Punching

[CHM]

(Not ice fishing)

Who's done it here in MN? What kind of weeds? I'm wanting to build a flipstick and that got me thinking about some really thick weeds I've seen and was wondering if anyone on here has tried punching with heavier weights.

[kstephes033]

I did it a little bit this year, fun technique because the fish absolutely demolish the bait. Thick milfoil alone as well as mixed with pads were my preferred cover types. Just make sure to have a really strong hook (I use the Trokar punching hooks... awesome) along with heavy braid (both 65 & 80 for me) and a rod that is over 7' so you can gain the leverage needed to get them out. As for the reel it is kind of preference at that point, I like to have a 7:1 so I can get that line up and fish out as quick as I can, others will like the lower ratio so they have more power to get them out.

[Juan Grande]

Donkey?

[Deitz Dittrich]

To be real honest, I know I threw finess jigs a few times this year.. otherwise, I punch about every time I am out. I punch deep, shallow, in weeds, in pads, in timber.

So,... Yup, done it.

[MuskieFever]

Great technique and quite a rush. My goal this next season is to target deeper structures for punching vs the normal shallow slop. It may take a little more searching to find it but it should pay off. I currently use a 7'MH but upgrading to a 7'10"H. I run 65 pound braid. Lesson I've learned is to not pitch or flip out too far. A lot of the time it's you vs a 3pounder with 5 pounds of pads and slop on the fish. Pressure is key but you can definitely horse them too much and lose em. Sometimes its best in super thick junk to set the hook, keep pressure, and chase em down with the trolling motor until you're dang near on top of the fish. Usually pads, milfoil, or just whatever thick junk you find. Usually 3/4oz works but I have broken out the 1oz from time to time. A nice trick is to pitch up so the bait falls from higher up to punch threw better.

[thatoneguy]

Donkey?

[CHM]

Thanks for the input. It's not talked about much on the MN forums so I was curious. I have an old heavy power 7' 6" Lamiglas blank that I will extend to 8' and do a spiral wrap on.

[RK]

I punch on occasions. It is pretty fun for sure. Sometimes the traditional pads/slop, but also some deeper stuff, especially coontail clumps and mats. A big coontail clump that's the size of your boat is actually pretty narrow at the base, and in a cluster of them there are big lanes between the bases of clumps, and about the only way to get to the bases is to punch through the overhead cover. Not a lot of milfoil up north so milfoil isn't something I deal with a lot...

I use an 8' Powell punching rod, which I like a lot. Main thing with the rod/reel choice I think is balance. A tip-heavy rod plus a big bait hanging off it can be murder on your wrist after a long day. One of those cases where a heavy reel is actually kind of beneficial even though it makes the overall combo heavier. I ended up putting a balancer on the rod butt since the reel I'm using is pretty light. Makes a big difference.

I know down south a lot of guys use 1-1/2 oz weights, but I rarely find a need to go that heavy. 3/4 to 1 oz is about all I use. I love tungsten, but even with 65 braid I get bit off by pike often enough that I usually use lead. Losing $30 worth of tungsten in an afternoon takes the fun out of it in a hurry for me... Conquistador makes a hardened lead punch weight that I like, and they're $5 for a 10 count bag. I use 65# braid and a snell knot. The snell knot supposedly gives you a better angle on hook penetration which I suppose is possible, but to me what it really does is protect your knot from the weight or the collar on a punch skirt grinding on it.

Biggest thing with punching for me is while some fish do absolutely drill the bait, a lot of them just pick it up and don't move. If you pick the bait up and feel resistance, it's usually a fish. Takes patience too - you can fish quite a while before running into a pod of fish, then catch 5 in 7 or 8 drops. You have to just kind of get into a rhythm as you move along, and you can actually cover water pretty quickly. Over time you also kind of get to know what parts of a big mat produce consistently.

All in all, punching is a hoot. Sometimes wish I fished more lakes where I had the opportunity to do it. Lot of the lakes I fish you can count the lily pads on one hand...

[BTL]

It's incredibly boring and monotonous until you get that first bite. Then you don't want to put down the flippin' stick for the rest of the day.

[CHM]

Excuse my ignorance, but do you just yo-yo in place when you break through the thick stuff? I have a lake in mind that has pads so thick a small dog could walk on them.

Good tip on the balance.

[Deitz Dittrich]

CHM- a lot depends on the weather and the activity of the fish. Some days I will yo yo it, some days I will just let it plop on the bottom and let it sit a few seconds.. Other days I will just let it hit the bottom and then I will right away pick it up and hit the next pocket.. The last way is what I do most of the time.. cover as much water as I can.

[Wayne Ek]

This may help... but it's long.

PUNCHING MATS AND FLATS FOR BASS

By Wayne Ek

In the Merriam-Webster’s dictionary “punch” is listed as a transitive verb, (1. prod, poke) or (4. to push down so as to produce a desired result.) And that is exactly what we are going to talk about today. How to prod, poke or push jigs and rigs down through mats of floating vegetation or expansive flats of Eurasian milfoil, with the sole purpose of producing one desired result, catching lots of bass.

Let’s talk about the what and where of mat fishing. Mainly we see two types of mats in the upper Midwest region. Floating mats of dead aquatic vegetation or living mats created as aquatic vegetation grows to the surface and mushrooms out.

Floating mats are usually smaller in size and in shallower water. They’re mainly made up of dead floating aquatic vegetation like pencil reeds, coontail, milfoil and cattail leaves. Current, waves or wind push these chunks of dead plants towards shore and shallow water. There they pile up against docks/boat-lifts, sea walls, lay-downs or living clumps of emergent vegetation (cattails, pencil reels or rice). Creating a small roof of convenient cover for any baitfish or bass passing by.

Living mats can range in size from small isolated clumps of milfoil or coontail in shallow water, to expansive flats (acres in size) of milfoil, with clumps of coontail or cabbage mixed in. Depending on water clarity, you can find them anywhere from 1-foot of water out to that 12-foot range. When I was guiding I used to tell my clients to think of fishing mats on milfoil flats, as fishing above a forest of trees. Think of milfoil as a “palm tree” growing straight up with some thick branches at the top, with nothing but open space between the ground (lake bottom) and top branches (surface vegetation). And think of coontail as a mushroom, a short compact truck, growing up into a thick umbrella canopy, with some open space in between. The canopies of both plants can hold and support an amazing number of baitfish, young sunfish, crappies and perch. This smorgasbord of food draws in the predators, including bass. The big fish are drawn to the edges of the “forest” and to the open space under the canopy; those are the places we want to fish. But to get there you need to “punch” your bait through a thick surface canopy.

You need powerful rods, strong reels and heavy line to fish mats/flats. This is a short line presentation; I would venture to say I rarely have more than 20-feet of line out, usually less. So the hook-sets are wrist jarring and the battle is a nose-to-nose, toes-to-toes slugfest. You got to love it. The equipment I’ve settled on for mat fishing is listed below.

• Two matching Okuma rods. I like the C3-Carbon Cone Concept rod (C3x-C-721XH), which is a 7’2” extra-heavy rod, with a fast taper and weighs only 5.6-ounces.

• The reels are both Okuma Serrano’s (SR-200W) the “W” just indicates that it’s a wide-spool reel and holds a little less line, which is a plus for flipping/pitching. It’s a low-profile reel, fits comfortably in my hand and only weighs 7.2-ounces. The gear ratio is 6.2:1, picking up 26-inches of line. Both reels are spooled with 65-pound Power Pro line.

My lure selection is very simple, good or bad I don’t vary much. My theory on “mat bass” is; either they bite or they don’t. There is no finessing them with different lures or colors of baits. And what’s listed below has cashed enough tournament checks for me over the past couple of years, that I’m not about to change.

• One rod has a ½-ounce jig/pig on it. I’m now using the Hack Attack jig and Rage Craw trailer (All Strike King Lures). I like the Hack Attack jigs because they have a big Gamakatsu hook, with a wide gap. Since using them my hook-up to landing ratio has gone way up, once I hook-up with this jig I rarely drop a fish anymore. My go-to colors on the jigs are Black/Blue and Green Pumpkin Craw. For the Rage Craw trailers the colors I use the most are Black/Blue Flake, June Bug, Blue Sapphire and Green Pumpkin.

• The second rod has a “Texas rigged” tube or creature bait on it. Again by Strike King Lures the Denny Brauer’s Flip-N-Tube in Black/Blue Flake (blue tail) or Green Pumpkin (chartreuse tail). The creature bait is always a Strike King “Rodent” in June Bug, Bama Bug or Green Pumpkinseed.

• I use Gamakatsu 4/0-Superline worm hooks and a Strike King Lure, Tour Grade Tungsten weight (black or green pumpkin) in ½-ounce up to ¾-ounce weights. The weight is pegged with a rubber worm weight peg. And I place a rubber (neoprene) slip-bobber stop between the weight and hook to cut down on knot wear.

So now that we know what we’re fishing and what tackle works, let’s take a look at how to target these fish. Floating mats are really very simple and quick to fish. When I’m pitching a shallow water pattern, I like to look at floating mats as bonus cover. You were going to fish that dock anyway, but now you have one more spot to hit. A couple of points on floating mats:

• Because they’re small, they rarely hold more than a couple of fish, usually only one.

• If they are in shallow clear water they rarely replenish quickly. So you may only get one bite per day per mat.

• Isolated floating mats can be fished very fast. But floating mats in expansive pencil reed flats need to be picked apart very slowly and thoroughly. As they have a tendency to hold more fish.

On to those big expansive milfoil or coontail flats, with thick mats everywhere you look. The same ones that other anglers pass-up because “they’re too hard to fish.” I truly love fishing this stuff, it took awhile but I finally figured it out and now “punching milfoil” is one of my favorite patterns.

If you’ve never punched milfoil before, the first time can be frustrating for a couple of reasons. One is the shear size of some milfoil flats, acre upon acre of cover, all looking like it should hold fish…where do you start? And two, just like deep weedlines where bass tend to school up in certain select spots, expansive milfoil flats are the same way, schools of bass in select areas. You just have to find those areas. Here is what I suggest, as it worked for me when I was trying to figure out this frustrating pattern.

• Find a good milfoil lake in your region, check with your Dept. of Natural Resources, as Eurasian milfoil is considered an invasive species the department will know which lakes have it.

• Pick a nice day, light winds and clear sky. Then commit to only pitching milfoil mats for half the day.

• Pick one rod to use the whole time. I would suggest the “Texas rigged” tube/creature bait set-up. No other rods on the deck.

• There is a rhythm to this type of pitching; it’s something like this. Pitch it out, follow it down, lift once, twice, three times, reel up and start over.

• Pull up to a milfoil flat; put the trolling motor on slow, put your head down and start pitching. Pick up the rhythm and just keep moving. Pay no attention to water depth or clumps, mats or holes in the milfoil. Just keep making short pitches every 5 to 6-feet down the center of the flat. Once you get to an end, whether shallow or deep, move over 20-yards and work right back the way you came. Moving slow and making short pitches. Just covering water. Keep doing this until you’ve fished the whole flat. Then move on to the next flat and start all over again. Eventually you will hit fish. Whether you do it in the first 50-yards on the very first flat or even if it takes a couple of half-day outings… eventually you will hit fish.

• And that’s the payoff, eventually hitting those fish. Because it won’t be just a fish, there will be a school of them. We’ve spent whole tournament days on one area no larger than a two-car garage, catching fish after fish. The whole key is believing that this pattern will produce fish and then going out and overhauling them a couple of times.

• After that it’s just a psychological mind game you have to play with yourself. Constantly reminding yourself, they’re here, they’re here! Because when the bite is slow and tough, fishing massive milfoil flats can be relentlessly tedious. As well as mind-numbingly dull. That is until you hit that next school of fish.

Fishing mats/flats large or small has a learning curve to it. But if you give it a fair chance this pattern can put a lot of fish into the boat. It can also give you the worst case of “bass thumb” that you’ve ever had. And as we all know, at the end of the day bass thumb is what we all strive for.

As always, stay safe and we hope to see you on the water.

Wayne Ek is the owner of Agape Outdoors, LLC. He is a writer, seminar speaker and tournament angler, living in Alexandria, Minnesota.

[Juan Grande]

Awesome article Wayne! I have to admit that I've never punched. Seems like a tactic that would be great for putting fish in the boat for tournaments if you're good at it.

As for fun fishing, I don't know. I know the ultimate goal is catching fish, but is it thrilling to pull a fish 10 feet from the boat straight out of the water with a heavy action rod and 70 lb test? I guess I should try it before I knock it!

[Wayne Ek]

Thank you. The thrill is the numbers of fish this tech. can produce. And a big fish, be it bass, northern, walleye or muskie on a short line will get all of our hearts pounding.

[RK]

Great stuff as always Wayne. Right on about the other species too. Have caught some great big walleyes doing this. Always a fun "What the...?" moment when you see a big walleye head coming out of the mat instead of a bass.

As far as letting it sit, hopping it, whatever - it's a cliche, but kind of have to let the fish tell you. Most of the time I give it a hop or two is all, then it's back out and on to the next pitch. I bet it's in the water a total of 15 seconds, out of the water for 5, then back in. Wayne's right on about getting into a rhythm. A lot of the time though it's a reaction bite and they hit it on the drop or as soon as it hits the bottom. One thing I will do most of the time though is pause for a second or two while the bait's just under the mat before I pull it out of the water. Sometimes fish will chase it up, and if you pause, they'll eat it right under the mat. Those fish usually drill it too.

One other twist is to use a Bubba Shot rig instead of a Texas rig or jig. Basically it's a drop shot rig but with a heavy weight (I use a pegged egg or Carolina Rig sinker, or a bullet weight upside down) and a heavy hook 8" or so above it. These can work when fish are a little off. The weight punches through and drags the bait down with it, but once it's through and the weight is on the bottom you can let the plastic fall slowly or just hover it and shake it a few times. It's kind of a contraption and not always easy to pitch accurately, and the plastics get torn up (I usually use tubes), but it can be a good way to scrounge a few more fish from a school you've already beat up on with a jig or Texas Rig. Also good on a real gooey bottom where a T-Rig just sinks into the muck and disappears. I don't do this a lot - should do it more maybe. It does slow you down some. But, it can work too, so...

[Superduty]

I have a Bubba Shot question for RK and others that use this technique.

Do you feel like you miss fish because they hit the dropshot weight (instead of the bait) on the original drop through the mat? I have a mental hang up about the Bubba Shot because of this. My thoughts are that fish will hit the first thing they see falling(the weight and not the bait) and the Bubba Shot should be used only for trying to get a few more bites from a school that has shut off. I think one of the main reasons pitching with heavy weights is effective is because fish don't have time to think about eating your bait as it quickly appears and rushes by them. They have an instinct that takes over when something suddenly appears in their space and they can't help but to eat it.

[CHM]

I think one of the main reasons pitching with heavy weights is effective is because fish don't have time to think about eating your bait as it quickly appears and rushes by them. They have an instinct that takes over when something suddenly appears in their space and they can't help but to eat it.

From an In Fisherman article...

"Suppose you’re sitting at home and someone drops a French fry in front of you. All you do is reach out and grab it from where you sit and swallow it." LOL

[RK]

I have a Bubba Shot question for RK and others that use this technique.

Do you feel like you miss fish because they hit the dropshot weight (instead of the bait) on the original drop through the mat? I have a mental hang up about the Bubba Shot because of this. My thoughts are that fish will hit the first thing they see falling(the weight and not the bait) and the Bubba Shot should be used only for trying to get a few more bites from a school that has shut off. I think one of the main reasons pitching with heavy weights is effective is because fish don't have time to think about eating your bait as it quickly appears and rushes by them. They have an instinct that takes over when something suddenly appears in their space and they can't help but to eat it.

Yeah, you do get some 'sinker bites' once in a while but not that many really. Get them with a regular drop shot sometimes too. Really though there isn't a lot of bulk there to get noticed compared to the bait so I don't think about it too hard. Most of the fish hit the bait.

[slopmaster]

Punching is a great technique and produces big fish. Some days you have to let it sit on the bottom but most times I yoyo the bait so it hits the bottom of the mat and then let it fall back to the bottom. Those 2lbers feel big with 10lbs of salad on them, get a 5lber thrashing around and your heart will be racing.

[smalliehunter]

Thank you for sharing your knowledge wayne. I picked up a few slither rigs lsat month and after reading all this I can not wait to try them. Really good stuff here, thank you again.

[CHM]

smalliehunter - I grew up in Hutch!

Thanks to everyone for the input! I appreciate it. I'm going to take some notes from this thread and buy some tackle and plastics this winter.

I can't wait to start building the rod. The rod blank I have is an old discontinued Lamiglas MB895 that I bought for $25 from the bargain bin at the Lamiglas plant in WA. It's a 7' 5" 5-power jig blank. It's a beast. The color is a nice translucent deep maroon so it will look great with some brown burl cork. I'll put a balance kit in the butt.

[RumRiverRat]

I did a ton of punching this year.

I also did a lot of Bubba/power shotting.

3/4 to 1.5oz weight, 4/0 flippin hook and any of the beaver style baits will work.

Also used the SK Menace Grub, Gambler Cricket and Havoc Slop Craw.

Punching is nore addicting than frog fishing.

[wiangler88]

3/4 oz is usually my go to size but like some have said here, it may take up to 1.5 oz.

I bought some from kenders and they are uuuunbelievable. There's go up to 1.5 oz but I have been using the 3/4 oz with no problems so far this year. I would expect as the foliage gets more dense the 1.5 will come in handy. 

They have this rainbow finish one and the quality insane. The prices are solid too!

https://www.kendersoutdoors.com/collections/tungsten-weights/products/tungsten-punching-weights?variant=18271541123