Maybe a stupid question about spraying weeds

[gerty]

I just bought some amine 400 2,4-D weed killer. I have a broad leaf problem in my lawn. It says to use 1 tablespoon per 2 gallons of water if you have a broad cast sprayer or 8 tablespoons in 2 to 3 gallons in a spot sprayer.

My question is, can I put this stuff in an Ortho hose end sprayer and then set the dosage on 1/2 tablespoon (per gallon of water) and use this hose end sprayer or does it need to be in a big mixture of water and on a tank sprayer like on a lawn mower?

Thanks for the help.

[hotrod1]

I have never used a hose end sprayer but i don't see why it wouldn't work. I would set it at the dosage that you stated and give it a shot.

[paul pachowicz]

follow the label instructions

[LwnmwnMan2]

I just bought some amine 400 2,4-D weed killer. I have a broad leaf problem in my lawn. It says to use 1 tablespoon per 2 gallons of water if you have a broad cast sprayer or 8 tablespoons in 2 to 3 gallons in a spot sprayer.

My question is, can I put this stuff in an Ortho hose end sprayer and then set the dosage on 1/2 tablespoon (per gallon of water) and use this hose end sprayer or does it need to be in a big mixture of water and on a tank sprayer like on a lawn mower?

Thanks for the help.

You need to do it this way, to make sure you're getting the correct dosage.

Most likely, it should say how many ounces of chemical per 1000 sq ft.

Now, you need to fill your Ortho sprayer (with only water) and take it out to your driveway.

Mark out an area of 100 sq ft, or if you have the space, 1000 sq ft would be better, 100x10 or 50x20, something along those lines.

Now when you turn your sprayer on, time yourself, to see how long it takes you to evenly cover that 1000 sq ft. If you're only doing 100 sq ft, then multiply your time by 10, or if you're doing 200, multiply by 5, whatever to get to that 1000 sq ft number.

Now when you have your time figured out as to how long it takes you to cover that 1000 sq ft evenly through the end of your Ortho sprayer, get a 5 gallon bucket.

Reset the timer, and time yourself spraying into that 5 gallon bucket, and stop filling the bucket with your Ortho sprayer when you've run the same amount of time that it took you to cover the 1000 sq ft.

That's how much water you're spraying per 1000 sq ft.

So if it took you 1 minute to cover the 1000 sq ft, and then if you took you that 1 minute and filled 2 gallons into the bucket, then you're spraying at a rate of 2 gallons per minute, or 2 gallons per 1000 sq ft.

Now if you have a 50,000 sq ft yard, you're going to need 25 gallons of water, or 12.5 tablespoons of chemical.

100,000 sq ft, and you'll need 50 gallons of water, and 25 tablespoons.... etc.

DO NOT use my numbers. Calibrate the sprayer yourself and measure the amount of area you're spraying. You'll use the least amount of chemical (cost effective, healthy for the earth) and get the most out of your chemical.

The biggest problem you MAY find, is that the chemical may be a little "hot" if you just adjust the nozzle on the sprayer. You can never just trust a factory setting. Run this test first, then you know how much water you're really spraying.

You setting 1/2 / gallon on the sprayer and spraying slow, vs. someone with the same setting in a hurry obviously isn't going to get the same amount of coverage.

When you're using the Ortho chemical, you're using a chemical that's watered down for people so they don't burn their lawn. Now you've got the "good stuff" so you need to be more careful.

[gerty]

LwnmwnMan2 - Thanks for the insight. Sounds like it may just be easier to try and spot spray all the weeds. By the time I did everything above (not saying it is not good advice) I could probably be done spot spraying everything. I would say that my whole lawn is maybe 7500 to 10,000 square feet total. I may have to try it your way though. That way I would make sure that I didn't miss any weeds either.

Thanks again.

[Mlaker3]

It doesn't have to be rocket science. Both the herbicide and hose end sprayer are designed for home use which means about anything you do with it is ok. 10,000 sq ft = 1/4 ac. Put in a 1/4 pt. Fill about 1/2-3/4 full with water and spray away. When you are 1/2 done look to see how much spray is left. You can add a bit more chemical or go back across what you did if you are long. Wear rubber gloves and decent footwear, keep the kids off for 4 hours (a common re-entry interval for chemicals a lot harsher than lawn products). 30 minute job or less and you are putting the hose away. Repeat in a couple weeks if you have hard to kill weeds (which may take something better than 2,4d), but at least you will know what you are doing when you use the harsher stuff.

[LwnmwnMan2]

It doesn't have to be rocket science. Both the herbicide and hose end sprayer are designed for home use which means about anything you do with it is ok. 10,000 sq ft = 1/4 ac. Put in a 1/4 pt. Fill about 1/2-3/4 full with water and spray away. When you are 1/2 done look to see how much spray is left. You can add a bit more chemical or go back across what you did if you are long. Wear rubber gloves and decent footwear, keep the kids off for 4 hours (a common re-entry interval for chemicals a lot harsher than lawn products). 30 minute job or less and you are putting the hose away. Repeat in a couple weeks if you have hard to kill weeds (which may take something better than 2,4d), but at least you will know what you are doing when you use the harsher stuff.

This mentality is the reason that the EPA has the power that it does.

Without reading the label, a person has no idea what the active ingredient is in the formulation.

When I buy round-up, it's in a solution that's 41% active ingredient.

If a person buys it from Wal-Mart, it's about 8%. I can mix my chemical 1/5 the rate and still have the same active ingredient.

You cannot "just throw some stuff together" and feel good about it.

I do know when you go get the license to apply from the state, that the most important thing you are taught is conservation, not pollution.

Here is a link to the label for Amine 400.

Amine 400 label

Here is a label for Ortho Weed B Gon max.

http://www.hardwarestore.com/media/pdf-misc/464057.pdf

You'll see the active ingredient for the Amine 400 is 46.6%.

The label for Ortho Weed B Gon Max shows the active ingredient is 16.66%, almost 1/3 of the active ingredient.

If you were to run these at the same rate, not only are you using almost 3x's the chemical, but also much more money.

Yes, if you were buying product from one big box store to another, then sure, go ahead and throw them in as long as the active ingredient is approximately the same.

When you're going to switch to a professional product, you really really should adjust.

[Mlaker3]

LwnmwnMan2

You scare the [PoorWordUsage] out of me. You made something terribly simple into a chemical P.I.A. Don't even start with label reading with me. I know my way around a label, and a homeowners yard, and anything that can be purchased at any garden center by anyone walking the street. It's not rocket science, its simple and its designed and labeled to be safe and simple for the home user. Even when he screws it up. Pesticides that are hard use, that carrry user risk are for professional/licensed use.

"You need to do it this way" "This mentality....EPA..etc."

You still scare the [PoorWordUsage] out of me.

[fishinchicks]

We had classes at our local agronomy center regarding chemical safety, and the importance of reading labels (this was for the spouses of the farmers, not the actual pesticide training class). Professional use or homeowner use, you still need to take precautions. The mentality that some have regarding pesticide use is the reason why some groups are looking to ban them.

LwnmwnMan has consistantly given good advice about rates and proper use of chemicals. I look at this from the agriculture point of view, where all applicators have to be licensed, and all pesticides are used only according to label recommendations. If you want to step up to the professional strength of your chemicals, you need to follow the proper steps. It will save you money in the long run.

[Tom7227]

LwnmwnMan spends more time giving out sound advice than just about anyone on this entire HSOforum. I'd do what he says.

Gerty, if you think you can do it with a hand sprayer and spot treat the lawn that would seem to be the way to go. Too many people are dousing way to many chemicals around without knowing what they do. It's not just the money - it's what those chemicals do when they get out there. We don't need that stuff running off into the landscape!!!!!!

[harvey lee]

MLaker3

I hold a commercial applicators license to spray some chemicals due to the thinking of some who believe they can do as they please with some restricted use or for that matter any chemical.

One needs to follow the directions on the label to the T and that is what LwnmwmMan has suggested. Way too many people for way to long a period have handled chemiclas wrong and the state had to step in and control this before more damage was done to everything.

The label is there to follow in the best interest of all.

[Mlaker3]

So why are you all over my case? If you read the label you'd see it goes on at 1-4 pt/ac. I recommended 1/4 pt on a 1/4 acre, the low use rate, and adjust with use and you are still at way below your label. It's amine 400. Its 4 lb per gallon. And what has your roundup concentration got to do with it? You are all acting like a bunch of lawn NAZI'S. If we don't think your way you want to call the EPA police. I am afraid of anyone that comes up with "you need to do it this way".... or else the EPA will jump down on you. It's a 1/4 pt of amine on a lawn for God's sake. You all scare me. All he wanted to do was use a hose end sprayer.

And I work in the industry, I read labels all the time for all kinds of reasons, in all kinds of situations. I'm qualified to give the lesson to the guy that gave fishinchicks the lesson. Don't come down on attitudes unless you stop "You need to do this" That's what got ME going.

[gerty]

Sorry I caused such a stir!!! For all interested, I spot sprayed my lawn. Wanted to also fill in some dead spots with more seed and dirt so I figured that was the best way to do it and not worry about affecting the new seed. Next spring I will however, probably use the hose end sprayer.

[MuleShack]

We're all happy you got that off your chest now.

[fishinchicks]

So why are you all over my case? If you read the label you'd see it goes on at 1-4 pt/ac. I recommended 1/4 pt on a 1/4 acre, the low use rate, and adjust with use and you are still at way below your label. It's amine 400. Its 4 lb per gallon. And what has your roundup concentration got to do with it? You are all acting like a bunch of lawn NAZI'S. If we don't think your way you want to call the EPA police. I am afraid of anyone that comes up with "you need to do it this way".... or else the EPA will jump down on you. It's a 1/4 pt of amine on a lawn for God's sake. You all scare me. All he wanted to do was use a hose end sprayer.

And I work in the industry, I read labels all the time for all kinds of reasons, in all kinds of situations. I'm qualified to give the lesson to the guy that gave fishinchicks the lesson. Don't come down on attitudes unless you stop "You need to do this" That's what got ME going.

Actually, it is the attitude that you gave that reading the label is for wimps that raised a red flag. If you are in the industry, I would hope that you would instead be supporting the reading of labels/precautions for the average homeowner who hasn't taken any classes. Handling the concentrate is different than handling the watered down version that you get at the box stores.

There is a movement that is starting to gain a little strength in the legislature that supports banning the use of all pesticides - including 2,4D and Roundup. That is what scares me, and gets me going. Education on proper rates and uses of chemicals is very important so that the pesticides will still be available to those who need them.

There are plenty of people who read these forums that will use the advice gathered here, without asking any questions. For as many lawn care experts that are on this site, there will be different methods that they use. That is one of the draws of coming here every day.

[MuleShack]

Also the method that Lwnmwrman explained is the method that they teach in the certification classes for proper application rates to know how fast a device/person applies to know how to mix the solution.

Glad you got your lawn sprayed Gerty!