NASCAR today

[harvey lee]

I wonder at times what NASCAR could do to get the fans and interest back into the cup racing.

I realize that when the Big E died, so did NASCAR to some degree.

I wonder if NASCAR went back to the racing of 20 years ago with the rules and let these guys race if it would be better?

I would like to see all have to qualify and no guarantee for a top 35 spot. You get in on the race of your qualifing time. Get ride of the Chase and lets count the whole year. Yes, we can have a chase and do the final 10 races but who will pick the tracks and then who do they favor?

I would keep the safer barriers and go back to the car they ran a few years ago instead of the COT car and then make them a bit safer.

Then, if one or two teams find something that makes their car faster, then NASCAR has to change the rules so the other cars can go faster or they slow the fast ones down. Thats not racing.

If a few teams cannot aford the racing or simply cannot keep up, then NASCAR cuts how much other teams can spend and how much then can test and so forth. Might as well be IROC racing.

Look at this week, they have changed the chassis rules 4-5 times to change the racing. Let's just go racing and forget all the other ways to try and change how the race will be run or the outcome.

Using any driver as an example, you win the pole and then in practice you have an accident, then you have to start in the back. These are dumb rules to say the least. Why not have the guy who earned the spot with the fastest car start on the front row???

Then, you can only have so many tires and only test so much. If we put any more rules in place, it will be like watching paint dry.

Now, just maybe we could have racing of years ago and a bit safer. I believe we would see some much better good ol racing.

Doubt this will ever happen and racing will continue to die off at the NASCAR level.

Years ago I never missed a race and now I watch maybe a third of them. I would rather go dirt track racing where there is at least some good racing action.

[Double D]

Harvey, I agree with much of what you said (which I usually do).

I just read an article on Yahoo that was interesting and I also agree with. I think for at least the next couple days, this was the right guy to have win this race. Somebody new, and it sure sounds like he is an upstanding young man. If one of the regular drivers won, there would not be near the coverage that is going on tonight. All the networks are climbing on top of each other to get at him and you will see him everywhere at least until Wednesday. Read my other post about Dale Earnhardt and you will see why a new winner with an old team just may be the spark to renew some interest in this.

Now that being said, they still can't let them run around like a dirt track chain-up race when they go back in July. At least cars chained together can't wreck their partner.

DD

[PurpleFloyd]

First off I would axe the Chase and have one continuous season. Then I would take a look at having maybe a max of 2 cars to a team so that there is a more dynamic field of owners and set a max budget for R and D to even things out a bit.

Then I would like to see a crapload of the rules thrown out the window and simplify the whole thing instead of trying to micromanage every little detail.

They are trying to make things too uniform and IMO it is better with more variety from car manufacturers to body styles to tires.

[LMITOUT]

Using any driver as an example, you win the pole and then in practice you have an accident, then you have to start in the back. These are dumb rules to say the least. Why not have the guy who earned the spot with the fastest car start on the front row???

Um, because they would have an advantage of having a fresh car with a new engine, transmission, etc, etc.

The rule of starting from the rear if you wreck your qualifying car isn't new and has been around for quite some time.

[harvey lee]

There are many accidents that take out a pole sitter or another that are of no fault of their own.

It does not always have to be a drive train part.

No advanyage Dan with a back up car unless the advantage is for the other guy

I believe I stated a accident in my post and not a blown engine Dan. Pleas reread my post.

[Gordie]

I wonder at times what NASCAR could do to get the fans and interest back into the cup racing.

I realize that when the Big E died, so did NASCAR to some degree.

I wonder if NASCAR went back to the racing of 20 years ago with the rules and let these guys race if it would be better?

This would Draw my total intrest back into the sport as I used o love watching them Race and just go in a circle

[spearchucker]

First off I would axe the Chase and have one continuous season. Then I would take a look at having maybe a max of 2 cars to a team so that there is a more dynamic field of owners and set a max budget for R and D to even things out a bit.

Then I would like to see a crapload of the rules thrown out the window and simplify the whole thing instead of trying to micromanage every little detail.

They are trying to make things too uniform and IMO it is better with more variety from car manufacturers to body styles to tires.

How can you say you want to put budget and team rules in place to even things out and then in the next sentence say things are too uniform and need more variety?

I started watching less NASCAR when they put the rear-end gear limits in place to regulate engine RPM. Before this is was great watching someone try to turn 10,000 RPM without blowing up instead of everyone running the same RPM. Then they put all the shock rules in place and started the COT. Now they call a caution for every little piece of tape or rubber on the track to tighten things up. I still watch, but not as much as I did 8-10 years ago.

[jdfisherman]

Has anyone seen a comparison of championship winners using both the old rules and the new chase rules for the same season? I know that Kenseth won the last champoinship under the old rules, but wouldn't have if they were using the chase rules. Similarly, Kurt Busch won the first championship under the chase rules, but wouldn't have won using the old rules. I'm curious to see how old vs chase rules have affected the outcome of the championship.

[LMITOUT]

There are many accidents that take out a pole sitter or another that are of no fault of their own.

[pureinsanity]

Your post was quite clear, but this rule has been around for some time now. A fresh car is a fresh car. Why should someone who runs the snot out of their car all week be allowed to use a fresh one for the race?

Not sure why that is so difficult for you to understand.

Who is to say they don't use a fresh car regardless. You would never know. Isn't the cars rebuilt after every race anyway. wouldn't that be the same thing as a fresh car?

I am unsure as I do not watch nascar and don't know many of the rules.

[pureinsanity]

Won't nascar going on a diet cutting carbs and resorting to fuel injection bring back the fans?

This will allow teams to make more power, use less fuel, and the engines will be more responsive across the RPM range. Guess that "fresh" car will have more advantage more than ever now.

[harvey lee]

They have fresh cars every race. If not brand new, they bring a car nback that has done well and it has been all gone through.

I am not going to play your game Lmit.

[pureinsanity]

They have fresh cars every race. If not brand new, they bring a car nback that has done well and it has been all gone through.

I am not going to play your game Lmit.

I wouldn't either. I learned a while ago what limit says is right no matter what anyone says.

[LMITOUT]

Has anyone seen a comparison of championship winners using both the old rules and the new chase rules for the same season? I know that Kenseth won the last champoinship under the old rules, but wouldn't have if they were using the chase rules. Similarly, Kurt Busch won the first championship under the chase rules, but wouldn't have won using the old rules. I'm curious to see how old vs chase rules have affected the outcome of the championship.

"Classic" 2010 Sprint Cup Driver Points Standings:

rank, car#, driver, points, behind

1) #29-Kevin Harvick, 5274

2) #48-Jimmie Johnson, 4989, -285 CHASE CHAMP

3) #11-Denny Hamlin, 4865, -409

4) #99-Carl Edwards, 4820, -454

5) #24-Jeff Gordon, 4669, -605

6) #18-Kyle Busch, 4647, -627

7) #17-Matt Kenseth, 4640, -634

8) #14-Tony Stewart, 4628, -646

9) #2-Kurt Busch, 4459, -815

10) #31-Jeff Burton, 4423, -851

11) #16-Greg Biffle, 4414, -860

12) #33-Clint Bowyer, 4376, -898

13) #5-Mark Martin, 4364, -910

14) #1-Jamie McMurray, 4325, -949

"Classic" 2009 Sprint Cup Series Points Standings

1) #48-Jimmie Johnson (X), 5156 [7 wins] CHASE CHAMP

2) #24-Jeff Gordon (X), 5090, -66 [1 win]

3) #14-Tony Stewart (X), 5085, -71 [4 wins]

4) #11-Denny Hamlin (X), 4806, -350 [4 wins]

5) #5-Mark Martin (X), 4762, -394 [5 wins]

6) #2-Kurt Busch (X), 4758, -398 [2 wins]

7) #16-Greg Biffle (X), 4541, -615

8) #42-Juan Pablo Montoya (X), 4503, -653

9) #18-Kyle Busch, 4457, -699 [4 wins]

10) #39-Ryan Newman (X), 4447, -709

11) #99-Carl Edwards (X), 4398, -758

12) #17-Matt Kenseth, 4389, -767 [2 wins]

13) #9-Kasey Kahne (X), 4388, -768 [2 wins]

14) #33-Clint Bowyer, 4359, -797

15) #00-David Reutimann, 4221, -935 [1 win]

16) #83-Brian Vickers (X), 4122, -1034 [1 win]

"Classic" 2008 Points Standings

1) #99-Carl Edwards 5236 [9 wins]

2) #48-Jimmie Johnson 5220 -16 [7 wins] CHASE CHAMP

3) #18-Kyle Busch 4984 -252 [8 wins]

4) #16-Greg Biffle 4747 -489 [2 wins]

5) #31-Jeff Burton 4709 -527 [2 wins]

6) #29-Kevin Harvick 4691 -545

7) #88-Dale Earnhardt Jr. 4605 -631 [1 win]

8) #24-Jeff Gordon 4537 - 699

9) #20-Tony Stewart 4487 -749 [1 win]

10) #07-Clint Bowyer 4487 - 749 [1 win]

11) #11-Denny Hamlin 4439 -797 [1 win]

12) #17-Matt Kenseth 4316 -920

13) #6-David Ragan 4299 -937

14) #9-Kasey Kahne 4085 -1151 [2 wins]

"Classic" 2007 Points Standings

1) #24-Jeff Gordon 5455

2) #48-Jimmie Johnson 5102, -353 CHASE CHAMP

3) #20-Tony Stewart 4749

4) #17-Matt Kenseth 4718

5) #11-Denny Hamlin 4623

6) #5-Kyle Busch 4585

7) #99-Carl Edwards 4574

8) #07-Clint Bowyer 4556

9) #31-Jeff Burton 4549

10) #2-Kurt Busch 4371

11) #29-Kevin Harvick 4344

12) #1-Martin Truex Jr. 4314

13) #12-Ryan Newman 4046

14) #16-Greg Biffle 3991

15) #25-Casey Mears 3949

16) #8-Dale Earnhardt Jr. 3929

"Classic" 2006 Points Standings

1) #48-Jimmie Johnson 5158 CHASE CHAMP

2) #17-Matt Kenseth, 5154, -4

3) #29-Kevin Harvick, 4838, -320

4) #20-Tony Stewart, 4727, -431

5) #11-Denny Hamlin, 4725, -433

6) #8-Dale Earnhardt Jr., 4641, -517

7) #24-Jeff Gordon, 4567, -591

8) #31-Jeff Burton, 4535, -623

9) #9-Kasey Kahne, 4497, -661

10) #6-Mark Martin, 4484, -674

11) #99-Carl Edwards, 4428, -730

12) #5-Kyle Busch, 4416, -742

13) #16-Greg Biffle, 4075, -1083

"Classic" 2005 Points Standings

1) #20-Tony Stewart, 5199 CHASE CHAMP

2) #16-Greg Biffle, 4984, -215

3) #48-Jimmie Johnson, 4771, -428

4) #6-Mark Martin, 4676, -523

5) #99-Carl Edwards, 4597, -602

6) #2-Rusty Wallace, 4512, -687

7) #17-Matt Kenseth, 4451, -748

8) #12-Ryan Newman, 4409, -790

9) #19-Jeremy Mayfield, 4281, -918

10) #97-Kurt Busch, 4248, -951

11) #24-Jeff Gordon, 4174, -1025

12) #42-Jamie McMurray, 4130, -1069

13) #38-Elliott Sadler, 4084, -1115

14) #29-Kevin Harvick, 4072, -1127

15) #88-Dale Jarrett, 3960, -1239

"Classic" 2004 Points Standings

1) #24-Jeff Gordon 5042

2) #48-Jimmie Johnson 4995 -47

3) #8-Dale Earnhardt Jr. 4869 -173

4) #97-Kurt Busch 4795 -247 CHASE CHAMP

5) #20-Tony Stewart 4701 -341

6) #6-Mark Martin 4597 -445

7) #42-Jamie McMurray 4597 -445

8) #17-Matt Kenseth 4376 -666

9) #12-Ryan Newman 4361 -681

10) #38-Elliott Sadler 4315 -727

11) #18-Bobby Labonte 4277 -765

12) #9-Kasey Kahne* 4274 -768

13) #29-Kevin Harvick 4228 -814

14) #88-Dale Jarrett 4214 -828

[gregg52]

ya this goes back to

knaus would have ran the team different and raced different

it is what it is

[spearchucker]

Has anyone seen a comparison of championship winners using both the old rules and the new chase rules for the same season? I know that Kenseth won the last champoinship under the old rules, but wouldn't have if they were using the chase rules. Similarly, Kurt Busch won the first championship under the chase rules, but wouldn't have won using the old rules. I'm curious to see how old vs chase rules have affected the outcome of the championship.

It wouldn't have affected anything because you race to the rules in place. Teams would have raced different had different rules been in effect. This is apples and oranges.

[spearchucker]

Who is to say they don't use a fresh car regardless. You would never know. Isn't the cars rebuilt after every race anyway. wouldn't that be the same thing as a fresh car?

I am unsure as I do not watch nascar and don't know many of the rules.

They can't change cars or engines between qualifying and the race. The same car and engine must be used. In the past they used a qualifying engine and then switched to the race engine for the race. Rules state if you go to a backup car or change engines you have to go to the back of the field. Plain and simple. If you let the officials decide whether it was the drivers fault and if they should go to the back of the pack it would open a can of worms. The rules need to be black and white as much as possible.

[harvey lee]

I realize that spear. I am saying they should be able to change cars if someone else took them out in pratice and the crash was not their fault.

Thats all, nothing about anything else.

[spearchucker]

I realize that spear. I am saying they should be able to change cars if someone else took them out in pratice and the crash was not their fault.

Thats all, nothing about anything else.

Then you have a judgement call by the officials as to who's fault the wreck was. This isn't a new rule, this has been a rule for a long time.

[candiru]

Cookie-cutter cars, cookie-cutter tracks, cookie-cutter drivers, cookie-cutter interviews. Too dang many commercials. At least some of these races are too dang long. Too much charm school for these drivers.

It is also been getting to have the feel of reality TV with manufactured drama. (questionable cautions, chases, and points system manipulation) Manufactured drama is not drama!

[spearchucker]

I DVR the races now. I don't have 4 hours to watch a race. Maybe I have ADD or something.

[harvey lee]

Spear, I never said it was a new rule but I did say they should consider changing it. Yes, I know it has to be a call made but most all are. With replays, one can see without a doubt who was at fault. Not hard to do.

[candiru]

I do not understand why they took a race away from Atlanta. That is one track that seems to consistantly produce good races, even with the car they are using now. I believe Rockingham is usable. I would rather see them race there than a second race at some of these other tracks.

[spearchucker]

Rockingham used to have some of the best races of the year. Every race was within a car length. Remember Craven and Busch sliding off the last turn side by side with smoke and sparks flying off both cars?

NASCAR got greedy and started giving the bigger tracks more races and taking away from the smaller ones because they could sell more tickets at the bigger ones. I think it has kind of bitten them now.

[gregg52]

exactly alanta couldnt draw neither could rockingham its the god

o'lmighty buck to the Frances

altough i dont think going to kentucky will hurt things for awhile they will draw good

they should maybe open more tracks around the country and go to them every other year or something