No topic

[DrJuice1980]

Seems like the last few threads were getting off topic, might as well make one with no topic.  

 

Del,

Splenda:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Splenda

Honey:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey

 

Go ahead and pick your poison.... lol

 

 

 

[delcecchi]

You were saying fructose as in "high fructose corn syrup" is bad. 

Honey gets its sweetness from the monosaccharides fructose and glucose, and has about the same relative sweetness as granulated sugar.^[1][2] It has attractive chemical properties for baking and a distinctive flavor that leads some people to prefer it over sugar and other sweeteners.^[1] Most microorganisms do not grow in honey because of its low water activity of 0.6.^[3] However, honey sometimes contains dormant endospores of the bacterium Clostridium botulinum, which can be dangerous to infants, as the endospores can transform into toxin-producing bacteria in infants' immature intestinal tracts, leading to illness and even death.^[4]

Honey has a bunch of fructose and maybe some botulism on the side....  MMMMmm, 

It does taste good. 

[RebelSS]

I'm NOT getting in on this one, but I do know HFCS has been blamed on a lot of Bee Colony Collapse since they started using it as a feeder substitute years ago. We're in very bad shape right now with our bees; without them, we have no food... period. I'll stick with honey and try to avoid the non-natural HFCS. Lots of info leans toward the fact that it causes metabolic diseases. Lots of input on that I won't get into Therefore, I consume a lot of honey. It's great on burns, too, it DOES prevent bacterial growth. And yes, I was a certified Emergency Care Instructor, and I did stay at a Holiday Inn.  

OK, I'm done.

Beekeeping[edit]

Main article: Colony collapse disorder

In apiculture in the United States, HFCS became a sucrose replacement for honey bees starting in the late 1970s. When HFCS is heated to about 45 degrees C,hydroxymethylfurfural can form from the breakdown of fructose, and is toxic to bees. HFCS has been investigated as a possible source of colony collapse disorder.^[15]

[delcecchi]

There is a nationally known bee researcher at U of MN> 

http://www.beelab.umn.edu/

Dr Marla Spivak had this to say. 

https://www.minnpost.com/earth-journal/2015/03/marla-spivak-grasp-our-bees-plight-and-prospects-stay-focused-food

Check her out if interested.

[RebelSS]

Thanks, Del, gotta do that! Way too many insecticides and unknowns have contributed to the loss of bees. My Autumn Sedums, that turn maroon in the Fall, are normally COVERED with honeybees for a month in the Fall. This year, it was like they deserted, I saw a few, which was incredible. Been watching swarms of them on the plants for 20+ years, since I planted the Sedums. They're disappearing. 

[delcecchi]

I bet she would even reply to email. 

ps I like honey.  I just try to avoid sugars whenever possible.  But honey on toast made with Walmart Italian white bread, with butter, is one of my occasional indulgences.  Mmmm.

And I made pb and honey sandwich for my daughter's lunch until she went to college. 

Edited December 23, 2015 by delcecchi

[RebelSS]

I'm a clover honey snob. Amazing amount of clover honeys out there; I'm a purple blossom guy. Right outta the jar  *GULP*   

[leechlake]

my father in law started the honey thing last year.  Awesome stuff and funny watching him in the suit.  He could bore you to death with how it all works but it's worth listening when you get some honey from him.

[eyeguy 54]

I'm a clover honey snob. Amazing amount of clover honeys out there; I'm a purple blossom guy. Right outta the jar  *GULP*   

better than being a sunfish snob...  lol  

[delcecchi]

Hmm. maybe not so good for you after all...

https://www.minnpost.com/earth-journal/2015/03/marla-spivak-grasp-our-bees-plight-and-prospects-stay-focused-food

Crime

Honey laundering: The sour side of nature's golden sweetener

JESSICA LEEDER - Global Food Reporter

The Globe and Mail

Published Wednesday, Jan. 05, 2011 11:30PM EST

Last updated Thursday, Jan. 20, 2011 8:31PM EST

 

 

As crime sagas go, a scheme rigged by a sophisticated cartel of global traders has all the right blockbuster elements: clandestine movements of illegal substances through a network of co-operatives in Asia, a German conglomerate, jet-setting executives, doctored laboratory reports, high-profile takedowns and fearful turncoats.

What makes this worldwide drama unusual, other than being regarded as part of the largest food fraud in U.S. history, is the fact that honey, nature's benign golden sweetener, is the lucrative contraband.

...

What consumers don't know is that honey doesn't usually come straight - or pure - from the hive. Giant steel drums of honey bound for grocery store shelves and the food processors that crank out your cereal are in constant flow through the global market. Most honey comes from China, where beekeepers are notorious for keeping their bees healthy with antibiotics banned in North America because they seep into honey and contaminate it; packers there learn to mask the acrid notes of poor quality product by mixing in sugar or corn-based syrups to fake good taste.

None of this is on the label. Rarely will a jar of honey say "Made in China." Instead, Chinese honey sold in North America is more likely to be stamped as Indonesian, Malaysian or Taiwanese, due to a growing multimillion dollar laundering system designed to keep the endless supply of cheap and often contaminated Chinese honey moving into the U.S., where tariffs have been implemented to staunch the flow and protect its own struggling industry.

.....

China, the world's largest producer of honey, would seem a natural candidate to fill the gap. But Chinese honey is notorious for containing the banned antibiotic chloramphenicol, used by farmers to keep bees from falling ill. The European Union outlawed Chinese honey imports because of it.

Dilution is another issue. According to Grace Pundyk, author of The Honey Trail, Chinese manufacturers will inject a type of honey with litres of water, heat it, pass it through an ultrafine ceramic or carbon filter, and then distill it into syrup. While it eradicates impurities such as antibiotics, it also denies honey of its essence.

(anti dumping tariff imposed )

In the U.S., a hefty tariff - more than two dollars for every kilogram of Chinese-origin honey - was levied.

"We saw a flurry of honey starting to come into the U.S. from countries - Indonesia, Malaysia, Taiwan, the Philippines - that had never been exporters to the U.S. before,"

.......

A group of executives at the German food ingredients conglomerate Alfred L. Wolff GmbH (ALW) were early masters of this model, according to allegations contained in U.S. court documents. Headquartered in Hamburg, ALW has subsidiaries and affiliates around the world, including in China and Chicago. After the U.S. tariffs were levied, ALW, the largest honey importer in the U.S., began networking with Chinese honey producers and brokers desperate to unload cheap products.

In exchange for contracts with ALW, honey brokers agreed to move Chinese-origin honey to Russia, India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Mongolia, the Philippines, South Korea, Taiwan and Thailand, according to court documents.

The brokers also agreed to repackage the honey and muddy its trail by using a series of shell companies to ship it to the U.S. That meant falsifying country of origin certificates and, in some cases, deliberately mislabeling honey as molasses, fructose or glucose syrup so customs officials would not notice a suspect increase in honey shipments. Brokers were told to hire specific labs that specialized in filtering the honey to remove markers (such as pollen or soil) that could be used to trace shipments back to their true origin, according to court documents that outline the U.S. government's case.

....

A bonus to those in the laundering scheme, U.S. food inspectors had a more lax approach to inspecting shipments that did not appear to have a Chinese connection. Tests conducted by food inspectors are based on country-of-origin information; if Chinese roots aren't declared on shipments, inspectors will not test for the chemicals associated with honey production in China, meaning contaminated loads are less likely to be detected or seized and can still be sold for consumption. The same is true of honey diluted with cheaper sweeteners, which is often passed off to consumers as the real thing.

Chicago sting

That was true without many exceptions until U.S. investigators got the right people talking. In May, 2008, federal agents arrested a pair of young ALW executives, Stefanie Giesselbach and Magnus von Buddenbrock, outside Chicago's O'Hare International Airport.

Threatened with having to take the lion's share of the blame for ALW's scheme, both began co-operating with investigators.

Momentum quickly picked up: U.S. customs officials seized close to 2,500 drums of suspect honey that year in Minnesota, Illinois and Washington state and highlighted 600 loads of disguised Chinese honey connected to ALW. Declared as Chinese, it would have been subject to nearly $80-million in tariffs.

...

He said a recent EU decision to ban honey from India over worries of lead and other contaminates - much of it widely suspected to be of Chinese origin - has only increased odds that more Chinese honey is bound for U.S. borders.

Yep, definitely a health food.  Eat it and you are hungry an hour later....If you live. 

 

Edited December 23, 2015 by delcecchi

[fishersofmen]

 

And I made pb and honey sandwich for my daughter's lunch until she went to college. 

My kids favorite right there. I don't eat a ton of it except for on cereal.

[DrJuice1980]

A little honey in the morning is a great idea. 

[delcecchi]

Why?  Get your blood sugar up?   First and foremost it's sugar. 

[DrJuice1980]

Whats wrong with pure sugar?  You mean humans needed to alter it to make it better for you?

Its way more than sugar.

Taking local honey has been shown to reduce allergens by strengthening your immunity to those allergens.  I'd rather go that route then take allergy shots or meds that are not necessary. 

http://health.howstuffworks.com/diseases-conditions/allergies/allergy-treatments/local-honey-for-allergies2.htm

Call me wacky, I'll call you a pill popper.

 

 

[delcecchi]

Interesting you seem to not post links from actual medical sites

Now, why is it we would want or need to add things comprised primarily of sugar to our diet?

Edited December 23, 2015 by delcecchi

[LindellProStaf]

I put a little honey in my first cup of coffee every morning.  

I heard an interesting talk on MPR a couple of years ago.  It was a Fed Food Economist.  He was talking about sugar being so bad for our population as far as diabetes and obesity etc.  He said about 40 years ago the Feds were getting ready to announce the dangers of sugar and do something about it.  At that time the sugar lobby which is HUGE started putting ads in the media denouncing fat from animals being so bad for us and creating obesity which clouded the whole situation.  The numbers of diabetes and  obesity have skyrocketed in the last 40 years. That is the same time frame when gas stations went from selling gas and had about 5 kinds of pop and 5 kinds of candy bars to having hundreds of kinds of candies and pops and make more money selling sugar than gas.  Great marketing by the sugar companies.  The ag industry has tried to make our beef pork and chicken more lean and healthy.  He wasn't denouncing either lobby just giving info on each of them.  Very interesting.  Everything in moderation. 

I don't mind some sweets but I really like steaks, chops, wings etc....    

[DrJuice1980]

Interesting you seem to not post links from actual medical sites

Now, why is it we would want or need to add things comprised primarily of sugar to our diet?

 

Studies and research that contradicts itself usually means somebody wants to profit and said research or study or publication may prohibit that. Dont be so naive.

Did you know your body requires sugar and fat?  

 

Edited December 23, 2015 by DrJuice1980

[delcecchi]

Duh.  Did you know that your body makes sugar in the process of digesting complex carbohydrates? You have no need to consume sugar.

[DrJuice1980]

If it were only that simple Del.  Not all carbs are metabolized the same...

Duh...

 

Edited December 23, 2015 by DrJuice1980

[DrJuice1980]

Farmers have you brainwashed.  

[delcecchi]

So a substance that is largely a mixture of sugars is good?   And who told you that? 

Farmers?  Where did that come from?  Complex carbohydrates?  Farmers grow everything.  You are really stretching on that one, juice. 

[nofishfisherman]

What are you guys arguing about now?  Sugar vs Honey?

Here is what I know.

Gram for gram sugar has slightly more calories than honey but people rarely weigh their honey/sugar before dumping in a tablespoon of either. Given honey weighs more than sugar you are probably using more grams of honey than you are of sugar if you use a tablespoon of each, so by using honey you are likely consuming slightly more calories. Although the calorie difference is probably not enough to make much of a difference unless you are consuming large amounts. 

Honey is lower on the glycemic index so if that is a factor for you than honey is better than sugar. 

Honey also has some other health benefits that can be debated but are generally accepted. 

If I had to say one is better than the other I'd probably give the nod to honey but in reality both should be consumed in moderation and neither could really be considered as being healthy in most circumstances. 

 

[DrJuice1980]

So a substance that is largely a mixture of sugars is good?   And who told you that? 

Farmers?  Where did that come from?  Complex carbohydrates?  Farmers grow everything.  You are really stretching on that one, juice. 

I thought you agreed we as humans, required sugar.... why not get that from sugar?

 

Sorry, I will rephrase that.  Big Farm has you brainwashed, as well as Big Pharm.

 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2015 by DrJuice1980

[RebelSS]

I say foo to it all and just have another slice o' cheese. 

[fishersofmen]

I love cheese. They say it is as addictive as crack.