Favre heading for another MVP

[barebackjack]

Oh yeah, on a side note, I flepped back and forth between the vikes game (preying theyd not do that good) and the packers game (preying they would do gooder) and well Im not expecting to be throwing too much banter your way this year so from here on out Ill just fall back on the superbowl trump card if I have anything to add That is unless Im happily surprised

[buzzsaw]

Nice!

[SledNeck]

Atleast wisconsin always has the Brewers

[buzzsaw]

More news from ESPN: Sorry, I had to copy and paste.

Two Words For You:

PACKING. IN.

In a season of lows for the Packers, last night was truly the lowest point.

Forget 2005: The 48-3 drubbing on Monday Night Football -- by the sorry Ravens, no less -- was the lowest moment of the Brett Favre Era in Green Bay.

That's why the Favre Era in Green Bay is officially over.

No matter how the team decides to limp through the final two games of 2005. No matter what the Packers decide to do with understudy Aaron Rodgers. No matter whether or not Favre comes back next year. No matter if he IS the face of the franchise.

(Or at least, WAS.)

The new face of the franchise is futility, and even the most ardent Favre fans can't argue their guy hasn't been tainted by this season.

But should Favre pack it in? Not yet.

He's the NFL's Roger Clemens: On a contender, he could be an MVP candidate again. Can you imagine him on the Bears?

That's the problem: No one can imagine him in any jersey but Green Bay's. (I'm guessing he can't, either.)

But even Joe Montana went out in a Chiefs uniform, and no one holds that against him. It's selfish of any fan to demand fealty to a jersey.

Here's what a 45-point loss to the Ravens on "MNF" really confirms:

The Packers are a shell, destined to wallow among the NFL's dregs for the remainder of Favre's career, however long that lasts -- and whether Favre plays for them or not.

If Packers fans and Favre's many admirers really cared about him, they'd encourage him to finish his career elsewhere.

[genegodawa]

Awright Buzz, KC maybe, but not with DaBears please.

[barebackjack]

Maybe he could come to MN, have Johnson as his back up

[buzzsaw]

Theres my guy Bareback! Where you been, I figured you'd be bashing your boys alot harder than you've been. Will the pack go after Leinart next year or are they really going to try that Aaron Rodgers project for a few years?

[sunnyj]

Quote:

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Maybe he could come to MN, have Johnson as his back up

---

Who would hate that more. GB fans or Vikes fans?

[buzzsaw]

GREEN BAY, Wis. -- Frustrated. Disappointed. Embarrassed.

Profile

2005 SEASON STATISTICS

Att Comp Yds TD Int Rat

519 321 3165 19 24 73.1

And benched, if even for just a quarter.

Brett Favre will start his 240th consecutive game including the playoffs Sunday against the Chicago Bears, but his 239th was one to forget.

Favre left for what the Green Bay Packers hope is their future late in the third quarter of Monday night's 48-3 loss to the Baltimore Ravens when rookie first-round pick Aaron Rodgers entered during the worst beating the Packers have suffered since 1980.

"I would much rather have played and been in a situation to win the ball game," Favre said Wednesday in his first comments since the loss. "If we were way up or way behind, [coach Mike Sherman] said he might play Aaron and I said, 'That's fine.' Up to the point that Aaron came in, we had gotten three points."

Favre's performance -- 14-of-29 for 144 yards and two interceptions -- again is fueling speculation that this year, his first losing season as a starter, might be his last.

"I've tried my best not to analyze not only this season, but a game like that the other night," Favre said. "I don't know if we can say the rest of the games this year have been embarrassing, but I think the other night was."

The three-time MVP took until March to decide he wanted to return for his 15th season and 14th with the Packers. Sherman said he would talk to Favre about his future as soon as the season ends.

Favre says his return is a matter of commitment.

"If I do come back will I be committed?" Favre said. "I think it's more than anything, 'Do I want to play?' There's no guarantees next year will be better or worse."

Favre said he felt better than ever before the season and came into training camp after an offseason conditioning program looking slimmer, stronger and poised to lead Green Bay to a fourth consecutive NFC North title.

But top wide receiver Javon Walker tore a knee ligament in the first game, four-time Pro Bowl running back Ahman Green shredded a tendon in his thigh and backup running back Najeh Davenport broke his ankle -- all by Oct. 23.

By that point, the Packers were 1-5, and Favre has grown increasingly frustrated. Cameras caught him again yelling at teammates Monday night.

“ If I do come back will I be committed? I think it's more than anything, 'Do I want to play?' There's no guarantees next year will be better or worse. ”

— Brett Favre

"As an experienced player playing quarterback for 15 years, I would like to think I could get everyone lined up correctly, could make all the right decisions, could make the perfect throws," Favre said. "That's not the case, and if I didn't care, then you wouldn't see the frustration on my face."

Sherman says there is no problem with Favre's actions on the field.

"He probably yells at guys less than any quarterback in this league," the coach said. "He's not a confrontational guy, that's his nature. Certainly there's frustration when you're dealing with the youth that we're dealing with and inexperience at times. I can't blame him for that."

But Favre's problems keep piling up.

Without Walker and with a running game that has lost four starters to season ending injuries, no one has been able to bail out Favre when he throws deep and into coverage.

So Favre has thrown for 19 touchdowns and tied a career-high with 24 interceptions with two games left.

In 1993, Favre had 19 touchdown passes and 24 interceptions, but the Packers finished 9-7 in a streak of 13 consecutive nonlosing seasons. This year, the Packers couldn't keep that streak alive through November.

"It bothers me that the retirement talk is a constant theme," Sherman said. "I told him, 'You should be offended when people talk retirement because physically you're certainly not there.' And I believe that."

Sherman says the speculation about Favre or if he will keep his own job at the end of the season hasn't caused the Packers to lose focus. Regardless, Favre says he doesn't know how to approach continual losing -- something he's never dealt with.

"No one has given me any guidelines to how you handle a 3-11 season," Favre said. "I think as a quarterback, just like a head coach, you can only do so much, but you feel like you should be able to do more than everyone else. And it's bad enough as it is right now."

[Down to Earth]

Buzzsaw,

I'm pretty much at the point now that I feel Favre needs to retire after this season. As a Packer fan living in Minnesota I don't get to watch all the games, but a good number of them and from what I've seen this year of Favre it has not been good. At some point he has to realize that the talent around him is not there, and he needs to adjust his game and not continue on as he has been. Both of his interceptions Monday night, like many this year, were passes thrown into double or even triple coverage that had no chance of being caught and should never have been thrown in the first place. As much as I enjoyed watching him through out the years it I feel it is definately time for him to hang it up.

Though I can't really blame Sherman for all the bad that has happened, Favre's decision to come back may be made easier if Thompson decides to let Sherman go after the season is over.

[JIvers]

You know it's gone downhill for the Pack and their fans when a hard-core Viking fan like me starts feeling sorry for them. Heck, I'll be cheering Favre and the Packers on this weekend, which is a very strange situation for me. In a bizarre way, I'm actually going to miss Favre whenever he retires or leaves.

Piling on Favre and the Packers right now is too much like kicking someone when they are down, so I won't do it. Picking on Matt "Edsel" Millen and the Lions is a whole different matter. Having been so bad for so long, it is really kind of comical to see them continually screw up in every possible way.

[TNFL]

I hear ya. On Monday night, I was thinking to myself. This isn't even fun this year watching the Pack get destroyed. Much more enjoyable watching them lose in the playoffs at lambeau.

[barebackjack]

Quote:

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Theres my guy Bareback! Where you been, I figured you'd be bashing your boys alot harder than you've been. Will the pack go after Leinart next year or are they really going to try that Aaron Rodgers project for a few years?

---

Now why would I bash my boys??I said what I needed to say atthe beginning of the year and so far havent had to stray from it. If you ask me Rodgers is always going to be a back up but Im no sports guru either, I see no reason to put Favre on the back burner if hes still going to be around. On a side not I heard Mike Sherman will be replaced by Monica Lewinsky. She will no doubt

blow a few, but she certainly won't choke on the big ones!!!

[buzzsaw]

Quote:

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On a side not I heard Mike Sherman will be replaced by Monica Lewinsky. She will no doubt blow a few, but she certainly won't choke on the big ones!!!

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Ba dum dum dum! I always liked that one.

[Quickstrike]

I agree, as a Viking fan I will also miss Favre. He's a guy you love to hate and I don't think there are too many football fans, no matter what team you root for, that don't respect him.

[buzzsaw]

Good thing for the Bears that they got to play Favre and the Packers last week! I still can't believe the interception Favre tossed by his own goal line that was picked and returned for what ended up being the winning TD! Oh, and he tossed four more interceptions this week!! I really think he's done. I also believe that the Packers organization thinks the same way! He can still make some plays, but seems to be making far more mistakes. He's definitely NOT going out on top! His last playoff memory will always be a spanking at the hands of the Minnesota Vikings at Lambeau Field...

[otto_man]

buzzsaw

does Favre have a Super Bowl ring??

most players in the league (especially vikings) don't have a clue what one looks like on their finger or will ever know for that matter.

[Down to Earth]

True he does have the ring, and I think when he retires people will tend to look at Favre with a career perspective, which they should, but that doesn't take away from the present season in which we are in now. And the fact is Favre has stunk up the place and has cost the Packers games. Yes I know they have had their share of injuries and losses during the off season, but they should still be better than a three win team. Almost every announcer doing a Favre game this year has mentioned that even at Favre's age he still has all the physical tools he had a few years ago, and still can make all the plays. Unfortunately, much of the game is played above the shoulders and that is where Favre has failed this year. I've seen poor decision after poor decision. He has not been able to adjust his game to those around him this year and it has cost the Pack in multiple ways. I'm willing to bet that Thompson will make the choice easy for Favre and dump Sherman at the end of the year, which will in effect trigger Farvre to make the decision to retire.

[outdoor ran]

I think Favre has a year or 2 left in him if he had a coach who wasn't scared of him and would knock some sense in him. I rememeber Holgrem having to yell at him. I think its Favres mental game hes lost not his arm. I guess I would like to see Sherman leave and Favre try one more year.

[buzzsaw]

Quote:

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does Favre have a Super Bowl ring??

---

The answer is ahhh duhhhh let me think about that tough question... ah yes! So does our starting QB, whats your point? All I was saying is how bad Favres decision making process has been this year and actually last year as well (especially in the playoff game vs the Vikings) I just had to add that last point, as you did.

It seems as though DTE agrees, but you don't agree??? I know that Favre walks on water in Wisconsin so it's hard for some people to admit that he is NOT the QB he was years ago. He may still have alot of the physical skills or atleast thats what some announcers say, I don't really agree with that statement... Just admit it Otto, Maddens bridesmaid is not the same man he's always been. Will his last playoff game in a Packer uniform go down as a blowout loss to Minnesota? or will the Packers rebound to glory next year when they draft a real QB with that high draft pick???? Alot of tough questions, lets hear what ya got Otto.

[otto_man]

you're correct buzz, your QB does have a ring but let me think, did he get that bad boy playing for the vikings, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm nope. has any player got a super ring playing for the vikings, hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm nope.

i'll admit, favre has seen his better days but it sure was fun when he was on his game and when holmgren had him under control. if only sherman had the stones to wrap his hands around favre's throat and choke the stupid out of him maybe then just maybe he'd be fun to watch again!!

i'm ready for that high draft choice, i know there's a tony mandrich out there somewhere....

[buzzsaw]

Quote:

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i'm ready for that high draft choice, i know there's a tony mandrich out there somewhere

---

If there's another Mandarich/Demetrius Underwood out there, I'm sure the Vikes are as capable of making that horrible choice!

All joking aside, what do you think the Packers will draft for? I suppose it depends on exactly where they end up... but they need Defense and it looks like posibly a QB even though they took Rodgers last year. What about the RB position??

The Vikes have question marks as well, starting with coaching, offensive line... they do get Mr. Whizzenator (Onterrio Smith) back next year and I expect Bennett to be traded for a third rd pick possibly. I still think we need a better WR corp...

[bucketmouth64]

If Favre does go how good would he look in a Raiders uniform? Not that I like the Raiders, but their history shows they can squeeze out 1-2 years out of any player that others think is washed up. He does have 1-2 years left in him. If Gannon can have an mvp season and lead them to the superbowl, what do you think Favre could do? Probably win it. He could have lots of fun tossing to Moss and Porter. They need a qb of his caliber to get them to the playoffs/superbowl. He could be the talk of the NFL all season.

[bucketmouth64]

If Favre does go how good would he look in a Raiders uniform? Not that I like the Raiders, but their history shows they can squeeze out 1-2 years out of any player that others think is washed up. He does have 1-2 years left in him. If Gannon can have an mvp season and lead them to the superbowl, what do you think Favre could do? Probably win it. He could have lots of fun tossing to Moss and Porter. They need a qb of his caliber to get them to the playoffs/superbowl. He could be the talk of the NFL all season.

[Down to Earth]

Favre has already said he won't play elsewhere as well as if Sherman leaves he most likely won't come back either. This is the main reason I think Sherman won't be back. I thing Thompson would really like Favre to retire, but after all Favre has done for the orginization over the past 15 years its not like they're going to push him out the door. But I think if Sherman is pushed out, Favre will follow.

As far as the draft goes I'm expecting the Packers to be in the #3 spot. I read a recent article where the top 5 is still kind up in the air, but looking at schedules its probably where they will end up. If that is the case both Bush and Leinart will most likely be gone. Depending on what they think of Gado they could go RB. Deangelo Williams out of Memphis might be a good fit. They also need help on the O and D-Line. I did see one really early mock draft that had them picking AJ Hawk, LB out of Ohio State in the #5 spot. A lot of things for that will clear up once the college games are over and everyone declares. Then it will be fun to project.