Legality of selling guns at an estate sale

[Steve Foss]

Hey all:

We've been doing property cleanouts and estate sales for the last few years, and surprisingly have not run into this until our current project.

There will be a bunch of guns up for sale as part of the esate. All are either hunting or target guns. Four handguns (three revolvers and a 22/45 target semi-auto), and a variety of shotguns and rifles.

Can these be sold at an estate sale by someone who is not a gun dealer? If not at an estate sale, what about private sales?

Here's the rundown . . .

Handguns

1. Ruger 22/45 semi-auto target .22 pistol

2. Ruger GP100 .357 revolver

3. Rohm GMBH 1M/BRZ .22 revolver

4. S&W .44 mag revolver

Shotguns

1. Winchester Ranger Model 120 youth 20 gauge pump

2. J.C Higgins Model 21 20 gauge pump

3. Ithaca Model 37 Featherlight 12 gauge pump

4. S&W Model 1000 20 gauge semi-auto

Rifles

1. Winchester Model 1873 .38 WCS, lever action, octagonal barrel

2. Ruger 10/22

3. Marlin 336 lever action .30-30 w/Bushnell fixed power Sharpshooter scope

4. Browning 30-06 semi auto w/Redfield 3-9x 50mm scope

5. Winchester Model 670A .243 bolt action w/Redfield 4x scope

6. Remington Model 7400 .270 semi-auto w/Bushnell Sportview 3-9x scope

7. Remington Model 510 Targetmaster .22 single shot

8. Savage Model 24 .22/20 gauge over/under

Also, there are at least three cannons (ceremonial, not combat) and a LOT of black powder. I shnit you not! Any restrictions on selling the black powder?

And no, I'm not trying to sneak in a for-sale post and arrange sales through the forum. I figured the list would make it easier to get some input, since there are handguns and semi-autos involved. Thanks in advance for the advice.

[harvey lee]

Very interesting questions.

I have sold numerous guns over the years and also purchased many from private parties.

Never did one thing in regards to a regristration for any purchased or sold through a private party.

I personally know of no laws would require you to do anything.

May be a great question for the Sheriff's office.

[harvey lee]

Out of curiosity, I called my Sheriff's office and talked to the sheriff who is a friend of mine.

He suggested to write up a sales reciept for the gun, with both parties names and the gun type and serial number for your records, that's it.

I asked if one had to report anything to the Satte or feds for weither a rifle, shotgun or a pistol of any type.

So, I would take from that it's good to go as long as the weapons to be sold are legal to own, no auto stuff.

Hope that is what you were looking for.

[Steve Foss]

Thanks Tom. I love simple solutions to potential problems.

[picksbigwagon]

Harvey Lee nailed it. Do a bill of sale with name, drivers license and serial numbers......make sure they know that they have to give you this information or no sale.....

[snoozebutton]

I believe you have to see an ID to ascertain that they're 21 or over and ask if they've have ever been convicted of a felony. They can lie about the felony conviction if they choose but you're covered as long as you ask.

[Tom7227]

624.7132 REPORT OF TRANSFER.

Subdivision 1.Required information.

Except as provided in this section and section 624.7131, every person who agrees to transfer a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon shall report the following information in writing to the chief of police of the organized full-time police department of the municipality where the proposed transferee resides or to the appropriate county sheriff if there is no such local chief of police:

(1) the name, residence, telephone number, and driver's license number or nonqualification certificate number, if any, of the proposed transferee;

(2) the sex, date of birth, height, weight, and color of eyes, and distinguishing physical characteristics, if any, of the proposed transferee;

(3) a statement that the proposed transferee authorizes the release to the local police authority of commitment information about the proposed transferee maintained by the commissioner of human services, to the extent that the information relates to the proposed transferee's eligibility to possess a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon under section 624.713, subdivision 1;

(4) a statement by the proposed transferee that the transferee is not prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon; and

(5) the address of the place of business of the transferor.

The report shall be signed and dated by the transferor and the proposed transferee. The report shall be delivered by the transferor to the chief of police or sheriff no later than three days after the date of the agreement to transfer, excluding weekends and legal holidays. The statement under clause (3) must comply with any applicable requirements of Code of Federal Regulations, title 42, sections 2.31 to 2.35, with respect to consent to disclosure of alcohol or drug abuse patient records.

Subd. 2.Investigation.

Upon receipt of a transfer report, the chief of police or sheriff shall check criminal histories, records and warrant information relating to the proposed transferee through the Minnesota Crime Information System, the national criminal record repository, and the National Instant Criminal Background Check System. The chief of police or sheriff shall also make a reasonable effort to check other available state and local record-keeping systems. The chief of police or sheriff shall obtain commitment information from the commissioner of human services as provided in section 245.041.

Subd. 3.Notification.

The chief of police or sheriff shall notify the transferor and proposed transferee in writing as soon as possible if the chief or sheriff determines that the proposed transferee is prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon. The notification to the transferee shall specify the grounds for the disqualification of the proposed transferee and shall set forth in detail the transferee's right of appeal under subdivision 13.

Subd. 4.Delivery.

Except as otherwise provided in subdivision 7 or 8, no person shall deliver a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a proposed transferee until five business days after the date the agreement to transfer is delivered to a chief of police or sheriff in accordance with subdivision 1 unless the chief of police or sheriff waives all or a portion of the seven-day waiting period. The chief of police or sheriff may waive all or a portion of the five business day waiting period in writing if the chief of police or sheriff finds that the transferee requires access to a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon because of a threat to the life of the transferee or of any member of the household of the transferee.

No person shall deliver a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a proposed transferee after receiving a written notification that the chief of police or sheriff has determined that the proposed transferee is prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon.

If the transferor makes a report of transfer and receives no written notification of disqualification of the proposed transferee within five business days after delivery of the agreement to transfer, the pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon may be delivered to the transferee.

Subd. 5.Grounds for disqualification.

A determination by the chief of police or sheriff that the proposed transferee is prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon shall be the sole basis for a notification of disqualification under this section.

Subd. 6.Transferee permit.

If a chief of police or sheriff determines that a transferee is not a person prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon, the transferee may, within 30 days after the determination, apply to that chief of police or sheriff for a transferee permit, and the permit shall be issued.

Subd. 7.

[Repealed, 1994 c 636 art 3 s 46]

Subd. 8.Report not required.

If the proposed transferee presents a valid transferee permit issued under section 624.7131 or a valid permit to carry issued under section 624.714, the transferor need not file a transfer report.

Subd. 9.Number of pistols or semiautomatic military-style assault weapons.

Any number of pistols or semiautomatic military-style assault weapons may be the subject of a single transfer agreement and report to the chief of police or sheriff. Nothing in this section or section 624.7131 shall be construed to limit or restrict the number of pistols or semiautomatic military-style assault weapons a person may acquire.

Subd. 10.Restriction on records.

If, after a determination that the transferee is not a person prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon, a transferee requests that no record be maintained of the fact of who is the transferee of a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon, the chief of police or sheriff shall sign the transfer report and return it to the transferee as soon as possible. Thereafter, no government employee or agency shall maintain a record of the transfer that identifies the transferee, and the transferee shall retain the report of transfer.

Subd. 11.Forms; cost.

Chiefs of police and sheriffs shall make transfer report forms available throughout the community. There shall be no charge for forms, reports, investigations, notifications, waivers or any other act performed or materials provided by a government employee or agency in connection with a transfer.

Subd. 12.Exclusions.

Except as otherwise provided in section 609.66, subdivision 1f, this section shall not apply to transfers of antique firearms as curiosities or for their historical significance or value, transfers to or between federally licensed firearms dealers, transfers by order of court, involuntary transfers, transfers at death or the following transfers:

(1) a transfer by a person other than a federally licensed firearms dealer;

(2) a loan to a prospective transferee if the loan is intended for a period of no more than one day;

(3) the delivery of a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a person for the purpose of repair, reconditioning or remodeling;

(4) a loan by a teacher to a student in a course designed to teach marksmanship or safety with a pistol and approved by the commissioner of natural resources;

(5) a loan between persons at a firearms collectors exhibition;

(6) a loan between persons lawfully engaged in hunting or target shooting if the loan is intended for a period of no more than 12 hours;

(7) a loan between law enforcement officers who have the power to make arrests other than citizen arrests; and

(8) a loan between employees or between the employer and an employee in a business if the employee is required to carry a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon by reason of employment and is the holder of a valid permit to carry a pistol.

Subd. 13.Appeal.

A person aggrieved by the determination of a chief of police or sheriff that the person is prohibited by section 624.713 from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon may appeal the determination as provided in this subdivision. The district court shall have jurisdiction of proceedings under this subdivision.

On review pursuant to this subdivision, the court shall be limited to a determination of whether the proposed transferee is a person prohibited from possessing a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon by section 624.713.

Subd. 14.Transfer to unknown party.

(a) No person shall transfer a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to another who is not personally known to the transferor unless the proposed transferee presents evidence of identity to the transferor.

( No person who is not personally known to the transferor shall become a transferee of a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon unless the person presents evidence of identity to the transferor.

© The evidence of identity shall contain the name, residence address, date of birth, and photograph of the proposed transferee; must be made or issued by or under the authority of the United States government, a state, a political subdivision of a state, a foreign government, a political subdivision of a foreign government, an international governmental or an international quasi-governmental organization; and must be of a type commonly accepted for the purpose of identification of individuals.

(d) A person who becomes a transferee of a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon in violation of this subdivision is guilty of a misdemeanor.

Subd. 15.Penalties.

(a) Except as otherwise provided in paragraph (, a person who does any of the following is guilty of a gross misdemeanor:

(1) transfers a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon in violation of subdivisions 1 to 13;

(2) transfers a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a person who has made a false statement in order to become a transferee, if the transferor knows or has reason to know the transferee has made the false statement;

(3) knowingly becomes a transferee in violation of subdivisions 1 to 13; or

(4) makes a false statement in order to become a transferee of a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon knowing or having reason to know the statement is false.

( A person who does either of the following is guilty of a felony:

(1) transfers a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a person under the age of 18 in violation of subdivisions 1 to 13; or

(2) transfers a pistol or semiautomatic military-style assault weapon to a person under the age of 18 who has made a false statement in order to become a transferee, if the transferor knows or has reason to know the transferee has made the false statement.

Subd. 16.Local regulation.

This section shall be construed to supersede municipal or county regulation of the transfer of pistols.

[Ufatz]

Okay Tom.

Thanks for that.

Now we all know and it is at our discretion to conform or not to the requirements.

[Tom7227]

It seems to me that requiring ID or a transfer permit is pretty minimal and cuts way down on the chance of selling a firearm to a bad guy.

[SmilinBob]

Another option is to see if there are any FFL dealers that would be affordable to do it for you. This is a tricky one as the ATF uses the vague description of "engaged in the business" to define what is a dealer vs private sales person.

[Steve Foss]

Good Lord. Quoting a law that takes a legal expert to interpret has no value if there's no real explanation. I'll just go with what the sheriff's office said. Probably I'll reach out to my own sheriff's office just to verify what the first two Tom-Toms said.

How many Toms can reply to this topic anyway? Isn't there some HSO regulation limiting the number of Toms in a single thread?

[Tom7227]

OK, I will try and simplify it. I quoted the law as in the past there have been some concerns about the soundness of my shorthand answers.

A person who wants to buy a pistol is supposed to get a transfer permit, commonly known as a purchase permit. The permit is required if you are buying from a dealer but not from a private seller. A carry permit works for a tranfer.

A private seller is required to write down the person's ID info. Although not specified I would suggest that a MN DL be the source of that info. I would also write down the make, model and serial number of the firearm. Finally I would write up a simple receipt and demand that the buyer sign it.

If you only take the minimum required steps you don't have enough info to know whether the buyer is a prohibited person - a person who cannot legally possess a pistol. I personally would not sell a firearm to anyone without that person having either a transfer or carry permit. Just my stand on the subject.