Need help with rifle suggestion!!!!!!!!!!

[esox49]

I am planning on going out west this fall mule deer hunting and in need of a new rifle. What does everyone recommend? I would like something powerfull enough for elk and moose also. One "do all" gun. Please recommend brand, model, caliber,and what brand and power scope to put on this! Thanks for all the help!!!!!!!!

[kc0myy]

Well where are you going? Are you going in the hard woods up north in Minnesota? If so, I would use a 30-30 Lever Action Winchester 94. The round nose will go and hit a branch and won't go haywire. but you said your going out west so I would get a .270 mag that my 2 cents

[irvingdog]

Ummmmmm.....there are not many mule deer in the north woods of minnesota . Clearly, the most versatile round, based on available variety of cartridges, is the 30.06. I personally prefer the .270 win (mighty close to the 30.06) but ammo doesn't come in as many "flavors" as the .06.

[bklimek]

That is the age old question!?! I was in the same boat as you about 2 years ago. I spoke to many hunters and done a lot of research. I decided on the 300 WSM, Tikka T3 Hunter, Nikon Monarch 3x9x40. That caliber of rifle will be sufficient to take down any game in North America. You will have a lot of guys mentioning many other calibers as well. The 30-06 is very popular. I know my Dad uses a .270 Remingtion pump and he took his first cow elk last October at apprx. 100 yards. When he hit her she dropped to her knees, got up, and piled up after making it another 30 yards. The key is to find the caliber you are most comfortable with. You would rather pack a lighter caliber and feel 100% confident that you can hit your target versus using a caliber that knocks the snot out of you when you shoot. If you don't like a lot of recoil the magnums are probably not for you. Tikka makes a suberb rifle for the money. Whatever you decide to go with don't go cheap on the scope. There are many good brands out there. Happy shopping!!!

[almostthere!]

Lime is correct. If you want a versatile round, the 300 is the way to go. Plenty of ammo to choose from and it will reach out and drop whatever N. American game you want. It is neither too much or too little gun.

If money is a concern, then you can not beat the Tikka T3's (under $599). Each individual rifle is factory tested to produce a 1" group before leaving for your local store. If you like a lighter rifle to carry around then you should get the 300 WSM. If you can not handle recoil, then get Browning A-Bolt with BOSS (around $700).

For optics, there are a number of excellent brands available around $450. You might want to consider Leupold V-X III, Zeis Conquest, or Nikon Monarch Gold in 3x9x40.

[Guest]

One choice could be a remington 7mm mag bdl with a leupold vx11 3x9.Good flat shooting rifle with decent downrange energy.Leupold scopes are very good with a lifetime warranty.I have never had a problem with any type deer,but have not shot a elk with it,but with correct bullet should not be a problem.I also shoot a ruger 300win mag with same scope as above and its a killing machine,with good longe range and energy.Only problem with this caliber is the kick which can be cured with a muzzle brake but the noise is now somewhat of a problem.As long as you pick a rifle that fits you with a scope of very good quality and pratice with the gun you should be good to go.I own many rifles and the one gun to me that is the best all around is my 7mm.I would say to make sure you dont buy a cheap scope as the bigger caliber guns can be hard on them. Buy the best scope you can afford.Also,if you dont mind the recoil, the 300 mag would be great for your trophy elk or moose.

[Pooh]

i personally would look at the 7mm. never seen a whitetail that needed to be blood trailed with that caliber. the 7mm is (if i remember right) a .284 caliber. bigger than a 270 smaller than a .06 the bullet packs alot of powder though, making it reall fast and flat shooting. both the 7mm Rem or the 7mm weatherby would be my choice for a new gun!

[barebackjack]

I own a Rem model 700 ADL 7MM mag and havent had the opportunity to use it on anything bigger than a whitetail and that was one time and th last time, got the gun last year and I wont use it again unless its going out west if I ever get that chance. My opinion is its too much gun for whitetail and too much gun for the woods Im hunting in. I would guess by the results I saw you would most likely be impressed using this caliber for that type of trip. I also am partial to a .270, IMO, best all around gun and like mentioned earlier plenty of different choices in ammo. I personally wont shoot anything other than a federal, 150 grain round nose soft point, good bullet for wide open or a littler thicker brush.

[ScoutII]

DON"T go with the 7mm magnum, the balistics are to fast will not penetrate a MOOSES hide. I know there were 5 bullets just sitting in the hide. Now a 30-06 is slower and will penetrate. That was the caliber that took the moose down. That is my experiance with moose and rifles.

[lawdog]

Quote:

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Well where are you going? Are you going in the hard woods up north in Minnesota? If so, I would use a 30-30 Lever Action Winchester 94. The round nose will go and hit a branch and won't go haywire.

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That's just wrong. NO BULLET can hit branches and not be deflected. This is an old myth and we need to kill this thought. You have no idea where a bullet will go after it hits a branch. Don't take that shot!!!

[Beeber]

Lawdog is right. You would be amazed how little it takes to change the trajectory of a bullet (any size bullet). Anything that will change the rotation of the round will affect the accuracy of the shot. Grass will even make a shot go astray by a lot more than you would think. Also the farther you are away from the target and the closer the obstruction is to the gun the greater the distortion will be.

That’s my 2 cents

[jlm]

Yes, this is an age old question and all opinions are correct. Good information and suggestions so far guys! I will approach this as though you are of average means like most of us financially. My opinion is to get the most bang for your buck. If you are looking for something with good trajectory and somethng that produces tremendous hydrostatic shock or knock down power, I have a couple of good suggestions. The first is Weatherby rifles. I would go with the .270 or .300 magnums. These are fantastic rounds which are very popular. Both are sufficient for elk and even larger critters if need be. Weatherby makes a cheaper make rifle which is very accurate and top of the line for that price range. I would highly suggest taking a look. Ammo for these guns tends to run a little expensive but it is high grade and hot. Well worth the price in my opinion. If you would like a round with more ammo options, you can get the Weatherby chambered in almost any popular round. Another option I would look at is Savage. They have come a long way over the years and the price is right. They now have a new trigger system on some rifles which is great. Anyway, I believe Savage and Lazzaroni (sp?) have teamed up to make a couple rifles which are smokin' hot. If you want to stay with your traditional brands like Rem, Win, Bro, etc, I would suggest .300 mag or .300 SM. Both are great rounds. I would stay away from the .270's unless they are magnum rounds (no offense guys, although great for deer, I feel this is a little light for long range shots at elk...I realize this can be argued however). Anyway, these are some of the suggestions I would take a look at that will not break the bank. As far as optics go, you can't go wrong with Nikon. They to make a cheaper line of scopes (Buckmaster and some others) that are pretty good for the price tag. Good luck and let us know what you go with!

[cyberamish]

I was faced with the same question, I wanted a gun I could use in MN for whitetails and would also work for elk or moose out of state. I went with a Browning A-Bolt II in .270 WSM. The ballistics are nearly identical to a Weatherby (in some cases they surpass Weatherby with handloads), the gun is considerably lighter thanks to the short WSM action, and the ammo won't cost you $50.00 a box. If you reload, or know someone who does, you can load everything from 90 gr up to a 180 gr Barnes. Mine loves the 140 gr Nosler Accubonds. I put a Nikon Monarch scope on mine and love it for the clarity and light trasmission. All told I spent under $1000 for "my" perfect rifle.

[FOOT]

There are several calibers to choose from.

My suggestion would be to go to a good outdoor retailer like Aschmann's and ask them to test fire a couple of used guns on their range. Be truth full and tell them you're looking to purchase a weapon for Mulies, Elk and Moose.

I would look at the 270, 30-06, 7mm and 300 mag. Personnally I would shy away from the 300 mag. I don't believe you'd need that much fire power.

BUT the bottom line is get a weapon you are comfortable with.

I've taken deer and elk with a 270, 30-06 and 7mm and have found none of the three calibers lacking in anyway. Know where you weapon puts the bullet and get comfortable with it.

[lawdog]

I think you have lots of good choices, but I will add my name to the list of 30-06 shooters and fans. This is a tried and true big game killer in North American hunting. Probably shot more of the animals you'll be after than most others combined since its so common and been around for so long. Surely some of the new calibers have some ballistic advantages, but not very significant ones for most shooting. All the guns discussed are in the ballpark anyway as far as the ballistics go. I just like the WIDE variety of readily available ammo, and the fact that this gun has stood the test of time and is still considered one of the better all around multi-purpose guns. Its not some flash in the pan that you can't find ammo for and will be gone in a few years!

Like others have said though, whatever you pick, be comfortable with shooting it and equip it with good glass. I think Leupold personally, but I have a Nikon too and its a good scope for the money. The Zeiss and other high dollar scopes are good too, but I'm not sure they are that much better than a Leupold Vari X - III yet they cost A LOT MORE!

[uffdapete]

Probably 20-25 years ago I read an article about the results of testing several calibers and bullet types shooting through brush.

The results conflicted greatly with some long held opinions.

The heavier, slower round nose jobs like the 30-30, 44 mag., 35 Rem., etc. that were thought of as brush busting calibers did not fare well at all. The round that performed the best in this test was the .270! I don't remember the brand or bullet design.

[DrKen]

Much good advice. Foot has good points on checking out guns. As far as calibers, most any mentioned would do all well. As far as the 7mm being no good for moose, I would tend to say that he was using quick opening expansion bullets suitable for whitetails when he should have been using bonded pentration type bullets. In todays world with the huge improvements in variety of bullets, caliber is being less of a factor than it used to be. If you only want one gun, it is hard to beat the 30-06 just because so many varieties of ammunition are available from low recoil to light magnums. With the variety of bullet types from varmit to heavy bonded up to 220 grains it will take any game in North America and you can get ammo in most any country store. As far as the rifle, i would tend to any quality bolt action rifle be it Remington, Winchester, Browning, Ruger, Tika, Savage. Which one would be the one you feel most comfortable with. As far as a scope, a 3-9 in a high quality such as the Leopold VXII, Burris, etc is a necessity. Don't cut corners here. Spend as much on the scope as the gun. Lastly, go out and shoot. No matter what bullet, caliber, gun scope etc it does no good if you can't put the bullet where it counts and that takes practice.

[Ruttin' Buck]

More of the same I guess. I am partial to my 7 mil Rem Mag. Deadly on whitetail and I trust that gun to thread a needle and make that shot through a pop can diameter hole in the brush. Did it this year, pulled up the gun and the Leupold had nothing but pine boughs. I picked out 3" diameter hole and made the shot behind the shoulders, lungs only, no quarter or loin damage.

This can be done with any gun with a good scope and patience...at least at a reasonable range. Nobody has really mentioned ballistics. If you're going west and want flat shooting with horsepower here's the deal...

Generally speaking above say 25 caliber historically the 7mm Rem Mag shot flatter than the 30-06, 260's, 270's, 280's, 300 Mags, etc...WHEN COMPARING SAME BULLET MASS. However, with the advent of the WSM cartridges you'll see that the 300 WSM will outshoot the old 7mm Rem Mag as will the 7MM short mag.

With that being said, I was part of a moose hunt where the hunter dumped a 56" bull with a 300 WSM. I also had a friend shoot a black bear with a 7mm at point blank range. None of the bullets exited. The velocity is blistering, but the advange you gain is that that velocity in turn creates a significant shock wave behind it. When it impacts an animal that shock turns vitals into mush. The moose ran about 40 yards and the black bear had been hit in the top of the shoulder plate which destroyed the bullet, but the bear dropped in its tracks and didn't so much as flinch. The deer I shot this year...well, the bullet exit showed just slight signs of mushrooming, and the lungs were in pieces.

My short version...velocity kills.

One last plug for speed. I shot my first deer with a muzzleloader this year. Huge bullet mass...245 grn versus my 170 grain 7mm bullets. Drilled this doe double lung, no shoulders. She went 80 yards. I inspected the vitals to find a 50 cal hole and and out and a perfect 50 cal hole through each lung. I could literally stick my finger into the lung like a plug had been removed with a cookie cutter. It made a blood trail, but she went a considerable distance on a perfect double lung....why? Well, two lungs with a little damage work longer than 2 lungs turned into pudding.

Last word of advice. The last gun you want for going out west is a 30-30....terrible ballistics.

[EXTREME]

I am suprised that nobody has mentioned the 300 ultra mag. My buddy has a 700 BDL Remington with a 4.5-14x Leupold Vari-X 3. It is really accurate and really an a** kicking round. It is a little overkill for whitetails, but it would be awesome for elk and moose. With the right loads it will easily surpass most belted magnums for velocity and down range energy. I personally use a .270 but I would not use it for moose...you just need that extra bullet weight for knock down power. It is a awesome round....kind of kicks hard thou!

[BigDaddy]

30-06 and 300WSM are both great choices. I shoot a 270 WSM but that's whitetail only. I too have a Tikka T3. It's dollar for dollar the best rifle out there. The trigger is fantastic.

[tripper]

Most any of the cal. mentioned will do. If you shoot some of them do so and pick the one you feel you will enjoy going to the range with to practice at ranges you expect to be shooting. Know your gun, put the bullet where it belongs and dinner is on the table.

[FOOT]

One more thing to add to the discussion.

Many of you are probably to young to remember a hunter by the name of Jack O'Conner. But while I was growing up he was the end all, be all of big game hunters. He wrote for Outdoor Life and several other mags and took most all of his big game with a 270 including Sheep, Goats, Deer, Caribou, Moose, Elk and numerous Asian and African critters.

his contention was the same as most of the posters on this site. If you are comfortable with a rifle and can put the bullet where it belongs then that's the weapon you should use. Of course he wasn't a fool and most African and North American dangerous game he would use a larger caliber.

Good hunting

[Gissert]

Ah, Jack O'Conner. That man was one excellent writer.

His wife was a great shot and hunter as well, and knocked most of her game over with a 7 x 57 mauser.

As far as all around rifles go, that is a tough question to answer. If elk is in the mix, I really would not want anything smaller than 30 caliber. There are so many combinations to choose from.

With elk, especially on public land, they are often worked up and spooky. Elk in that state can be real tough to bring down. My first elk went 400 yards with three .338 bullets into his vitals. I want a big, strong bullet like a Barnes X (my favorite) or a Nosler Partition, that will get through a shoulder bone.

I went from a 30-06 to a .338 win mag back in 98, and have never looked back. I use the .338 on whitetails and elk because I am comfortable with the rifle (Savage 111) and shoot it well.

Nothing wrong with the 270's and 7mms for any game at all, I just prefer a bigger bore with elk.

[icehousebob]

Most of my deer and antelope have fallen to a 7x57 custom Mauser, but I picked up a .338 mag Ruger Model 77 a while back. For the .338, I use 250 gr. Sierra boattails and it is a tight shooter. With a properly placed bullet, it doesn't do any more meat damage than the smaller calibers. The recoil can be abusive with hot loads, so we tried to download it with 200 grain Nosler slugs at a slower velocity. The slugs never opened up and I had two lung shot deer that took over a hundred yards to die. I burned those loads up shooting cans and went back to 250 grain Sierras. For the bucks,I don't think you can beat the Ruger 77 rifle, no matter which caliber you choose.

[S.D. Ice Angular]

.338 Win Mag Hands Down...

You will not b e disappointed, and put the best optics you can afford on it. I personally like a high zoom power scope (which I know is not the norm, but to each their own right)

I use a Leupold Vari X III on my .338

Good Luck...