A Lucky Mudeye At Belle Plaine

[MachineHead]

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While I think the rules/regs could be tweaked a bit, one thing that could be done immediately is exactly what you did Dark. Go to these tourneys and monitor them. If nobody is taking care of these fish, step in and help out.

If a group was formed, that group could monitor these tournies, make recommendations, donate time or supplies needed to protect the fish. There are simple things that could be done right now.

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Keen observation, dtro. That would be perhaps a serious step in the right direction.

[Larry FlatCaster]

I like your thought process Dtro.

I think that you mentioned in one our conversations during the contest on how they handle Musky tourneys. The fishermen call in and Judges/Assistants go out measure, weigh, photo and release the fish asap. I would be willing to voluteer to do something like that. Not the easiest way of doing, and you would need a fair number of volunteers, but..... a means of getting the fish released back in the water in a fairly timely manner.

(Correct me if I'm wrong.)

thanks

Larry

[Blue Kayak]

Dark's videos really tell a story. Anyone viewing the video can understand that tank is too small. The fish gasping at the surface show oxygen stress. It seems like the contests could charge a little more and purchase larger tanks. The bait stores have oxygen tanks for the sucker minnows; maybe bottled oxygen would also help in the tourneys.

[Big Dave2]

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Otherwise it looks like you are just concerned about

your

favorite speciese in

your

favorite body of water.

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Not quite sure what’s so wrong about that?

Most every other game fish in the state has some sort of club or group associated with it but not flatheads.

These debates are great! They are the sparks that can ignite some action!

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The only thing I was trying to point out is that all of those other organizations like pheasants forever and ducks unlimited, try to deal with issues involving that animal on a state wide basis. You guys are talking about an organization that would deal with one species in one body of water.

Don't get me wrong, maybe if someone actually organizes this thing you might get enough members to actually make a difference, but doubtfull. There is a lot more to managing a species than lobbying for new laws, but its a start.

Don't forget, laws have to be made by lawmakers in st.paul. I doubt that too many of them go cattin'.

[Big Dave2]

Please don't take my posts the wrong way. I am not trying to be an a-hole here, but I am sure that all of you who have a problem with how the contest is run would be more than welcome to volunteer to help out next year. That way your opinions could be expressed to the people who need to hear them.

[Papa Grump]

To add to Dave's post, Jim Hooper has been asked to help out next year.Jim is an avid cat guy from Jordan and also fishes in the BP Cat league. Of course Jim asked me to assist him which I will gladly do. HOPEFULLY the bridge will be done in Belle Plaine next year, and we will have the weigh in and release at the landing itself, like it used to be many years ago. The beer , beans and rumbling can still be at the park itself.

Brian

[Gordie]

Last year I was at Frankin derby and ask the dnr if it was possible for them to do the same thing they do in franklin for the belle plain contest and the response I got was that all belle plain has to do is ask for are help with the fish .

[hanson]

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To add to Dave's post, Jim Hooper has been asked to help out next year.Jim is an avid cat guy from Jordan and also fishes in the BP Cat league. Of course Jim asked me to assist him which I will gladly do.

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Rock On! I can't think of two better guys for the job!

[Big Dave2]

I've never been to the franklin derby. Just curious, what does the DNR do for them?

[Gordie]

the dnr has a great big tank 750-1000gal ajitators they also measure weigh and in the past have tagged some of these monsters to do research on. by tracking the fish to see there movements and mortality rate after catch and release has occured. We talked with one officer and he said that most of those big fish dont travel very far after being released, maybe a mile and they will try to dominate a new area. its dnr biolagy members that do most of the work . they handle the fish with great care and respect.

[Big Dave2]

That sounds like it would be great to get the DNR involved in the BP contest. I bet the current organizers don't even know this is available.

[Gordie]

yes I belive they do .I have a friend in Jordan that fished Franklin with me last year and he said that he brought up to someones attention not sure who . he also informed the guy that used to own 169 sports store so he could pass it on and this was before last years belle plaine contest and it didnt seem to matter. so my friend now calls that contest HOOKS AND CROOKS .

[169Sportsman]

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yes I belive they do .I have a friend in Jordan that fished Franklin with me last year and he said that he brought up to someones attention not sure who . he also informed the guy that used to own 169 sports store so he could pass it on and this was before last years belle plaine contest and it didnt seem to matter. so my friend now calls that contest HOOKS AND CROOKS .

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I have given them more suggestions than I care to count. I have even tried to help in the past. All this just led to frustration for me so I finally just gave up. They are just so content on running it the way they always have it's ridiculous. Not to stick up for them but I dont understand why people even leave there fish at the park.

[Gordie]

I guess the fish just doesnt matter to them, just $$$$ I've decided not to particapate in that contest anymore unlees their is someome that accually cares about the fishes well being.

[MuskieMojoTackle]

Sounds like a bunch of muskie fishermen in here...

I agree with what you guys are talking about here. I have never caught a truly big cat, but I have enjoyed fishing for them in the past and have caught my fair share of decent ones.

In my opinion, any fish should be taken care of and released back in the water unless it is to be legally harvested. That big flat dying in the holding tank during that tournament is disgusting. That great fish died for no reason.

Does anyone have any info on delayed mortality in catfish? I know they are a tough fish, but they still need to be taken care of if they are expected to survive after release (that big girl in the tank is a prime example of that).

There has been much research done on vertical holds and the effect (not a positive one) they have on large fish. A vertical hold still seems to be a common one amongst cat fishermen. Weighing every fish also seems to be common practice. I dont think this would be very good for them either?

Not trying to ruffle any feathers here, just looking for more info.

The passion that you guys seem to have for these fish is very admirable. I'm a muskie guy...so I know exactly how it feels.

[hanson]

Luke-

A couple good points as usual man.

1) In regards to vertical holds, I'm sure you are right on the money. I know a few guys now that won't take vertical hold pictures of flathead cats for the reasons you mentioned. The only vertical hold shot I've ever taken, also happened to be the biggest cat I ever caught. Doh! There was honestly no other way to hold it at the time. Dang nerves and week knees! LOL!

2) Weighing fish. You are most definitely correct again. It puts the fish in a vertical position, and puts an incredible amount of pressure on the jaw of the fish. Not too mention 1 hard tail slap from a flathead is enough to dislocate your knee (well...maybe not) and drop the fish on the floor of the boat. What I would encourage is to put the fish back in the net, and weigh the net and fish, then subtract the weight of the net. You'll be close enough.

One problem with flathead cats is the length to weight ratio is all over the map. The 44" flathead I caught this summer weighed 48lbs, yet dtro & larry caught a couple in the 43" range this weekend that weighed in the low 30s. If we could figure out a length x girth ratio, I think we'll be ahead of the game but it is going to take some serious data collection to put a formula like that together for flatties.

Until then, C&R all them flatties boys, only keeping them out of the water long enough to do the important stuff, like smiling for the camera.

A trophy flatty is a rare, and old fish in this state. Lets take care of and protect the resource and fishery we have.

For those who are wondering what happened to the group we were planning to form, its still in the works, I've just got a lot of things on my plate right now. I'm really excited though about some of the ideas that have been put forth, and I think this will be a big step for flathead catfish in MN.

[DARK30]

I would rather see someone grasp the lower jaw while also adding some support from underneath with the other hand. I can't see any reason to hold a large Flathead by the gill plates. Weighing them can be done just fine while in the net ( they weigh more that way too) Also, just dropping the fish could do serious harm so hang on.

On another note...I noticed a bit in the Trib on Sunday. Looks like the DNR is proposing a 48" size limit for muskies in lake Miltona, lake Vermillion and includes several lakes in Cass county. This is micro management. I would love to see something similar happen with the Minnesota River Flathead Catfish! Now I got a few questions.....

1. Is there a problem with the Muskie population in these areas? If not, why micro manage them.

2. Did the DNR take this action or did a special interest group "lobby" for it?

3. What about the fish over 48". Don't they think they should be going back also?

I sure hope the Flathead gets its recognition in this state soon.

[MuskieMojoTackle]

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I would rather see someone grasp the lower jaw while also adding some support from underneath with the other hand. I can't see any reason to hold a large Flathead by the gill plates. Weighing them can be done just fine while in the net ( they weigh more that way too) Also, just dropping the fish could do serious harm so hang on.

On another note...I noticed a bit in the Trib on Sunday. Looks like the DNR is proposing a 48" size limit for muskies in lake Miltona, lake Vermillion and includes several lakes in Cass county. This is micro management. I would love to see something similar happen with the Minnesota River Flathead Catfish! Now I got a few questions.....

1. Is there a problem with the Muskie population in these areas? If not, why micro manage them.

2. Did the DNR take this action or did a special interest group "lobby" for it?

3. What about the fish over 48". Don't they think they should be going back also?

I sure hope the Flathead gets its recognition in this state soon.

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Dark -

Here is what I know about the size limit increase for Muskies...

1. There is not a problem with the population in these areas, but the lakes on the list have a great potential for trophy fish so that is where we are starting. The goal is to make it statewide. Baby steps.

2. Muskies Inc is lobbying the DNR for this change. The Twin Cities Chapter is spearheading the movement.

3. They are shooting for 48" because that is the number that has been tossed around for years and makes sense in the DNR's mind. Swinging for the fences right away doesnt really make sense. Yes, the bigger ones deserve to go back too, but the increase from 40 to 48 will save alot of fish from going home with people.

[DARK30]

I guess I was being a little sarcastic about the muskie population in question 1. My point is, there are no problems with the Flathead population in the Minnesota either...there a lots of um and they are there to stay. I just wish (someday) we'll start keeping (all) of them in the river and not on the dinner table in Iowa and Missouri. Or for that matter, not being hauled into a contest by someone looking to make a buc and a yuk.

And again I'll say, Lets put um back (all of um). Take a picture, make a video, weigh it, measure it, kiss it, or lick it...just put um back in. They do eat carp too! All in favor of the Mudeye Management Task Force say "I" ! Does Flatheads Inc sound better?

[DTro]

My vote goes for....

"Friends of the Flatheads"

Too granola cruncher sounding?

How about:

"Flatheads....the other BIG fish"

[rushing]

"Mudeye Management Task Force" Sounds like some sort of group Chuck Norris is the spokes person for!