Sheriffs shuting down all public launches?!

[LMITOUT]

Good. Open the gates and let them all go out. Maybe if they get wet and cold they'll think next time.

[muskE]

But hey, he didn't go "through" he went "in."

[Finns]

This law has been on the books for (nearl 20 years and just now some people are getting a little testy?

86B.106 BARRING VEHICLES FROM UNSAFE ICE.

(a) Whenever ice conditions on a body of water deteriorate to such an extent that there is

substantial danger to persons using motorized vehicles, including snowmobiles and all-terrain

vehicles, the sheriff of the county where the body of water is located may prohibit or restrict the

use of motorized vehicles on all or a portion of the body of water. If the body of water is located

in more than one county, all counties involved must coordinate any prohibitions or restrictions

that are imposed. A county sheriff acting under this section shall, as soon as practicable, post all

common access sites and publicize the prohibitions or restrictions. The commissioner must be

notified immediately and may review and suspend any restrictions imposed. Restrictions may be

lifted as soon as conditions warrant.

( A person may not operate a motorized vehicle in violation of a prohibition or restriction

imposed under this section.

© This section does not apply to a person who:

(1) is a member of a sanctioned circuit watercross association and can provide proof of

membership;

(2) operates a snowmobile with a silenced exhaust and is practicing for a sanctioned event;

and

(3) receives written permission from a conservation officer who must set the date, time,

and location of the practice.

History: 1992 c 584 s 1; 1Sp2001 c 2 s 90

[flipper]

This is the first time in memory that this has occurred as a "blanket" prohibition on all lakes within a county. The sheriff must think people are not capable of any rational thought or, at a minimum, he is making an effort to produce people who cannot think for themselves.

[Connan]

plenty of stupid people out there, Ha. last week i saw some lady who tried to drive onto the ice, only problem was the ice was melted the first few feet near shore. Now there was another area like 500 feet down the shore where the ice was frozen up to shore allowing a car to drive onto the ice, but instead she got her car stuck in the sand/water. Ha.

[Dave S]

This is the first time in memory that this has occurred as a "blanket" prohibition on all lakes within a county. The sheriff must think people are not capable of any rational thought or, at a minimum, he is making an effort to produce people who cannot think for themselves.

It only takes a few to represent the whole. Doesn't mean it's an accurate assessment. The Sheriff doesn't know one person's abilities compared to the next. IMO they've acted appropriately.

My apologies for the continuing of the dead horse beating.

[Finns]

X2 for both your statements!

[Kyhl]

A couple last comments.

First, I am not sure if those that are using the word "Darwinism" in this friendly debate are sure of its meaning. Darwinism can also be referred to as "survival of the fittest". This is not the same thing as "nature weeding out the stupid" which I think is what you may really mean.

For example, if this was Darwinism, and a certain subgroup of the population kept driving out and falling through the ice over the next millions and millions of years - it wouldn't necessarily mean they would disappear from the earth. It might actually mean they would adapt and evolve to the situation. They might grow gills or fins to swim once they fell through the ice and thus become even better suited for these poor ice conditions.

Or, on the opposite side of the coin, there is an easy case to be made that as a race, humans are de-evolving due to the number of protections that are in place.

[Kyhl]

Wait everyone here hates this law but think everyone driving out is stupid and they would never drive out anyways? Then who cares...it has no affect on you

That's funny.

But, I don't need a weatherman to tell me if it's raining either.

[TruthWalleyes]

Darwinism can also be referred to as "survival of the fittest". This is not the same thing as "nature weeding out the stupid" which I think is what you may really mean.

Your right....

Uh, wait:

So your saying A glass half full is NOT the same as a glass half empty

[CrappieNight]

Well put, Truth!

[DaSwede]

I keep seeing people post things like, "I don't need them to tell me it's unsafe. I'm not stupid." You know what? I believe you. You aren't stupid enough to do it. You know what else? There are a lot of people who are.

I think back to one of our big downpour rains a couple years ago. I was driving out to work down a gravel road and came up to a deputy in an Expedition blocking the road. I could clearly see that the road had been washed out. There's no way I would have driven through it, even in my F150. I asked, "People are dumb enough to try and drive through that?" He just gave me the look that said, "Why do you think I'm sitting here all day?" I just nodded and backed up.

So why is this any different than that? It's not "the man" telling me I'm stupid or taking my rights to drive down that road away. It's about public safety. And people are stupid. And when people are stupid, they put rescue workers in danger...especially on ice. That's stupid.

[mallardnwalleye]

If it is such a wise decision that Hennepin County shut down vehicle traffic on lakes-why aren't you all trying to get the whole southern half of Minnesota to be shut down? Would that be wise, as places further south are in much worse shape? Again, there is no logic arguing that the decision was based on facts. I am not saying that they do not have the (written law) legal authority. I am saying that this shutdown was

1. Rash and unplanned.

2. Not based on evidence of an actual increased risk- only percieved.

3. The conditions out on area lakes do not differ from what they are early and late in the year and we have in the past accepted those risk levels.

4. This is an unusual and unprecedented step that may set the tone in the future.

5. We need to raise a stink otherwise we will see this freedom of ice driving slowly be taken away as it already has.

6. ATV's and Sleds have a much higher rate of death. If you are for the shutdown of Vehicles this year than it would follow that you are for a ATV and sled shutdown as well. You would also be for a early and late shutdown as well.

Again-There are only an average number of ice deaths this year and 0 vehicle deaths. It is safe in most but not all areas. There is 14-16 inches in most places please drive

[flipper]

I keep seeing people post things like, "I don't need them to tell me it's unsafe. I'm not stupid." You know what? I believe you. You aren't stupid enough to do it. You know what else? There are a lot of people who are.

I think back to one of our big downpour rains a couple years ago. I was driving out to work down a gravel road and came up to a deputy in an Expedition blocking the road. I could clearly see that the road had been washed out. There's no way I would have driven through it, even in my F150. I asked, "People are dumb enough to try and drive through that?" He just gave me the look that said, "Why do you think I'm sitting here all day?" I just nodded and backed up.

So why is this any different than that? It's not "the man" telling me I'm stupid or taking my rights to drive down that road away. It's about public safety. And people are stupid. And when people are stupid, they put rescue workers in danger...especially on ice. That's stupid.

Did they close down every road in your county because of one bad spot?

[Kyhl]

There is 14-16 inches in most places please drive

I don't know about that. The metro lake I was on yesterday had 13 inches.

And there were full size trucks on it. Not mine though.

[IamZombie]

Just gotta laugh at all the lazy people getting angry because 1 county in 87 said you can't drive out on the the lakes.

More fish for the rest of us.

[flipper]

Not everyone that is against government overstretching its reach is lazy.

[CrappieNight]

This is the same path that so many companies have traveled regarding frivolous lawsuits based on bad consumer choices. Do you agree with the woman be awarded ridiculous amounts of money because she burned herself with hot coffee because she wasn't informed that her hot coffee could burn her?

Wake up people!

[whos_on_first]

I am saying that this shutdown was

2. Not based on evidence of an actual increased risk- only percieved.

I thought I saw a list in the report that listed how many vehicels went through in a couple weeks before the decision was made. To me that was evidence of an actual increased risk. I don't ever remember a year where this many vehicles went through the ice...ever. I'd say theat is an increased RISK...not deaths...RISK.

And in all reality, have we ever had a year this easy for walking on the ice? And are there really that many lakes in Hennipen county that you can't walk across?

[TKOGWEE]

Websters dictionary definition of the word CONSISTENCY:

1. Agreement between things, acts, or statements; logical connection.

2. Agreement with previous acts, statements, or decisions.

3. Conforming to a single set of principles, or to previous action or belief.

Consistency is whats makes, I believe, a persons word worth taking to heart.

So, for all of you that agree with the law man keeping vehicles off the lake (because there will be more fish for me, or ya'll are just lazy and a bunch of cry babies) better remain consistent with your views posted. Let me explain. To be consistent, you would need to agree with prohibiting watercraft from large waters when the wind exceeds 15 mph (your boat may capsize), and when it snows, no vehicles on the roads until they are cleared (you could slide around the roadway and kill someone). I could go on for a long time.

What value does a mans word have if they are not consistent?

[TruthWalleyes]

Everyone at our company now has to wear a cut proof glove when using a knife, and we were given some pretty dumb knives to use as well....ALL BECAUSE 1 INDIVIDUAL DROPPER THE KNIFE AND STABBED HERSELF WHEN TRYING TO CATCH IT MID DROP.

Now when using a knife, we must all use the proper knife, and safety gloves.. Dumbing down of america.

8-12" in my area of the state. Points, bars, current areas have significantly less than other areas.

[CrappieNight]

The perceived risk is based on people driving over pressure ridges, through or near channels and creek mouths. There is a picture of a truck through on Buffalo this year within yards of thin ice signs, that is the perceived risk, not actual, the ice didn't catch him by surprise and suddenly give way by a freakish anomaly, a truck dropped through at a channel on Tonka while another HSO member posted that he monitored the ice and warned people of the danger, yet, someone still went through. Freakish anomaly? Nope! Perceived risk, not actual.

[Slabasaurus]

Websters dictionary definition of the word CONSISTENCY:

1. Agreement between things, acts, or statements; logical connection.

2. Agreement with previous acts, statements, or decisions.

3. Conforming to a single set of principles, or to previous action or belief.

Consistency is whats makes, I believe, a persons word worth taking to heart.

So, for all of you that agree with the law man keeping vehicles off the lake (because there will be more fish for me, or ya'll are just lazy and a bunch of cry babies) better remain consistent with your views posted. Let me explain. To be consistent, you would need to agree with prohibiting watercraft from large waters when the wind exceeds 15 mph (your boat may capsize), and when it snows, no vehicles on the roads until they are cleared (you could slide around the roadway and kill someone). I could go on for a long time.

What value does a mans word have if they are not consistent?

Consistency? In the USA?

HA!

So, you think this winter has been typical? You haven't noticed an increase in the number of vehicles through the ice in the last 2 weeks?

When the city of Minneapolis starts enforcing their "nobody on the ice until the parks superintendent declares it safe," I'm not going to think this is a "sky is falling" fleecing of our rights privileges.

The state shuts down roads for special weather conditions (blizzards and floods).

This winter has been a special one. It's a statistical anomaly.

Why should the county not be able to make a special regulation for a special weather situation?

I think that's consistent...

Besides. 8 car through the ice calls they responded to in 8 days or something like that? yeah. They probably wanted to do something so that they could spend their time and resources elsewhere.

[IamZombie]

Not everyone that is against government overstretching its reach is lazy.

They aren't over stretching, there was already a law on the books.

Someone posted it earlier.

[whos_on_first]

the ice didn't catch him by surprise and suddenly give way by a freakish anomaly,

I bet he'd argue differently!