story I told!

[B-man715]

Sorry, I guess I take my math to seriously. Three things can "happen" but that doesn't mean there is an equal chance of them happening (33%, 33%. 33%.) It is all up to the individual on what the odds are.

If you have killed 40 deer and only missed or crippled 3 total, you are at a 93% kill rate per arrow launched. That is a great number (much better than 33%)

Nice buck by the way! Someday I'll break 130

[vister]

the meatseekers are not similar to a rage. meatseekers have a piston style ferrule that as it pushes down on contact, the blades are forced against the broadhead kinda like a ramp that pushes them down and out. rage are rear-deploying on a cam, so as the shoulders make contact, they are deployed from the rear of the broadhead, which means they are opened before they enter the intended target.

over the top mechanicals rely on the blades opening like an umbrella, which increases the risk of deflection on angled shots, and a great loss of kinetic engergy upon impact.

fixed blades work great, however, their style makes them fly a bit differently, typically because the blades are like wings.

rage are compact, so they fly like a field point. upon contact, the blades deploy from the rear with no loss of kinetic energy, and are fully open at penetration. watch them on utube! or buy them, put one on an arrow, and just push it through a piece of paper. u'll be amazed

[sparkyaber]

Thanks for clearing that up for me vister. Again, not being an expert, wouldn't the mechanics behind the meatseekers guarantee the blades opening?

I am not planning on buying them, just trying to learn a little about all broadheads. I am thinking of getting the Rage, or a fixed blade made by Trophy taker, called the Terminal T-lock.

Thanks again.

[bottom-bouncer]

to clear this up a bit. I have used the rage and was terribly dissapointed. now I know everybody here pays real close attn to detail but how many have actually looked at there rage broadheads from past seasons before they were ever shot and noticed how dull they were. if you havent you should if you want you can even call the manufacture they are well aware of this problem, also they do require kinetic energy to open just as a fixed blade requires kinetic energy to penatrate. as do ALL broadheads. now I know that a lot of people have more experience than me but in my twenty five years of bow hunting I have shot many differnt broadheads both fixed blade and mechanical I quit counting how many deer ive killed along time ago so before you say some people cant handle change or new things if its on the market for the public to use chances are I have tried them. there are better heads on the market in my opinion one of the great mechanicals was the rocket steel head also the wasp jack hammer both very durrable I have never lost a deer using either one of these heads. but with out a doubt there is not a better head than a muzzy three blade there is no broadhead that has killed more deer period. and if you doubt this you havent been around this sport for very long

[charliepete]

Vister...how many deer have you killed by archery? I remember you saying that you had only killed one buck with a bow before you arrowed that hog. When you say you have shot 35-40 deer and only wounded one deer are you talking all archery? I'm guessing probably not.

I also went back and checked out the post you mentioned about wounding that doe. Here is what you had to say:

It was a tougher shot, I did aim at the white under the neck, just mis calculated the range. Now I now, I don't think I'll ever let em fly at a shot like that again. I guess you just have to learn the hard way.