Braid knots

[Raider4ever]

Started frogging this summer and now I am hooked (Unfortunately, most of the fish that blow it are not.). I want to use braid on the rod. Only problem was my last experience with braided line left lots to be desired, especially breakoffs with spinnerbaits. I'm guessing it was a knot issue. So, what are some of the best knots to go from braid to lure? Braid is only going to be on my frog rod and I'm not messing around with fluro leaders or stuff like that. Thanks

[blakjack23]

I have been using a palomar knot on my braid for the past two years and have had pretty much zero knot issues.

[RK]

Hiya -

I've used a Uni-knot with braid since I started using the stuff (and on Dacron before that). Never had a knot failure, and it's easy to tie.

Palomar is also a good one.

As far as braid break-offs, one thing to keep in mind if you're not used to using it is that with zero stretch comes zero ability to absorb shock. When superlines first came out I know a lot of muskie guys that used 30# braid because they used to use 36# dacron. They'd snap it off just casting sometimes. A heavy lure stopping short, or a hookset on a short line, can generate more than enough force to break braid. When we switched to 60# or 80# braid the break-offs went away.

Look more at the diameter than the break strength, and be sure to use something that can take the shock. It's a lot easier to break 15# braid than 15# mono frankly, just because of the stretch of mono. I use 50# braid for slop fishing/flipping, and there are a lot of guys that use heavier yet.

HTH.

Cheers,

Rob Kimm

[wormdunker]

I have been using Spectra/Kevlar braids since they were first introduced in the late 980's early 90's (at least introduced in the fishing world by major mfg.s) The first company was Western Filament now known as Tuf-line. The mfgs claimed the product would revolutionize fishing due to the lines characteristics. Shortly after Stren came out with a kevlar product. I worked in the industry and in order to be absolutely certain the product held water we hired a testing lab. Additionally we fashioned our own test lab with a digital scale and thread stretching apparatus. We learned a lot but I recall the Spectra Fiber beat Kevlar and the Palomar knot always tested as the best knot. We also learned that if you really want to add extra security in your palomar knot try doubling the line used. In other words when starting the palomar instead of doubling your line back once and threading 2 strands through the eye, start with twice as much line and double it back twice. You will have to thread 4 strands though the hook eye and manage 4 strands through the tying process but I guarantee you will have a bullet proof knot. The 4 strand palomar provides more cushion within the knot than 2 strand palomar. It was always believed that the only reason a knot would break was because the kevlar/spectra would actually cut into itself. Having more product within the knot provides insulation from this. The Double palomar works great for topwater bass fishing and Muskie leader tying. I have used single strand with nearly ever lb test Powerpro for as long as it has been available and have never had a knot fail. Hope this helps.

[Fever]

I too recomend the Double Palomer knot when using braid. I almost exclusively use Power pro ranging from 15 lb up to 65 lb on my spinning and on nearly all my baitcasters. Dependingo n the gauge of your eye on your frog u may want to put a touch of super glue on the knot. I've found that the heavier gauaged hook eyes allow knot slippage even after you sinch it down. Also remember to lubricate your double palomer before you sinch it down... Anyway... So, go to the hardware store, buy some super glue that has the brush applicator and I bet ya anymoney that your knot issues are resolved for good. I don't always do this but I do when fishing in my league and or any tournaments (for money) and have never had a double palomer knot fail after touching the knot lightly with a super glue application. Hope this helps. good luck to you!

[Raider4ever]

Hey Everybody,

Thank you so much for all your help with both the knot issue, the glue tip, and what to look for in the line itself. It is greatly appreciated. I will be practicing the Double Palomar as soon as I get the reel spooled. Thanks again.

[slipperybob]

It's very easy to slip in some 20# mono into the Palomar knot to use as a cushion. In fact, you can do it to just about any knot and you will see huge improvements in knot holding strength. It's worth the hassle. My only problem is getting things hung up and unable to break the line. So it goes back to the plain Palomar knot, becuase it's the most consitent knot to break line at the knot.

[Jig Master]

does anyone have a link that visually demonstrates the double palomar knot? I've broken a few frogs off on the hookset and think this will help.

Thanks!!

[wormdunker]

I will take a crack at this. Just double the line back one time about 18" then double it back again. You will have 9" of 4 strands of line to tie the knot. Insert the 2 u shaped ends (opposite the end leading to your rod) through the hook eye, tie an over hand knot with all 4 strands and slip your frog though 2 loops (as opposed to one loop in a standard palomar) Wet the line and cinch it together

[bobbymalone]

have you heard of this google thing? It's pretty cool. I used to find this:

[bucketmouth64]

I use braid and had no issues using regular palomar until this year. I was losing worm hooks on snags/hook sets. Then I asked Deitz about gamagatsu's superline worm hook and to find out that braided line could slip thru the eyelet opening on a regular hook and their superline hook has the eyelet closed(soldered). I believe this was my problem and I never had this problem until now. Next time I was on the water I moved my line around an eyelet and behold the braided line slipped thru the opening. I will now try to tie the double palomar knot and see if it makes a difference.

If I use mono do I cut off a length of mono and tie regular palomar knot with the two lines together?

[Cecil]

A couple solutions to that gap in the hook.

Tie any knot with mono onto that hook, trim all ends and then slide it over the gap in the hook. I usually do a few before I start the day.

Other option is to solder them up yourself.

[TonkaBass]

Started frogging this summer and now I am hooked (Unfortunately, most of the fish that blow it are not.). I want to use braid on the rod. Only problem was my last experience with braided line left lots to be desired, especially breakoffs with spinnerbaits. I'm guessing it was a knot issue. So, what are some of the best knots to go from braid to lure? Braid is only going to be on my frog rod and I'm not messing around with fluro leaders or stuff like that. Thanks

I have always used a palomar as most have already said, and never had an issue. I would however suggest you give a flouro leader a try as it is well worth the minimal effort it takes to rig. Tie a 2 foot length of flouro to your main line braid using a blood knot. I have tried a bunch of different knots to attach the leader and the blood seems to hold up the best. Be sure to always wet your knot as well. Don't use a flouro leader where you don't need to though, it is just another link to go bad sometimes.

[TonkaBass]

A couple solutions to that gap in the hook.

Tie any knot with mono onto that hook, trim all ends and then slide it over the gap in the hook. I usually do a few before I start the day.

Other option is to solder them up yourself.

The superline gammy with the ring attached to the eyelet is also an option.

[mainbutter]

I use a uni-knot for EVERYTHING. I've tried palomar knots and everything else, but uni-knots never fail me and I tie them easiest.

To the OP:

What lb test are you using?? I just want to emphasize this..

THE WHOLE POINT OF USING BRAID IS TO GO OVERBOARD ON LINE STRENGTH. It's got such a small diameter, you might as well go with at least 30lb test. If you're going for thin line because you want something less visible, you're better off with light mono or fluoro and keep that drag adjusted for it.