'97 Johnson 115hp New Rings

[WalleyeWarrior]

I've always found this forum and it's members very helpful, so I figured I'd throw this topic out there. I have the above motor and it needs new rings. Getting a new motor is not on the table and I find dealers to be extremely pricy especially when I bought the boat from an individual and not a dealer. I am hoping that somebody on the forum either does this type of work or knows somebody that does a good job and is reasonably priced. I am in Hibbing and would be willing to trailer my boat to anyone within a reasonable distance. Any input would be greatly appreciated. If you want, please email me at [email protected]. Thanks in advance.

[Valv]

Usually if it needs new rings you will have to hone cylinders also, and you will need oversized rings. Installing them is not an easy jub as with snowmobile or bikes, you will have to pull the motor apart completely, it's a time consuming job.

I know somebody around this area but I am 30 miles south of the cities.

How did you find out you need rings ?

[WalleyeWarrior]

The motor has always been cold-blooded, but it was getting even worse. I decided to have it checked out. The mechanic tested it and said that the compression readings were out of wack. He pretty much said that it was a bigger job than he wanted to undertake. He said that it needed new rings and that it was a big job. I'll be the first to admit that I don't know s... about motors, but I trust this guy because he works for one of my buddies in the wintertime. I wouldn't be against delivering the boat to a place that far away as long as I knew a good job was going to be done and that I was getting a fair deal. Thanks for the posting.

[Valv]

Well the problem is you don't know if it's just rings.

95% of the time will involve rebuilding also cylinders and pistons. The bottom line is you don't know what's going on until you disassemble. Outboards don't have "jugs" or cylinders you can separate from block, they are one assembly, you have to split crankcase and remove crankshaft+rods+pistons together.

The place I mentioned is a tech from a large statewide dealer that does this on the side, it will be definitely cheaper than dealer but still expensive to do, I would ballpark several hundreds.

You have a tough decision to make, many of us were in your shoes too at some point and we all took different decisions.

[sparcebag]

Have you done a compression test? its easy I'm sure someone you know could pull a plug and put a compression guage in plug hole,then the others? then low comp. could be a valve? Was the person who told you it was bad,a outboard mechanic? or a back yard guy? a dealer for a test might be your best bet.also if your timing is off it could show poor comp.? Go to a dealer for a test!

[Macgyver55]

Quote:

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The motor has always been cold-blooded, but it was getting even worse

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Does it run ok once it is running? Generally cold blooded is not a symptom of low compression....hard starting when warm and low power are more classic. Cold starting problems are more often related to carburetion issues. I'd do another compression test done to verify that that is indeed the problem. Otherwise like Valv said it will more than likely need more than just rings.

Also, I think that vintage motor is included in the years that had a problem with the oil pumps. I know mine did (93 40 hp) and I paid the price by having to put in pistons and rings and hone the cylinders. Luckily since I'm a mechanic I was able to do it myself for just over 375 dollars. That doesn't include the pump though, they are over 200 bucks so I just went back to premix since its a lightly used motor.

[ChuckN]

I wouldn't settle for an answer like that, an overhaul is a big, expensive job. It's like a Dr. saying you have 3 months to live unless.... I would seek a second opinion from a trained OMC mechanic. That '97 115 is a strong, reliable motor. I had a '99 and it was cold blooded at times too.

I should mention that I went to synthetic oil (Amsoil) and my 115 performed MUCH better in all aspects. Less smoke, and didn't "load up" at all.

[marine_man]

Quote:

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That '97 115 is a strong, reliable motor.

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I agree with Chuck.. the 115 OMC products are pretty much bullet proof.. and unless you ran it without water or oil for a while I'm kind of suprised to hear you're having problems with it. When you say cold blooded what do you mean? Can you elaborate a little more?

I'd also get a second opinion... unless you're 100% confident in who you took it too, and I'd still think about a second opinion.

marine_man

[WalleyeWarrior]

Thanks for all the input guys. I definitely am going to get a second opinion. One thing that I should point out is that I have mixed fuel and do not have an oil pump. Secondly, I, too, switched to the Amsoil product early last year. Finally, by cold-blooded, I meant that it is extremely hard starting the first time I attempt to start it up. After running it for awhile, the subsequent starts are better, but it certainly doesn't start on the first turn of the key either. Thanks again for all the input. This is why I think these forums are so great.

[marine_man]

How long have you had this motor?

One other question is what your cold starting sequence?

Are you pushing the key in and holding it while you crank when it's cold, or are you pumping the key in and out while cranking?

Johnsons / Evinrudes from this era and earlier (and I believe up until fuel injection) have a primer system on their motors and not a choke (closing the butterfly). One pump = one squirt of gas in the carb, and that's it.

Now, if you've got low compression all the pumping in the world isn't going to make much of a difference, but it's something to consider.

marine_man

[WalleyeWarrior]

Well, I finally had the motor looked at again. Needless to say, the news ruined my weekend. Here were the compression numbers: 60, 100, 100, 110. When the mechanic took it apart, he found that it threw a ring. Now I guess I'm looking at either getting a reman powerhead and putting it on a 10 year old motor or getting a new (used) motor. The model of this motor is J115TSLECM. Am I SOL? Any ideas would again be greatly appreciated. If anyone has a 90-115hp motor, I'd be interested in discussing. Thanks, as always.

[Valv]

This time of the year is bad to find deals. You can try hsolist if you can find some powerhead guaranteed in good conditions, or you can have yours rebuilt (10 years is not that bad) if price is below $ 1500.

Otherwise can get a warranty used or, bite the bullet and get repowered with a new one.

What are you going to do with your bad motor ?

[Ryoushi]

I understand this isn't the case, but for what it costs a dealership to fix something like that(not very much), they should give you a nice deal on a trade.

[Valv]

Why shuld they give you a deal on a trade ? Motor is 10 years old, not bought there, and there is no warranty. To rebuild this it will cost approx $ 750.00 at dealer plus his own labor, not a good deal for them neither, I believe they will scrap the motor.

[WalleyeWarrior]

I'm probably leaning towards getting either a used or a new motor that somebody has been sitting on for a couple years or so if I can find one. A 2007 is probably going to be out of my price range. I'm not sure what I'm going to do with my current one. It'll all depend on what I find out there. If anybody knows of any dealers or private individuals that have a 90-115 motor. I'd probably be interested. I'm in Hibbing, but would be willing to drive if the offer was worth it.

[Surface Tension]

Time isn't on your side here.

Its one of those deals where, "while you have it apart you should replace this and that". Theres a reason way it went bad and that will have to be addressed as well. I would guess it was running lean from a dirty carb. That would explain your hard starting when cold. That hard start is a symptom that shouldn't be ignored. I won't go into proper winterizing and fuel treatments but for those that say they don't bother with any of that, heres a classic case of what happens. A little bit of preventative maintenance saves you big time down the road.

I think your looking at closer to $1000. Go ahead and look at what a replacement will cost, then reconsider having yours rebuilt.

I'll send you a name and number of a guy in the Cotton area.