DIDN'T EVEN SEE A DEER(4 DAYS)

[Shad rap]

shoot2kill I agree with you. I moved up here from Iowa 7 years ago. I quit hunting in MN and started hunting ND where you can at least see deer every night out and have a chance at killing a nice buck every year. I would rather drive 4 hours to ND to see deer then to spend all my time in MN and be happy to see 20 deer a year. I wish I could talk my wife into moving back to Iowa.

[bigbucks]

It's all relative to your experiences I guess. When I started deer hunting 25 years ago & over the next several seasons, there were many years where not everyone in our gun party even saw a deer over the two day hunt. Even more years there were several guys that never had a shot for the two days at any deer, fawns, whatever. We'd get 2-4 deer by shooting at brown for 8 guys & feel okay with that & those were typical numbers for parties in our area. I can only remember one year we didn't get any, we had zero doe tags & saw exactly one for sure deer.

I can remember when I'd been bowhunting maybe 3-4 years being ecstatic that I was starting to see deer on most of my outings as opposed to one out of every three or four.

In some respects I think it would be great to have the number of deer that some of these other states do, but then again, they're being scraped off the road all the time as it is.

[Shoot2Kill]

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shoot2kill I agree with you. I moved up here from Iowa 7 years ago. I quit hunting in MN and started hunting ND where you can at least see deer every night out and have a chance at killing a nice buck every year. I would rather drive 4 hours to ND to see deer then to spend all my time in MN and be happy to see 20 deer a year. I wish I could talk my wife into moving back to Iowa.

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Shad Rap - where in IA were you from? I have thought the EXACT same thing as you...not wasting my time here next year. I'm putting in for an IA tag and if I don't get drawn I'm going to ND to hunt with a buddy that has access to endless amounts of timber about 45 min SW of Fargo and has seen tons of deer all year including some really nice shooter bucks. I drove around with him at dusk in September and I stopped counting at 100 in a little over an hour. It was crazy how many there were in his area.

Where in MN are you? I'm just south of St. Cloud. Maybe we could team up and bash MN deer hunting practices over a few golden sodas? Shoot me an email if you're interested. [email protected]

[Shoot2Kill]

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It's all relative to your experiences I guess. When I started deer hunting 25 years ago & over the next several seasons, there were many years where not everyone in our gun party even saw a deer over the two day hunt. Even more years there were several guys that never had a shot for the two days at any deer, fawns, whatever. We'd get 2-4 deer by shooting at brown for 8 guys & feel okay with that & those were typical numbers for parties in our area. I can only remember one year we didn't get any, we had zero doe tags & saw exactly one for sure deer.

I can remember when I'd been bowhunting maybe 3-4 years being ecstatic that I was starting to see deer on most of my outings as opposed to one out of every three or four.

In some respects I think it would be great to have the number of deer that some of these other states do, but then again, they're being scraped off the road all the time as it is.

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I'm glad it's "getting better" compared to years ago, but I don't know if I have the patience to wait for it to get to the point of being able to pass up 150 - 160 inch bucks like my buddies are in Iowa waiting for a bigger one.

[Jeremy Donabauer]

Hey Shoot2kill-

I grew up in STC and live and work south of STC as well. Can I join in the MN bashing?

[Shoot2Kill]

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Hey Shoot2kill-

I grew up in STC and live and work south of STC as well. Can I join in the MN bashing?

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Heck yeah man...the more the marrier! Where do live and work at? I live on County Road 7 about 4 miles south of St. Augusta and work in Dassel. It would be great to get together seeing how my wife and I really don't know too many people here yet. Send me an email to my address in the previous post. Looking forward to it man! Anybody else want to join in? I got a big heated garage with a fridge full of golden sodas...I'm sure after a few hours of tippin em back we could solve all the MN deer hunting problems.

[chucker34]

Is everywhere in Iowa a deer hunter's Mecca? I doubt it and know because I used to live there myself. In terms of numbers, Minnesota is doing very well in its deer population. The DNR estimates that this will likely be the 2nd highest harvest ever. Not every microcosm of the state produces a bounty of deer every year. Some years there are more and others less. It's matter of finding the right place. I'm actually kind of excited for next year already because a lot of does made it through and we are having a mild winter. Should be a nice population boom next spring.

[Shoot2Kill]

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Is everywhere in Iowa a deer hunter's Mecca? I doubt it and know because I used to live there myself. In terms of numbers, Minnesota is doing very well in its deer population. The DNR estimates that this will likely be the 2nd highest harvest ever. Not every microcosm of the state produces a bounty of deer every year. Some years there are more and others less. It's matter of finding the right place. I'm actually kind of excited for next year already because a lot of does made it through and we are having a mild winter. Should be a nice population boom next spring.

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Chucker - completely agree with you...not everywhere in MN is going to have good numbers. My main argument is the dates of the gun season and I really believe that the gun season really has a lot to do with the numbers of bucks that are seen as well as the size of bucks you seen here in MN. When my buddies in Iowa are consitently passing up 150-160 inch bucks every season because they are too small it just shows that something down there is working. What is that something? IMO it is because there is NO guns at all during the rut down there. The big bucks get a chance to breed the does and the genetics continue. Here, with the mentality of 90% of the state if it's brown it's down during gun season I really believe that a lot of the bucks that are shot would not have been shot if they weren't in rut and running around trying to get some hot doe action. Thus...more big bucks are killed during gun season because of the rut and the bucks that are left get to breed the does, thus passing on inferior jeans. Witnessing an all out full blown rut is awesome. It's insane what bucks will do that time of year. I just haven't seen anything like it up here in MN. I don't know if it's right...it's just what I tell myself all the time while I'm bowhunting and counting the number of squirrels I see vs the # of deer.

Is everywhere in IA a deer hunting mecca? No, but the area I hunted was and I guess it spoiled me. Tell me why Iowa deer hunters can take 2 bucks every year - or legally 3 if they are landowners when MN has a much larger overall population (granted - MN is a bigger state)? Something is being done right down there....no guns in the rut. I know - preaching to the choir.

Just a bowhunters opinions...not trying to ruffle any feathers. I'd love to hear more opinions, hell, I'd love to really give MN a chance since I do live here for the time being, but I need something to steer me away from my current train of thought!

[Jeremy Donabauer]

Shoot2kill-

You've got mail.

Chucker I also know that there are good deer numbers in parts of the state...but where I live the numbers are way down and have been that way since the late 90's. Something has to be changed in order to restore order.

[Shoot2Kill]

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Shoot2kill-

You've got mail.

Chucker I also know that there are good deer numbers in parts of the state...but where I live the numbers are way down and have been that way since the late 90's. Something has to be changed in order to restore order.

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Dunns, I can't open my hotmail at work, so I'll respond to you tonight from home. Looking forward to meeting up with you.

[summit090706]

Not sure how to state this. But I don't think that it should be the states job to produce bigger bucks for people that trophy hunt. From reading these posts this year there are alot of meat hunters out there. From one side I see us looking only at the antlers and not at the fun we had with family and friends. I continue to read that MN needs bigger bucks, better QDM, but why? Don't get me wrong I would love to shoot a big buck, but shooting a doe or a small but is just as exciting. I think we need to let the DNR do what they can to keep the deer herd up and if we get bigger bucks great. The more we push for some sort of controlled hunting are we pushing the younger hunter out of hunting since they don't get the rush of their first deer? Just my 2 cents. Thanks everyone for great posts this year I have learned a lot....

[chucker34]

I would agree that its not the state's job to produce trophy bucks for us. It's their job to keep a healthy overall herd that presents us with a yearly opportunity to hunt deer period. And I do believe the DNR is trying their hardest to manage deer populations by area. But perhaps canceling the season in certain areas altogether for a year or two is necessary if the numbers are that drastically low.

As for holding the gun season out of the rut, in theory, that may allow bigger bucks to pass on "better" genes, but I'd like to see some statistics that prove that. Not anecdotes such as my friend passes up huge bucks before finally taking one or even bag limits, but statistics that illustrate how holding a gun season outside of the rut can help bucks grow older before they are taken. And even then, if less deer are taken overall every year because of this change, will that benefit the majority of hunter - the half a million hunters who just want to get out and take a deer with their friends and family, or the trophy hunters? What will that do to the majority of hunters' interest in the sport, their passion to get their children involved, the $$$ generated by hunting and funding for the DNR?

Finally, why are all these states out West doing away with antler restrictions? And talk to hunters in Pennsylvania about what state imposed quality deer management has done for them. I've read magazine article after magazine where frustrated hunters say whereas they used to see 20 deer a day, they now see 2, if they're lucky. Sure, those two might be big bucks. You just have to make all of the normal investments of time and resources you have in the past but pray to God one of them walks by your stand before the next guy gets it and your season for all intensive purposes is over.

A deer every year (hopefully) or a trophy buck every 5 or 10 years? I'll take the first and so will most hunters the DNR has surveyed so far. I'm all for QDM that tries to produce some big bucks, when its done privately and not imposed on others who enjoy getting A deer.

[Black_Bay]

Has anyone actually found out why the season in Iowa is in December? I bet it has more to do with holding the gun season after the farmers are usually out of the fields, rather than any noble attempt at deer management. They also have half the number of hunters that Minnesota has. That fact alone has a huge impact on the deer population.

If Minnesota decided to change the season to December after the rut, hunting the in northern areas of the state would be all or nothing in my opinion. It would be a slaughter for guys hunting near/in yarding areas. Guys away from these areas would be lucky to see a track. Not a good option.

I'm not saying Minnesota couldn't do a better job at deer management, but just changing the dates isn't the answer. I believe the brown is down crowd is the problem. Actually the take any buck crowd is the bigger problem. The guys that think they need to shoot a buck to prove their manhood are doing more harm to the population. It's a fact that most of the bucks taken are 1.5 years old. In my opinion there's no reason to shoot a small buck if you have a license that allows you to take an antlerless deer. There is no human alive that can tell the difference between a doe steak and a buck steak in the frying pan assuming both were well taken care. All this talk of inferior genetics is a load of bull too. Just because a forkhorn breeds a doe that doesn't mean she'll have offspring that will only ever be forkhorns. Deer don't get stunted like panfish. Genetics do play a role but quality forage, easy winters, and the time to grow big are usually the limiting factors in getting big bucks in the population.

[Shoot2Kill]

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Not sure how to state this. But I don't think that it should be the states job to produce bigger bucks for people that trophy hunt. From reading these posts this year there are alot of meat hunters out there. From one side I see us looking only at the antlers and not at the fun we had with family and friends. I continue to read that MN needs bigger bucks, better QDM, but why? Don't get me wrong I would love to shoot a big buck, but shooting a doe or a small but is just as exciting. I think we need to let the DNR do what they can to keep the deer herd up and if we get bigger bucks great. The more we push for some sort of controlled hunting are we pushing the younger hunter out of hunting since they don't get the rush of their first deer? Just my 2 cents. Thanks everyone for great posts this year I have learned a lot....

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Your first line is one that I've heard many times in MN - basically who cares if there are big bucks as long as there is something to shoot at - I can guarantee you that if you had ever been in the presence of 4 or 5 shooter bucks around your stand at one time, you would word that statement differently. I just have a different mentality because of seeing the caliber of deer on a regular basis before moving to MN.

I partially agree with you Summit - I don't want to see the younger hunters driven out either. As far as the state producing bigger bucks, I don't know if it's anyone's job...the hunters in IA have produced the bigger bucks for themesleves by passing on the little ones over the past 10 years as well as the help from the state because like it or not, NR hunting brings in HUGE dollars for the state. I bet MN would like the revenue generated by NR hunters that would come here to shoot big bucks though wouldn't they????

Am I a trophy hunter - yes. I'm not in it because I'm going to starve if I don't have deer meat for the year. I absolutely love the feeling you get when a true monster is in your presence. I love big antlers, I love big mounts, I love pictures of big bucks - that's just me and it's been programmed into my head since the first deer I shot when I was 16 scored 165. Do I like the meat, hell yeah I love it, but if I don't have deer meat in my freezer because I passed on a small buck then to me I feel better about it because just maybe that buck will grow into something that someone will be truly proud of someday and it's rack won't just end up in the corner of the garage.

To each his own - my own is big racks.

[Shoot2Kill]

Chucker and Black Bay - I see we disagree on some things, and we agree on others....you guys bring up valid points, some of which really make sense like the yarding up north..you're right about that...it would get ugly.

The any buck it's down, brown it's down, etc is a completely different train of thought that I agree could just use a little re-shaping. For the first timers or the young hunters fine, shoot away so they get hooked like the rest of us, but I do agree that a lot of people just want to be able to say "I GOT MY BUCK" this year and are ashamed to say are eating tag soup or shot a measly doe.

I'm tellin ya that if more hunters had close encounters with big bucks it would be easier to change peoples minds about shooting little bucks.

It's been a good discussion but I really have to get some work done today!! I hope nobody is rialed up...my opinions are just that, opinions and no hard facts...you guys are all invited to my garage for the verbal fixing of the MN deer problems through a few golden sodas.

[Black_Bay]

Shoot~ The only thing I think we differ on is the season dates. I've gone from the brown is down when I was younger, to hunting big bucks. In the area I hunt we can take either sex so if it's late in the season I have no problem taking a doe, especially since the buck to doe ratio has been so lopsided. This year we saw a lot of smaller bucks, all were passed up, so next year and the following years should prove to be interesting.

I like to think some of the reason I shot the buck I did this year is due to our group passing on the little guys. That reminds me I need to take the time to post a few pics.

[Shoot2Kill]

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Shoot~ The only thing I think we differ on is the season dates. I've gone from the brown is down when I was younger, to hunting big bucks. In the area I hunt we can take either sex so if it's late in the season I have no problem taking a doe, especially since the buck to doe ratio has been so lopsided. This year we saw a lot of smaller bucks, all were passed up, so next year and the following years should prove to be interesting.

I like to think some of the reason I shot the buck I did this year is due to our group passing on the little guys. That reminds me I need to take the time to post a few pics.

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Okay, so I've just accepted the fact that I'm not going to get squat done today. Your season date thoughts are valid as well - I've even thought about it like well who would really even want to be sitting in a treestand during December in northern MN, and then they would be overpopulated because very few were harvested and thus end up starving and getting eaten by wolves. I'm all out of ideas other than trying to get the deer to rut in October.

Congrats on passing up the smaller ones...good things come to those who wait. I'd like to see your buck pics.

[HC Eye Hunter]

One of the reasons MN avoids a late deer gun season is due to the additional stress on the wintering deer herd.

The states south of us don't normally have the winters that MN is supposed to have.

[decoy]

I had a great deer season. Got an early doe. That was fun to rifle hunt in warm weather, saw many deer. Then during rifle season, I got a nice 8 pointer about 3 minutes into season at 30 yards. Luck...

I proceeded to sit, and watched many deer for another hour before getting down to clean him.

A few days later, I climbed back into the same stand, sat for 45 minutes and a doe walked out at 30 yards. I got her too. She had another 8 pointer that walked out with her. He watched her go down and stood by sniffing her for awhile. I was going to get my partner for help with the doe, but he had 9 does right out in front of his stand and he was just enjoying the view...

I guess I'm trying to say that I love hunting in MN. We always see deer and can be picky. It seems like the deer hunting is getting better every year IMO.

Sorry you guys had difficulty. Perhaps more densly populated areas (closer to the cities) need more DNR control, or tighter regulations?

You won't catch me complaining about the DNR.

[Shad rap]

From the sounds of it The guys that are hunting up in the rilfe zone are the ones that are saying they are having great deer hunting. How about south of interstate 94? I think this is where the complants are coming from. Why dont they split the state. everything from interstate 94 and up let the gun hunters hunt during rut and south of interstate 94 hold the gun season off until Dec. I know I have not seen the deer herds in the winter like you see in Iowa or ND. In the area the deer numbers are down make the hunters draw for a tag and not give every hunter a tag. until the numbers come up. make the zones smaller so it would be easer to manage the deer herd. Just a idea

[Shoot2Kill]

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From the sounds of it The guys that are hunting up in the rilfe zone are the ones that are saying they are having great deer hunting. How about south of interstate 94? I think this is where the complants are coming from. Why dont they split the state. everything from interstate 94 and up let the gun hunters hunt during rut and south of interstate 94 hold the gun season off until Dec. I know I have not seen the deer herds in the winter like you see in Iowa or ND. In the area the deer numbers are down make the hunters draw for a tag and not give every hunter a tag. until the numbers come up. make the zones smaller so it would be easer to manage the deer herd. Just a idea

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I noticed that trend in this thread as well as many others and from what I have heard from the majority of the hunters that I know that head north. The farmland zones seem to be producing much different (lower) numbers in the past few years. Again - just another undocumented observation.

Shad Rap - you have an email.

[Gofishleech]

Well here in zone 245, the deer siteings are way down. I hunt and live near the paulbunyan forest and this is the worst year that many of the hunters have seen. The acorns where hard to find along with the deer. Some areas around the state forest had good deer numbers but over all the numbers have to be down.

As for when they should have rifle season, I see it every year - the friday before season bucks start chasing and it seems to last into mid-week of season. During the chase is when bucks are lead by does out into the open, especially the first part of the week. In my opinion if they just moved it to the middle of the month would make a big difference. And party hunting is allot of the problem. Guys can shot the first buck that runs in with a doe, then you know whats next.......the little bucks come in and get shot. You hear it all the time.....so-n-so shot 3 or 4 bucks. But even if it was not legal to party hunt it would still happen too much.

(These are just MY opinions)

[chris63]

Wow you guys really reponded!I hunted in 156 Aitkin co for opener Rifle zone and really didnt see anything while on stand.First year for 15to18 years.I hope it was just this year and not things to come.Ive been bow hunting since gun and i did see two does this past weekend!Still fun (deer sightings or no!)c63Again thankyou for AALL your replies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I love this site!c63

[Black_Bay]

I firmly believe that the warm weather and full moon had a negative effect on the season this year. Give me cold, snow, and a new moon during season and I'm a happy guy.

[Shoot2Kill]

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I firmly believe that the warm weather and full moon had a negative effect on the season this year. Give me cold, snow, and a new moon during season and I'm a happy guy.

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BB - the warm weather is definetely a huge factor and I'm hearing about it's affects all over the midwest this season. WHERE IS THE COLD!