Cliff Lee

[Scott K]

Quote:

Sources tell Tom Pelissero of ESPN Twin Cities that the Twins are considering making "a serious run" at acquiring left-hander Cliff Lee from the Mariners.

The Twins would likely have to give up two premium prospects for what would essentially be a rental, something that would be highly-uncharacteristic for the franchise. Still, any general manager of a contending team should be doing their due diligence in regards a possible acquisition of Lee. Ultimately, we'd be surprised if the team would be willing to surrender a top prospect like Wilson Ramos. A more aggressive team is likely to come knocking.

Source: ESPN1500.com

Related: Twins

This would be nice! But I have my doubts!

[Scott K]

I wouldnt mind, if they would lock him up for a long term deal.

[DonBo]

The Twins will NEVER give up any of their prospects for a top line player for one half of a season. Dream all you want, but this is not gonna happen.

[Harmonica Bear]

My thoughts exactly.

[Coach1310]

The reason this situation is a bit different is IF we trade for him AND he walks, we get 2 first round compensatory draft picks next year because he is a Type A free agent...

I can't see them giving up something like Ramos AND Hicks/Revere, but we'll see...

My feeling is that without a guy like Lee, the Twins will do the same thing they always do... make an early playoff exit

[zepman]

I wouldnt mind, if they would lock him up for a long term deal.

At least for a few years. Let Cuddy go and free up some space...Ramos is expendable as he's backing up Joe.

I wouldn't do it for a half a season though.

[mrklean]

renting him for half a season is all we would do no way they would spend the cash to keep him

[Scott K]

I dont forsee the Twins going short or long term for him.

[jwmiller33]

The Twins will NEVER give up any of their prospects for a top line player for one half of a season. Dream all you want, but this is not gonna happen.

your completely right DonBo... anyone who knows the twins and the strategy of their management, this is something that is COMPLETELY against what we have historically done year after year... regardless, cliff lee is one of the best pitchers in the game, and has been for the last few years... i had him on my fantasy team last year and LOVED his consistent outings.. he always goes deep into games, and going 8 or 9 innings is done at least once every 2 or 3 starts. i have been trying to trade for him on my fantasy squad all year and the guy who has him is driving a tough bargain!

i'd LOVE to see clifford lee in a twinkies jersey!

you guys know he doesnt ice his arm after games?! he is old school!

[thatoneguy]

The Twins will NEVER give up any of their prospects for a top line player for one half of a season. Dream all you want, but this is not gonna happen.

That's a totally inaccurate way to look at it. They're not giving up a prospect(s) for half a season of Lee or Oswalt, they're giving up a prospect(s) for a half-season of a pitcher that GREATLY improves their chances to reach the postseason and actually win a series or two PLUS two first-round picks if he leaves in the offseason.

Any non-Yankee team's legitimate window at winning the World Series is short. The Twins are one ace pitcher and maybe a RH bat away from being the best team in the AL - why the heck wouldn't they trade a prospect(s) (that they don't even know how they would pan out in the bigs) for a great shot at a title?

[zepman]

I agree. The Twins also have "new" ownership that seems more intent on getting things done...see Joe Mauer. Also, the Twins have already sold 3+ million tickets this year and when they were negotiating with Mauer, he may have been holding out a little longer to try and convince them that they not only need to sign him but bring in those players that will/can put them over the top.

I would not be suprised to see them pull the trigger on this.

[mskyfshntchr]

The Twins are one ace pitcher and maybe a RH bat away from being the best team in the AL - why the heck wouldn't they trade a prospect(s) (that they don't even know how they would pan out in the bigs) for a great shot at a title?

They need bulpen help more than starting pitching help in my mind if they are going to do anything in the playoffs. I have little faith in Guerrerier and a lot less in Crain. We need a right handed power arm in the bullpen to blow A-rod and the rest of the Yankees away in the playoffs.

[Willy]

They need bulpen help more than starting pitching help in my mind if they are going to do anything in the playoffs. I have little faith in Guerrerier and a lot less in Crain. We need a right handed power arm in the bullpen to blow A-rod and the rest of the Yankees away in the playoffs.

Twins have the second best bullpen ERA in the AL. In all reality, our bullpen is strong and one of our team strenths. However, I do agree a closer would be nice, then have Rauch setting up and then pretty soon after the 7th inning, the game can be over.

Cliff Lee is the best case scenario for the Twins, and I think you will see us make a strong push to get him. These are not the Twins of old. I expect a deal at the deadline and it will be for a player with plenty of worth.

Seattle is going to want at least 2 prospects, or a player and prospect for Lee. Lee is worth the 2 drafts picks, so the value to get him will have to exceed that.

I would not be surprised to see them flip any 2 of these players: Ramos, Revere, Slowey, Baker, or Blackburn.

IMO, it is worth it to gamble on this one. Lee would head up our rotation and make it super solid and tough to beat in the playoffs. Who knows, maybe they would make a push to resign him also.

[Coach1310]

They need bulpen help more than starting pitching help in my mind if they are going to do anything in the playoffs. I have little faith in Guerrerier and a lot less in Crain. We need a right handed power arm in the bullpen to blow A-rod and the rest of the Yankees away in the playoffs.

As much as I would like to see them add to the bullpen, to say they need that more than starting pitching is inaccurate. Our ENTIRE rotation is #3 starter type guys. They are consistent, but rarely dominant and to beat the Yanks or Rays you are going to have to get some dominant starts. Guerrier has done but produce over the last 3 years... His stuff doesn't look spectacular, but you can't argue his results... Rausch will be fine... he doesn't back down from anyone and he knows how to pitch. He is a very minimal problem in my opinion...

[Scott K]

I know this is old news, but the rumors are circulating, so I thought I would toss this out there.

Quote:

Trading Cliff Lee

Dave · June 14, 2010 at 11:34 pm · Filed Under Mariners

This post deals with where Lee might end up. If you’re interested in what his trade value is, check out this post at FanGraphs.

With the season basically over and focus shifting to the future, there’s one obvious big story left in this season – what will the Mariners get for Cliff Lee?

This is essentially the last drama of 2010 for Mariners fans. At some point in the next six weeks, the Mariners will trade Lee. Don’t buy into the smokescreen about keeping him around for the draft picks – at least one team will step up and make an offer that gives Jack Zduriencik significantly more value than he will get from keeping Lee and letting him walk at the end of the season.

Who will that team be? Well, the easiest way to guess is good old process of elimination. First, let’s throw out all the obvious non-contenders – that eliminates Baltimore, Kansas City, Cleveland, both Chicagos, Washington, Houston, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, and Arizona. Lee won’t be going to any of those teams.

Among the teams that are currently contenders, let’s cross off cities where Lee doesn’t make sense – Tampa Bay, Florida, Colorado, Cincinnati, Atlanta, San Diego, Toronto, Philadelphia, Oakland, and San Francisco fall into that category. If any of those teams are buyers in July, they’ll be buying someone else.

That leaves the teams that could potentially be interested in Lee – both New Yorks, Boston, Minnesota, Detroit, Texas, both Los Angeles’, and St. Louis. Those are your ten potential destinations for Cliff Lee.

So, who’s the best fit? Well, as we talked about last week, the Mariners have a lot of holes on their 2011 roster, and they don’t have a lot of ways to fill those holes with limited budget space this winter. The Lee trade is going to be their best bet to get a player or two who they can slide right into next year’s team, and who could be a productive player almost immediately. I don’t think the M’s are going to be hunting for a bevy of A-ball prospects in this deal, no matter what their upside is – the emphasis is going to be on getting someone (or a couple of someones) who can get to Seattle in a hurry.

That makes St. Louis pretty unlikely. They simply don’t have a high level premium prospect to give up that will make the Mariners pull the trigger. You could probably say the same about Detroit and the Los Angeles Dodgers. It’s tough to imagine any of those three teams being able to put together a package of players that the Mariners would really fall in love with. There are good prospects in each system, but they’re not the right kinds of prospects, and there aren’t enough of them.

Of the remaining six, I’d call Boston a pretty big longshot as well. Theo has consistently sat out of big pitcher sweepstakes, determining the cost was more than he wants to pay in young talent. The Red Sox farm system isn’t in great shape either, so their only hope to get Jack Z to listen would be to include someone like Casey Kelly, who they’ve been adamant that they’re not trading. Their pitching staff is pretty good anyway. I just don’t see it happening, though it potentially could, so they go to the bottom of the final six.

Coming in not too far ahead of the Red Sox in the longshot category would be both AL West teams – the Rangers and Angels. While both could really use Lee in their rotation and have the chips to make an interesting offer, inter-division trades of this magnitude are pretty rare. Teams are generally loathe to give their competitors players who can come back and hurt them long term. While both teams would love to have Lee, they don’t want their star prospects beating them 19 times a year for the next six years. It might not be rational, but it’s how baseball works, and it makes it unlikely that the M’s will deal Lee to another AL West team.

So now, we’re down to three – the New Yorks and Minnesota. Last week’s speculation from Ken Rosenthal about Lee’s eventual destination has made a lot of people assume that the Yankees are the favorites, but I’d make them the least likely of this trio, honestly. It’s fine and dandy to suggest that Lee would make any rotation better, and while its true, its less true with the Yankees than any other team in baseball. Right now, their playoff rotation is Sabathia-Burnett-Pettitte-Hughes. Yeah, they could put Lee in the rotation and bump Hughes back to the pen to strengthen their relief corps, but is that the kind of upgrade that is going to make a big enough difference for Brian Cashman to give up a blue chip prospect? And we haven’t even mentioned Javier Vazquez, whom the Yankees liked enough to give up one of their top young arms for this winter. They’re not just going to discard any chance of him pitching meaningful innings in November no matter how badly he started the season.

So, really, I see two teams that make sense on most levels – the Mets and the Twins.

The Mets have the glaring need, with only three big league starters on their roster and a GM whose job is almost certainly on the line. Omar Minaya has shown a willingness to give up a bushel of prospects for an arm he believes could put him over the top, as he did when he traded Lee (along with Grady Sizemore and Brandon Phillips) to Cleveland for Bartolo Colon. The Mets have spent a lot of money to try and win, and yet, they are one starting pitcher short of being a legitimate contender. Lee would give them a real chance at grabbing the NL East title and playing well in October. And in Jenrry Mejia, they have the kind of dynamic young pitching prospect who the Mariners would see as a valuable long term piece who could also potentially be part of the 2011 rotation. The Mets could put together a strong offer for Lee built around Mejia. There’s a potential deal to be made there.

However, if I’m Jack Zduriencik, I’m praying every night that the Twins get heavily involved. The fit is almost perfect.

Lee is everything the Twins love in a pitcher. They groom a never ending supply of strike throwers who get outs despite not having big velocity, and Lee is the quintessential version of that kind of arm. Paired with Francisco Liriano, the Twins become a lethal post-season team. And, they have what the 2011 Mariners need – young, cheap, major league ready starting pitching.

The Twins could create a package for Lee built around either Scott Baker or Kevin Slowey that would certainly pique the Mariners interest. Rather than getting a prospect that you hope develops into something, the Mariners would be able to slide either of them right into the middle of their rotation, filling a big hole on the 2011 roster but providing future value as well. In addition, the Twins have a quality young catching prospect named Wilson Ramos who doesn’t have a future in Minneapolis thanks to the presence of Joe Mauer, and while he’s not that much different than Adam Moore, he’d offer the M’s another option at a position that has been a huge problem since Jack got to Seattle. A package of Ramos and a second prospect, along with either Slowey or Baker, is the kind of deal that the Mariners simply couldn’t turn down.

The Twins have the depth to make that kind of move without crippling their future, and could capitalize on the primes of Mauer and Morneau with a legitimate World Series run with Cliff Lee in their rotation. It makes the most sense of any deal possible. Lee was made to pitch for the Twins, and they have exactly the kinds of players that the Mariners are going to want in return.

So, don’t be surprised if Lee ends up in pinstripes this fall, but not the Bronx version. Lee to Minnesota makes sense on a lot of levels, and you have to think that both teams see the same things we do. There’s a win-win deal here where both teams benefit, and that’s why I’d put Minnesota as the favorites to land Cliff Lee this summer.

[Scott K]

This is interesting, probably not true, but it would sure help us out this year.

Quote:

MLB Trade Rumor: Was Cliff Lee Nearly Traded To the Minnesota Twins?

The Minnesota Twins are tired of running headlong into the buzzsaw that is the New York Yankees. This is the team that has beaten the Twins in the playoffs three separate times during the managerial reign of Ron Gardenhire.

In their new 2010 Target Field, the Twins want to win the whole thing this season. They have a potent offense, led by three-time batting champion and 2009 MVP Joe Mauer and former MVP Justin Morneau.

They have the financial wherewithal with the new stadium and have upped their payroll already to $98 million, more than the Los Angeles Dodgers'. In addition, the Pohlad family, owners of the Twins franchise, are one of the wealthiest families in all of sports.

Yankees be darned!

Speaking with someone familiar with the situation (and verifying the initial conversation), the Twins traded for Cliff Lee last week, but the deal fell through. The primary player going to the Seattle Mariners, catcher Wilson Ramos , suffered a strained oblique during Saturday's game. Ramos is expected to miss seven to ten days .

Ramos was not yet placed on the seven-day minor league disabled list, keeping the trade possible. Unless the Commissioner's office signs off on the deal, players on the disabled list are usually ineligible to be traded. There must be an understanding that both teams know that player is on the disabled list.

The deal included Ramos, a Twins Major League-ready pitcher (believed to be left-handed reliever Brian Duensing ), and a low level minor league outfielder. The Mariners might be including a low level player, too.

Once Ramos gets clearance to play baseball again, this trade will again be made.

It appears that this deal heavily favors the Twins, as they would get one of the premier pitchers in baseball essentially for a young catcher their system sorely needs, a possible starting pitcher, and a filler.

If I were the Mariners, I would hold out (briefly, like a day) for 3B Danny Valencia , instead of the low level player, in addition to Ramos and Duensing.

This deal would give the Twins a very formidable starting rotation with Lee, Francisco Liriano, Kevin Slowey, Scott Baker, Carl Pavano, and Nick Blackburn.

Pavano, Baker, and Blackburn are without any type of innings limits. Slowey (91 innings pitched in 2009), and Liriano (138 innings pitched in 2009), are both coming off arm injuries and will likely be monitored for the rest of 2010.

In addition, Blackburn, who is signed through 2013 and is usually the team's most reliable starting pitcher, has had a very off year so far. His record is a respectable 6-4, but with a 5.80 ERA. We all know, however, that the pitchers' wins are more important.

The Twins staff already has five good starters, but Lee would fit in nicely in any team's rotation. As I write this, Lee just finished up another complete game , beating the Chicago Cubs 8-1 with nine strikeouts and ZERO walks.

It is Lee's fourth complete game this season.

He is now 6-3 with a 2.39 ERA and a 0.912 WHIP. He has struck out 76 batters in 86.2 innings, and he has walked only four batters.

Dontrelle Willis walked seven hitters in only two-plus innings last night.

Ramos is a good, young catcher but is blocked by Joe Mauer, making him expendable. Ramos came up to the majors earlier this season when Mauer was hurt and hit .296/.321 OBP/.407 SLG/.729 OPS with three doubles and an RBI in limited time.

However, he is struggling with the bat in Triple-A Rochester, hitting only .218 with four homers and 18 RBI.

That positive Major League time gave the Mariners an idea that he can be a good starting catcher. In fact, Ramos could step into a starting role right away.

Duensing is a 27-year-old left-handed pitcher who was squeezed out of the Twins rotation in 2010. He started nine games last season, including this gem over the rival Detroit Tigers, which helped lead the Twins into the playoffs.

Duensing was 5-1 as a starter down the stretch last year for the Twins.

Even though he has been great as a reliever this season (2-1, 1.88 ERA, 0.812 WHIP), and really tough against lefty hitters (.122 BA), I do expect the Mariners to convert Duensing back to a starting pitcher.

It is not enough of a haul for the Mariners, especially well before the trading deadline and with Lee pitching so well right now.

The Mariners are basically giving the American League Central division title to the Twins.

And that is bad new for the New York Yankees, Boston Red Sox, Los Angeles Angels, Texas Rangers, and any other possible American League playoff team which could face Lee in the 2010 playoffs.

[Coach1310]

I would rather it be Slowey or Blackburn heading over instead of Duensing. I think he has gotten the short straw.... he was great last year down the stretch, but it hasn't been good enough for the Twins brass to get him into the rotation... hopefully this happens sooner rather than later...

[Harmonica Bear]

I heard Gardy on Ruesse this afternoon and it sounded like Duensing is going to get a shot sooner than later, thats why they pitched him 3+ innings the other day.

Begs the question rotate a sstarter out of the rotation, or trade one. who should go? Who should sit?

[mrklean]

i would love to see lee here, i would rather see blackburn or baker go, baker is sinking it up this year and blackburn isnt much better, i think the story above is a buch of [PoorWordUsage] though just doesnt seem right we would have heard about that last week i would think

[Scott K]

i would love to see lee here, i would rather see blackburn or baker go, baker is sinking it up this year and blackburn isnt much better, i think the story above is a buch of [PoorWordUsage] though just doesnt seem right we would have heard about that last week i would think

I too think the source is full of hot air, and the article comes from a place that isn't very reliable. I did hear of this early week though.

[Coach1310]

i would love to see lee here, i would rather see blackburn or baker go, baker is sinking it up this year and blackburn isnt much better, i think the story above is a buch of [PoorWordUsage] though just doesnt seem right we would have heard about that last week i would think

The only thing with Baker is he CAN throw it by guys. He has a little more margin for error than Blackburn. If Blackburn's sinker stays up, he gets punished...I can live with giving up any of the Baker, Slowey, Blackburn, Deunsing bunch to get Lee.... I would prefer they hang onto Duensing though.

[mrklean]

we should have resigned redmond he would have been perfect trade bait

[Coach1310]

I say we give the Tribe a call and see what they want for him. A veteran leader in the clubhouse right now to fire the guys up would be nice.... how many games in a row can you be flat as all get out!

[Scott K]

Quote:

Ken Rosenthal of FOXSports.com reports that "two executives from clubs that have called the Mariners about Cliff Lee say the team is indeed willing to trade the pitcher immediately for the right offer."

Mariners general manager Jack Zduriencik said Friday that he's "not willing to throw in the towel just yet," but presumably he's more realistic behind the scenes. One executive said he expects Lee to be traded within the next 7-10 days, with Rosenthal calling the Twins "front-runners" while the Mets, Dodgers and Rangers are among the teams that "have inquired on Lee."

Source: FOXSports

[pinkfloyd4ever]

Go for it twins, just don't mortgage the farm on him. Would love to see the Twins just for once trade for a high value player.