Help With Heel Please

[broken line]

I've read several postings on this site, and it appears there is a lot of knowlege to be shared. Here is the issue. Riley, the 4 year old yellow lab, hunts hard, has great drive, sits, stays, comes when called and I would take another one just like her in a heartbeat. However, I just cannot get her to heel. I've tried choke collars, e-collar, gentle leads, etc, and she continues to pull. I hate to say it, but it is almost miserable to take her for a walk unless I am in a place that she can be off leash. It seems like she knows what the command is, because I say heel, and she will fall back, but then it seems excitement takes over and she is pulling again in no time. I would certainly appreciate some expert (or any) advice on how to remedy this.

[setterguy]

I can only tell you what worked for me, don't know if you've tried this or not. I would use a choke chain and give the command, then start to walk, then I would quickly change direction and give a little yank. Essentially what you are teaching the dog is that they had better stay close and keep an eye on you or else they are going to get "jerked". You said, "It seems like she knows the command". You have to be sure she knows what the command means before introducing the e-collar, The thing about the choke chain is they are basically doing it to themselves, and figure out real soon that the safe place to be when on heel, is right by your side. Having said all that, you must remember that I'm just a dumb pointing dog guy, heck our dogs can't even sit...maybe one of these retriever guys can offer better advice.

[SCUMFROG]

One bad thing about chokers is that if you don't put them on right they don't work. Only have them on the dog while training it, NOT ALL THE TIME. If the dog really pulls you even with the choker on and I know I'll get bashed for this but you'll need to use a pinch collar. Then you will get the dog to heel. I have an Akita and his neck is so strong a choker does not work, but a pinch collar gets his attention right away. Now when he even sees it he gets all excited cause he knows we are going for a walk.

[kentuck_ike]

I'd use a choke collar, When she starts to get ahead of you turn into her forcefully, in a sense try to cut her off with a turn before she gets out in front of you. If she gets in front before you can cut her off. Hold the leash with both hands by your hip and turn away from her quickly, be ready for a big jerk. after she gets somewhat under control, heel her in figure 8 patterns until you can see her watching you for the next move. It may take a while but she will catch on.

Ike

[gspman]

You could try a wire pinch collar if the choke/pop chain doesn't work. They have double prongs sticking inward all around. You do not pop the dog but let it pinch itself. Basically the harder the dog pulls the more it gets pinched. The dog pretty much corrects itself. They are available at most pet stores.

[jlm]

I had this same problem with my current dog and others as well. It seems some are naturals and learn this quick while others will drive us nuts! Anyway, here is my method. I do not like using e-collars to train to heel. I personally believe the critter needs to know how to heel before the e-collar should be applied. Once heel is down pat, the e-collar can be used for making the heel faster and more crisp. Go out and get a broom handle or even a long skinny stick (green so it will not break). Begin with a helper and let the dog run on leash with your helper. State the word heel to the critter and have your helper escort the dog to your side. Provide a treat for him. Do this LOTS of times over several days (even weeks for the hard headed ones). Soon he will associate the treat with heeling. Once he can heel at your side, now try walking with him/her. Gradually phase the treats out along the way. This is where your long stick comes in. If the dog goes ahead of you (which he will most likely do rather than behind you), tap him on the front legs or chest firmly, just enough to get his attention. (if you are right handed, you will have a leash in left hand and your stick in your right with the dog at your left) Be sure not to hit bone anywhere or you could cause injury. After you tap him in the chest, pull him back with the stick (with the stick on his chest). Repeat this over and over until he learns that he will be tapped if he leads you too far. Eventually with repetition, he will learn to heel on the move. Now keep the same routine but change directions. Eventually you will be able to get rid of the lead and have him walk freely. Introduce the e-collar at this time. This is my method. I am not an expert with dogs but have had some great success with this method. Good luck!

[marine_man]

I agree with jlm... what's worked best for me is a combination of the heeling stick and a pinch collar... my dog would pull through the choker chain no matter what.. but a pinch collar has really worked wonders. Until I got the pinch collar my wife wouldn't take the dog for a walk because he'd be taking her for a walk... with the pinch collar he pinches himself when he pulls to hard or too far and lays off pulling after the first 10 feet of the walk.

I'm not a big fan of rewarding the dog with a treat... but hey, whatever works, right?

marine_man

[Griff guy]

I also think the pinch collar is very effective. Choke collars can do more damage if misused. You can also loop the lead just ahead of the rear legs so when he pulls it tightens up on his middle. It is unbelievable how this stops them from pulling. Some dogs like to lean into the collar like they are helping you. My female is better at heel when she is off lead.

You can also try using a short grip with your left hand and spin the rest of your lead with your right hand in front of you. After he catches the end in his chin a few times he will stay right at your Knee. What's nice about this is he thinks he is doing it himself and your the nice guy to stay next to.

[broken line]

Thanks to all of you for the advice. I'll start trying these things today, and maybe we can walk nice by this summer !!.

[Lynno62]

pinch collar.

[LABS4ME]

One other thing broken line... Most people who train "heel" always do so while walking. Heel means stay by my side. Walking, crawling, sitting, laying...... What I see it is only used as walking command and the handler just adjusts his speed to those of the dog, when it should be the other way around. The dog should adjust his speed to yours. If he starts to get ahead of you command "heel" and make him come back to your side and sit for a good ten count. Then begin to walk and again command heel. If he increases his speed, back to the side and sit. Eventually he'll realize he's not going anywhere without obeying. As he begins to show signs of "heeling" adjust your speed often from slow to fast and throw in brief pauses as he begins to get ahead of you. Teach him heel when you are laying down and also crawling. They be gin to understand the command means to always be by your side. As stated before, changing directions often will get him to understand too that he has to keep an eye on you at all times in order to stay by your side. I really feel the e-collar is a great tool to enforce the heel command. The pinch collar works great too, but I'd just use them early on in training as they evolve into "knowing" when to heel and when not too, pre-determined if the pinch collar is on. You may need to use the heel command when hunting when the dog will not have a pinch collar on but a lot of times it will have it's e-collar. At 4 years old it's going to take a lot more committment and perserverance to get him to fully comply with "heel", but with work you should get him through it.

This "cements" what has been preached on here many, many times... get your basic obedience down soundly at an early age to negate problems in the future. Soundly trainiing them when young is less work than "breaking" them of bad habits when older.

[BLACKJACK]

I also vote for the pinch collar. It looks more wicked than a choke collar, but I think its actually less harmful to the dog and more effective. Don't let them get to the point where they are pulling against it, when they start to surge forward, surprise them and give it a quick snap.

Another thing that no one has mentioned is repetition, repetition, repetition. Do it every night for 10 minutes. I couldn't tell you how many figure 8's I did with my year old lab around the vehicles and yard trees. Now when I start walking toward the shed, shes right beside me, even without the leash.

[Tripleplay]

My GSP broke a choke collar and if I didn't know better I'd have swore that pup was flashing me the "old one finger salute" as she took off running down the street! It took me almost an hour to catch her that morning and we were a long ways from home. Bought a pinch collar that same afternoon and let her figure it out on walks and she is much improved. We did move onto the e-collar as well and she does that pretty well.

Best thing about the pinch collar is my kids (now 12) can walk the dog without getting dragged down the street.

[walros]

The dog apparently is forgetting who is the leader of the pack. Put a 15-20' rope on it, (collar of your choice though I would recommend a normal 1-1/2 nylon one cause chokers may catch and choke it) give the heel command and when it starts to stray, quickly go 180 degree's with rope over shoulder. When the rope tightens up give it a great big yank, the dog will roll over several times (no harm done) and contiue walking as if nothing happened. repeat as necessay but I bet it will only take two or three times for the dog to start looking back when it starts "wandering" and stay within range. Then adjust the length of rope until the dog stays at what range you feel comfortable with.