I wonder............

[maros91]

Quote:

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These numbers are with A-Rod and his 8 years as a SS and Jeter with his 10 years at SS:

Total errors at SS

Rodriguez: 131

Jeter: 173

Field Pct

A-Rod: .977

Jeter: .975

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Numbers don't lie me boy.

[PierBridge]

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Numbers don't lie me boy.

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IF 'IFS, ANDS OR BUTS' WERE CANDY AND NUTS.

Shoulda woulda coulda....

Actually the numbers do lie if you factor in A-Rod's career at shorstop back when he was a very good shortstop and 40lbs lighter he played on artificial turf and indoors versus Jeter who plays outdoors on a real field.....NEWS FLASH...big difference!

Is there anything else I can clear up for you guys.

[Willy]

Sorry Pier. You are wrong about part of this one.

Most any manager or team or anyone with much of a brain would take A-rod over Jeter. Jeter is good, there is no doubt and yes he may be on the all-time list as far as shortstops go, but his numbers aren't near as good as A-rod in almost any category.

Why are you talking should, woulda, coulda? These other guys are giving stats and you are giving intagibles and excuses.

P.S. I do not care for either Jeter or A-rod and I do not think Jeter deserved the MVP over Morneau last year either.

[jigging-matt]

Pier, How do you figure that Ozzie couldn't carry Jeter's Jock? 13 gold gloves and a stellar fielding percentage. As I stated in past post Jeter does have some intangibles, such as leadership, But Ozzie was also that type of leader in his day. Morneau deserved MVP last year, and Jeter is a great player, but not the greatest shortstop who ever played.

[PierBridge]

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Pier, How do you figure that Ozzie couldn't carry Jeter's Jock?

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I already said Ozzie WAS a better feilder....UMMM I'm pretty sure there is more to baseball then fielding "back flips don't count" like maybe hitting!!!!!!!!!!!!! I haven't checked the STATS but I would venture to say Jeters worst year would be better then Ozzies best year offensively......

[PierBridge]

What freaking stat are you talking about that stupid all time fielding stat? What part of playing indoors on astro turf versus outdoors on dirt did not understand.

Willy are saying that A-Roid is a better SS then Jeter right now like the poster above has said

And no A-Roid would not favored by more teams then Jeter even if A-Roid wasn't the biggest underachiever in postseason major sports history..... .071 and .133 his last two playoffs...not as bad a .000 when he was with Seatle....but pathetic none the less...

[PierBridge]

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AROD CAREER FIELDING % .977

JETER CAREER FIELDING % .975

WHOS LAST???????????????????????????????

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You might want to check your stats those are outdated.

When you make 24 errors at 3rd base "ALL TIME RECORD" things change fast.

ROTFLMAO... who's last....

[zamboni]

ACTUALLY PIERBIDGE- playing SS or 3rd or any infield position is tougher both on your body (turf toe, diving onto a cement floor) and the speed of the ball on the artificial turf make playing any infield position tougher than playing on grass which slows the ball down. And another thing- AROD is 10X more versatile, thats why he was asked to move to third and not Jeter, I really don't think AROD is all too fat and slow, either.

[zamboni]

I see your last posting, too- ALL TIME SS RECORDS have no account for 3rd base stats.

[PierBridge]

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artificial turf make playing any infield position tougher

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No chance whatsoever...

[zamboni]

You are wrong wrong wrong. Artificial turf makes the ball 10Xs faster.

[kaz2611]

but with artificial turf you get a true hop. A-rod is very good player maybe hasnt posted career stats like jeter but I think he is just as good however jeter has that leadership capability which is something in itself let alone THE YANKEE organization. Ozzie smith along with vizquel were better fielding shortstops and they posted respectable career numbers. Ozzie also had the same leadership skills as jeter. The MVP award shouldnt be handed out to the best player in the league just based on stats but also to the player who contributed the most for his team. Does the team need to be in the playoffs or the world series champs NO . For example at this point in the season IMO A-rod should be A.L. MVP where would the crank yankers be with out him at this point in the season. Last season some feel jeter shouldve won it I feel many felt this way just because hes a yankee and has won it before. But all in all you take jeter away from the yankees last year and morneau away from the twins which team wouldve had the better record? THE YANKEES MORE THAN LIKELY therefore morneau is MORE OF A VAUABLE PLAYER to the twins then jeter is to the yankees.

[zamboni]

Yeah you usually get a "true" hop, but they are hops that seem to bounce 15 feet high. Artificial turf does nothing to extend a players career either. I would take AROD on my team anyday and I bet a survey of knowledgable baseball people would agree overwhelmingly. AROD has it all, glove, arm and one heckuva bat.

[PierBridge]

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But all in all you take jeter away from the yankees last year and morneau away from the twins which team wouldve had the better record? THE YANKEES MORE THAN LIKELY therefore morneau is MORE OF A VAUABLE PLAYER to the twins then jeter is to the yankees.

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I think we can agree on that its just some of the other stuff in thread I disagree with....

[PierBridge]

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You are wrong wrong wrong. Artificial turf makes the ball 10Xs faster.

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Of course its faster but your Fielding percentage is going to much more difficult to maintain on dirt/grass.

[maros91]

A-Rod is better in every way except leadership. I have proven through numbers that this is true. In three years in Texas on natural grass A-Rod had a total of 36 errors at SS. The best three years for Jeter also equals 36. I take A-Rod any day and twice on Sunday. As much as I like throwing around numbers I am going to let this point rest.

[zamboni]

PIER-How the heck do you figure that? Your reaction time and chances of blowing plays increases with the speed of the ball. This is just blowing my mind. Would you have a better chance at cleanly fielding a 60 MPH grounder or a 100 MPH grounder?

[PierBridge]

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A-Rod is better in every way . I have proven through numbers that this is true.

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Oh really lets concede the ridicuolus fact that A-Rod is a better shortstop then Jeter right now.

So you have proven through numbers that A-Rod is better bunter, baserunner, average-hitter, oposit feild hitter, on-base percentage, strikes out less and of course clutch hitter.

Can't wait for you to crunch on those numbers....

Quote:

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I take A-Rod any day and twice on Sunday

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Hope its not a Sunday Playoff or World Series game...LOL

I'll take Clutch over choke any day.

[PierBridge]

Quote:

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This is just blowing my mind.

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I wouldn't worry if you really believe Fielding on Artificial turf is more difficult then dirt/grass fields your mind is already blown....seriously.

Can someone please try to explain this very easy concept to him.

[nofishfisherman]

Have any of you actually played on both artifical turf and on grass?

If not then maybe we should ask someone who has. Deciding which is tougher is a judgement call that can't be answered by a bunch of guys who have never fielded balls on both surfaces.

[fishyguy]

I have played on both. I have played on turf about 10-12 times and mostly in the HHH. Although it is true that you don't really get the bad hops you can get on grass, but the ball does get on top of you much quicker and can still act a little funny if you get a ball with alot of spin.

All that said, I would say there is a fielding edge to the guy on turf but it is not as much as most people believe.

[Willy]

I am looking at SLG, OBP(Virtually the same career numbers), OPS, RBI, HR.

Jeter's good no doubt. But IMO, a shortstop that is a #3,4 type hitter such as A-rod is more valuable than one such as Jeter that is a table setter.

Ah really, who cares, they are both Yankee money grubbing (Contact Us Please) anyway. I hate them both.

[PierBridge]

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Have any of you actually played on both artifical turf and on grass?

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It doesn't matter if we played on either surface its common sense if you don't understand its easier to field on a turf feild day in and day out there is nothing I can you do for you guys.

Plain and simple you are going to have more bad hops on a natural surface.

[bottomfeeder]

I'd take Greg Gagne over any of 'em

[zamboni]

Pier you saying my mind is blown is the dumbest of all the (Contact Us Please) you have said on here. I have played on both, and would rather have a slow grounder than a speedier one anyday.